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[avv]

So what if drakonis didn't make the perfect char, or that it is possible to make pvp-able hybrid? The point still remains that powerbuilds are encouraged, so are support alts. There's no question about that, hell devs even tried to ban alting last wipe but players just didn't stop doing it.

[Lexx]

It's impossible to exterminate alts, without altering the character creation system or highering the level cap. Regardless what you do, it will end in jack of all trades characters, as this is exactly the reason why alts exist.

[Wichura]

Edit:About outdoorsman, you don't need this skill anymore, till someone nerf sneak again, or alteast make impossible to go into sneak mode at Wroldmap, and automatically leave sneak mode at exit grid, so you can't be invisible instantly at encounter. Because you can tag Sneak instead of Outdoorsman and easily walk with 20% outdoorsman don't caring about anything. Noone will see you, so... what's a problem?

I didn't know that, thanks.
Outdoorsman is a source of XP, Sneak isn't :>

[virus341]

I didn't know that, thanks.
Outdoorsman is a source of XP, Sneak isn't :>

Without diminishing scorpions are your best friends, not outdoorsman

[avv]

It's impossible to exterminate alts, without altering the character creation system or highering the level cap. Regardless what you do, it will end in jack of all trades characters, as this is exactly the reason why alts exist.

What's wrong with altering character creation? Of course we gotta toggle the numbers if alts are wished to be exterminated. Players just won't stop what's strongly profitable.

- Reduce the potential which one char can master at one thing, no more 200+ sg snipers. Forces players to spend their skillpoints on something else and won't let them become too accurate.
- pvp system must have features that reward skill, more factors that can be exploited for player's favour.
- Set hp upper and lower limit
- Set ap upper and lower limit *these will prevent players from making intentionally too weak characters and turning this weakness into overpowering strength at some other area.
- The best equipment and temporary perks can only be achieved by npc faction interaction which demands skills in fighting and profesions.
- npc rep could be achieved by killing enemy players, but not so that you grind the same dude over and over again. You must kill various players with as much high status as possible.
- Currently crafting related skills provide nice perk unlocks suitable for fighting or just bonuses to fighting skills, like draconis said.
- Force players to choose fighting and luxury perks. You cannot pick only either type.

[geraioptuaer]

Same as all mmos where there is crafting, people will have alts to fill the supply gap or to get their own stuff when they want

[Sius]

Imho the core of the problem is not in powerbuilds but its in crafter builds. I mean most of the MMOs are combat based. Whenever its PvE or PvP there is a thin line between them and even if you focus purely at PvE you can still encounter PvP situations and you would not completely suck at them. But that are MMOs in general. When you take a look at FOnline then to reach out for high lvl professions you have to sacrifice your combat efficiency. I mean if we role out RP (since RP guys can play pretty much with anything and then never complain  ) and focus only on PvP and PvE then crafters are more or less useless in both. In PvP you can't afford to have single special misplaced and average builds are having really tough times trying to compete with PvPers. And in PvE I can't imagine situation where raid will profit from someones ability to craft high tier armor/weapons when it comes down to boss fight. Of course there could be situations like X repair is needed to get that generator working and use elevator in order to get into some "dungeon" etc but in general bringing crafters into fight, no matter if its against players or NPCs is not a good idea. Imho future professions should be obtainable by anyone who wants to craft. So even pure PvP maniac should be allowed to get SG 3 no matter how his special look like. Skill should determine your success and quality when it comes to crafting but it should not limit you. As it is with weapons. There are no restrictions for them. If you take laser pistol or turbo plasma rifle, skill does not limit you. It only determines how good you are with that gun. Same should be applied for professions. Also I think there should be some kind of progress when you craft. If you craft some stuff 1000 times a day then you will master it and be better than someone who is going to craft that stuff for first time. So imo everyone should have more or less combat build and the difference between good crafters that like to craft and people who can craft but ignore it should be made by players actions => how often they craft, what they craft etc.

And as for the why are alts so popular the answer is pretty obvious. Its easy and fast to make one and you profit on it so why not to create one right? Alts are domain mainly for PvP players since PvE guys or RPers can do whatever they want with one character. But PvPer has to supply his main char and since something like auctions or trades among players are like on the freezing point then everyone chooses to create an alt. Crafters can master top tier of their professions on 10th lvl and thats not that hard to get + fact that buying stuff will cost you more than if you farm and craft it yourself is another reason why to alt.

I would like to see working system where people who choose to craft and focus on that will supply others and the rest of the people will rather buy from them than switch to their alts. But there is way too much elements that affect this starting with combat mechanics and ending with servers economy - its nothing easy to get rid of the alts.

[geraioptuaer]

- The best equipment and temporary perks can only be achieved by npc faction interaction which demands skills in fighting and profesions.

This sounds promising, you could have it so you can only use certain pieces of equipment if you are in a certain npc faction.

But on this note I think you should be able to be in player faction and npc faction (but still have reputation changes etc).

[Midnight]

I would like to see working system where people who choose to craft and focus on that will supply others and the rest of the people will rather buy from them than switch to their alts. But there is way too much elements that affect this starting with combat mechanics and ending with servers economy - its nothing easy to get rid of the alts.

I tried this and everyone know perfectly how it finish. Or you get stolen or you get killed. The only way to trade is go for NPC merchant who are always short in caps and can't buy everything.
Here you want to put what should be a fallout game, people trying to survive. Many are helping each others and some don't play the game and are rejected, like raiders.

In FOnline, you have not the part people trying to help each other, or it's really minor (or NPCs ...) and all players have only one sentence on their chat is "i rape your mother" or this kind of things and they are permitted cause of imbalanced power builds. Powerbuilds which could not make it in the wastes. Sorry but a super sniper with crit is not a viable build in the wastes i can't possibly see how he could survive. Powerbuilds are all this kind they can't do it alone, but they are used to kill everyone else ...

[avv]

Basically any way that makes it more profitable to keep playing a single char regularly even after lvl21 than having alts supporting each other is the way to go.

[Ghosthack]

Basically any way that makes it more profitable to keep playing a single char regularly even after lvl21 than having alts supporting each other is the way to go.

Like Lexx mentioned earlier, almost any way that makes it more profitable to keep playing a single char, are ways that make characters more alike, closer to a jack-of-all-trades. Removing the level cap would be the single best alt eliminator, because then all the hardcore players that play 24/7 could continue with their grinding ad infinitum, and the value of having alts is simply very small suddenly, because the lvl 232 crafter/sniper/BG/barter character with 1642 HP is a bit more attractive than some weak barter/sniper/crafter alt with possibly low outdoorsman.

Removing the level cap would wreak havoc on the balancing though, and is a terrible idea. It was seen clearly in TLA before they introduced a level cap, where "god characters" would roam towns killing everything on their own.

I could bring more examples, but there was one.

[Alvarez]

Why don't you cap maximal HP or something else, instead of level, Ghosthack?

[RavenousRat]

Why don't you cap maximal HP or something else, instead of level, Ghosthack?

And only 1 skill possible over 200%, X skills to 150%/175%, and other skills 100% max.

[Sius]

I do think its the professions that are the issue here, not the powerbuilds. I mean best craftsman can't be the best if he can't use his goods better than the most of his customers. It just feels weird to make professions so unreachable that you have to dedicate your whole character to reach to the top.
The way I would like to see professions is like an extension to any character that chooses it. No matter if its powerbuilder, RPer or just an average guy. It should be the person itself that decides if he wants to get better and then spend his time and resources to reach to the top. Simply make it hard to reach to the top items but hard in matter of how much effort is needed to get there and not how you spend your special/skill points. Stats should make it easier/harder to learn and train professions but they should not limit you.

[Alvarez]

And only 1 skill possible over 200%, X skills to 150%/175%, and other skills 100% max.

Yeah, something like this would be cool.
Like tagged skills. And a limited amount of perks. Just that the character would be able to be neutralised by a small group, be able to fix some stat points, like ugly Charisma or bad Luck, learn two professions and be able to sell.
I'm sure, the player will put all his effort into his character.

Simply make it hard to reach to the top items but hard in matter of how much effort is needed to get there and not how you spend your special/skill points. Stats should make it easier/harder to learn and train professions but they should not limit you.

You mean, gradually diminishing skill/hit/experience points after proper amount of them?