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[Glave]

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZKMnV_xaUc" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZKMnV_xaUc</a>

[Catoptromancy]

TC involves gear. Not really but it matters. CA and gatling lasers or miniguns and metal armor...TC involves hours/weeks of lockpicking.

Since there was no documentation on how TC actually worked one faction scooped up most of the towns right away. I do not blame the other faction for this, its what factions do. Most other factions assumed they could collect gear for a few days and head over to a town and TC for a few hours, win town and call it a day. This only lead to that one faction accumulating days worth influence. The Den took literally over 24 hours to capture the first time, 5+ hours of AFKing over week.

How does that involve gear, the precious resource that allows TC and helps win the pvp. When a faction could collect 1000+ caps in a single town every 1/2 hour for weeks they can just buy gear and blueprints, even resources. This means the top gear to play with is easily obtainable from anyone willing to sell in a cap strapped society.

Eventually all big factions will also have enough blueprints to start making carpets. No crafting timer equals instant massive carpet, it just takes being able to get the blueprint first. So gear will eventually become easy and then town control will be balanced.

Point of all this, no real documentation of TC let a faction be able to buy all the gear and supplies everyone else needs to work hard to get. So only real problem with TC is lack of proper documentation.

Wiki can be wrong at times, misleading, confusing...but this is something too big to be so vague about.

[Sarakin]

Just a reminder, most of PvP active players agree with Rascal's points, but there (in this thread) is also gang whose players are loudly lobbying for their own view of TC.
Regarding Rascal's points, I dont agree with these:

5. The pace of influence gaining depends from equipment and numbers, tier 3 and level cap needed to be counted.

High-tech stuff shouldnt be mandatory to apply for TC. Even mid-tier should be enough (if you want to see more gangs involved)

6. Loot in lockers is generating for each 30 minutes of holding town. Faction members presence not needed. The longer u have city the better rewards ur getting.

This is totally wrong concept, gaining sth for doing nothing. Solar's concept on rewards fits better.

[Rascal]

This is totally wrong concept, gaining sth for doing nothing. Solar's concept on rewards fits better.

Cant agree, current system creates only unnatural need to left idle chars for night/whole day. It doesnt make any sense. Its only pain in the ass. BTW keeping town isnt "doing nothing" as u wrote. Its constant "be ready to defend" mode and also a lot of battles to defend city from enemy raids.

[Sarakin]

Yes, but imagine scenario, when one gang dominates whole wasteland (SoT, Rogues, happened several times in the past) and they gain profit from 6 towns simultaneously - it gives huge advantage and its quite unfair for other gangs. If they need to stand in the city / do homework / whatever, you cant profit from all towns.

[Rascal]

its quite unfair for other gangs

What is unfair ? If a gang is strong enough to dominate whole wasteland it should gain all wastelands (6 towns) loot. Its logic.

[Sarakin]

If they dominate fair and square, its alright...
I get your idea, you want to gain everything for no effort but thats not how it should be.

[Catoptromancy]

It is fair to control everything, if they can. What isnt fair is for misleading wiki to suggest that other factions can come along and win a TC in a single setting, so factions just let sot hold those towns while they geared up after wipe. In those couple days of gearing up, massive amounts of influence was gained locking other factions into all night AFK sessions to catch up.


TC should never require presence, though it is a noble idea...only facilitates AFKing. TC rewards are different. TC rewards and actually holding the town should be split.


2 things I think should be implemented as soon as possible.

TC = taking town by force, like last season.
TC rewards = using a capped current influence system, 100 max cap.

All those quests and rp stuff suggested is cool, if it only boosts influence and TC rewards. But those can be added later. Fix the main part of TC already, everything else can be added one at a time.

[Reiniat]

To summ it up:
"PvE gangs" (are there really such?) kill ur muties in encounters - stay away from north cities
"RP gangs" - do ur mythical "RP" on south which is dedicated for it and if u try to do such nonesense in some north city dont cry u got raped by evil PvP apes
PvP gags - should have solid working PvP promoting system in north to have FUN in this game - otherwise server number just gona drop.. drop.... and the end is easy to predict.

Yeah sure, the only way to get fun here is TC, dev efforts should be concentred in the perfection of TC. Make half of the map a PVP trench... Why is people so close minded?
PVP players just use the game as a platform to play a isometric strategic shooter.

My opinion to Solar: bring'em back old TC system, make a few fixes here and there to make everything be perfect as Rascal said. And get centered in new caravan system, farming enjoyable countermeasures and PLEASE more encounter based PVP.

[avv]

What is unfair ? If a gang is strong enough to dominate whole wasteland it should gain all wastelands (6 towns) loot. Its logic.

Then dominate it too. If you aren't in town upholding your rules and showing your presence, you don't deserve anything. You deserve rewards from risks. If you risk your gear for 15 mins, you deserve rewards from that 15 mins not more.
Getting rewards when you're not present encourages off-timezone captures which annoy everyone.

[John Porno]

the way rascal worded it though you would at least have to stand in town for 30 minutes with a few people to get soemthing and these people could easily be killed by another gang, breaking their stream of caps.

then again it would highly depend on militia and in the end it would all be the same anyway, but his idea still was different and reasonable.

[Lordus]

What is unfair ? If a gang is strong enough to dominate whole wasteland it should gain all wastelands (6 towns) loot. Its logic.

 If a system allows one gang to dominate whole wasteland cities, then yes. But thats wrong conception. Look at the similarity into real world. There exists rules aimed against economical dominance, because it ruins or it has potential to ruin economical competition.

 In 2238 is the same: One dominant team efectively blocks "TC" interaction amongs others and it leads into One vs others. So i think that new proposal should reduce possible domination of one team. Why? Server should not be aimed for entertaining only one gang. More factions with access to economical benefits of "TControling" means more factions joinining the combat.

 

the way rascal worded it though you would at least have to stand in town for 30 minutes with a few people to get soemthing and these people could easily be killed by another gang, breaking their stream of caps.

then again it would highly depend on militia and in the end it would all be the same anyway, but his idea still was different and reasonable.

 Why every proposal of TC should include loitering in cities? Stay there for 30 minutes, you get reward. During last two years it means 3/4 cases of wait for nothing (except stuff) and 1/4 of cases was action.

 So why not divide it, make reward and PvP as two independent "scenarios". Simply, one is beacon, second is without and needs investition (repair generator, get some stuff). It would in both cases eliminate or at least minimize loitering time in exchange of action of any type. Why? Make this game more friendly for players who dont want to sit online for hours per day if they want to join team PvP.

[Catoptromancy]

The largest controlling faction have been beaten. PVP'ed till they stopped coming back, the reward was some loot...town could never be taken with so many random allied factions asserting that much control at once. Was still a fun rewardless pvp with allied factions countering the swarm.

Actual TC involves going at it alone. Not very fun. Splitting TC into in timer and TC rewards into influence would solve this. Once a TC timer runs out and town is taken, all influence is reset.

[kttdestroyer]

So, there is a big problem with militia and generally town right now.

We get town, and reach influence limit, the militia is ours, however SoT has only 0.05 until take control again, so they just have to enter town and militia is their, without us even notice it, the same other way around.... Solution: Militia shouldint swap sides at all. (And a lot other things mentioned in this thread, like factions loss in influence while other gain, right now it is very little amount)

Now the town of Den looks like a real mess, we or sot can take it in matter of 1 min... Its unplayable right now 

[Vincenzo]

TC system needs to be re-worked from the very basics imho. It has for too long meant that a town becomes a PK infested warzone unaccassable for anyone outside the gang participating in that TC. Right now, it actually encourages hanging out in the controlled cities for long periods of time and thus really makes the gang controlling them, not just run in, camp the spawn grids for few minutes, kill everyone and profit. Now when gangmembers have to hang out in TC controlled zones longer, there is less collateral dmg, even if most gangs still act like idiot PKs during TC (kill everyone on sight, even if he clearly doesn't pose any threat)
Allthough the system is faaaaaaaaaaaar away from perfect, I still think the latest update in the TC system was indeed an improvement.
This game needs less stereotype PvP gangwars and moar roleplaying people and stuff to do for non-gang players. Sure PvP is fun, but I'd like to believe there's something more to this game than that.