Other > Closed suggestions
Crafting, economy and anti-alting
Nice_Boat:
--- Quote from: Elmehdi on February 21, 2010, 03:05:47 pm ---Here I can't agree with you :P. I was playing with a single character for a long time and I didn't have a feeling that I was limited in any way. The point is that you have to buy a lot of things from other players. It's not that bad, since most of players offer quite decent prices for their products, crafting them mostly to get exp.
At least it was possible before nerfing critical hits. You could build a great sniper without having to limit him that much, now 10 luck seems to be a must ::).
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I know you can play a single character, but there are limits to what you can do. Take an unarmed fighter for example - you can't really do much more, and it's not a good main because it's very limited in a lot of areas even if you mix up and make him a crafter and a scout. Some builds are very fun if not overused and, unfortunately very specialised - and being unable to have an alt of the kind would simply mean that they disappear from the game or get used by a limited group of players.
Another argument in defense of alts (with constraints like login timeouts and forbidding dual logs in place of course) is the level cap - if you could play a single character only, there wouldn't be any character development going on for you. If you can have an alt or two going on, you are constantly increasing your capabilities as a player and you keep having something to do. A 1 character - 1 player system would mean that the only thing you'd have to do after reaching 21 would be TC and perhaps stockpiling stuff (but what the hell do you need that 20th CA for anyway?) - which in all honesty wouldn't be enough to keep me playing.
Attero:
Eh you will not see that much of differance 1v1 in random encoutners between combat and some crafter mix expecially in case of sniper - the main advantage of pure sniper is his range thats not the case here. He can have more crit % but its still random and between 60% and 70% crit chance there is not that much differance (depands on your chances imo). However if you happen to to have FA high then unless you can lock him out totaly with one FA he can heal up fully.
Also another case is that combat chars drug them selves up to hoof - they dont do that for encoutners and i dont belive you will want to lose your inante 2 aimed per round to jet addict yourself.
But in case of BG builds the differance is much much bigger - a 180 hp BG vs 250 HP one ...well the odds change.
Also keep not that for combat = FA ?& doc . In random encoutner yo ucan doc up with jsut 10% skill and cure the broken limb but thats 70min timeout after. with 100 the timeout is less then 10 min so while it shines in city fights...
Elmehdi:
To be precise, it's actually 69% to 85% when shoting in the eyes and 59% to 75% when aiming in the head and I'd say that 16% of the spread makes a significant difference.
--- Quote from: Nice_Boat on February 21, 2010, 03:14:32 pm ---Another argument in defense of alts (with constraints like login timeouts and forbidding dual logs in place of course) is the level cap - if you could play a single character only, there wouldn't be any character development going on for you. If you can have an alt or two going on, you are constantly increasing your capabilities as a player and you keep having something to do. A 1 character - 1 player system would mean that the only thing you'd have to do after reaching 21 would be TC and perhaps stockpiling stuff (but what the hell do you need that 20th CA for anyway?) - which in all honesty wouldn't be enough to keep me playing.
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I do really hope the devs let us advance somehow after reaching level 21 ::).
avv:
--- Quote from: Nice_Boat on February 21, 2010, 01:24:08 pm ---And just think about it for a second - if you managed to somehow limit people to playing a single character, who the hell would really enjoy it aside from the odd "true roleplay" bunch? It'd drastically limit the number of things you can do with the game - if you go PvP, you can't craft, can't fight in the unarmed brawls, can't go on a country trip. Who the hell would choose to play high-CHA leaders or crafters if it's hard to convince people to make such an alt right now, even when it's really needed for the team?
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The problem is that characters have too high potential to be good at something and too high potential to suck at something. Plaing a maximized powerbuild takes away all the other activities except the speciality. This is pretty irrational, even the world's top profesionals have still variety of skills at their disposal. They surely can read, talk, wash laundry, speak foreign languages and so on. In fonline a specialist is a retard robot who can't do anything else but his main task.
Another problem is that because of items being the basic need for everyone, characters are used only to hoard them. There's no reason to play THE character, as long as there's A character who can get items. The characters themselves don't get any better when max level is reached, but the ammount of items at certain group's or person's disposal can always be raised. So characters are used as tools to get items, instead of items being used as tools to get something for the characters. This causes people to regard their chars as tools and the game fails as role playing game.
EDIT: hah people made the same points while I was typing this message.
Nice_Boat:
--- Quote from: avv on February 21, 2010, 04:02:41 pm ---The problem is that characters have too high potential to be good at something and too high potential to suck at something. Plaing a maximized powerbuild takes away all the other activities except the speciality. This is pretty irrational, even the world's top profesionals have still variety of skills at their disposal. They surely can read, talk, wash laundry, speak foreign languages and so on. In fonline a specialist is a retard robot who can't do anything else but his main task.
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Not really, no. All characters can do all the basic things with some effort (drugs), being able to do one or two things exceptionally well is what makes them specialists - and that's all fine and the way it should be. What would you want, a BG gunsmith who incidentally can make his own stimpacks and an occasional Plasma Rifle? THAT would be really f**ked up.
--- Quote from: avv on February 21, 2010, 04:02:41 pm ---Another problem is that because of items being the basic need for everyone, characters are used only to hoard them. There's no reason to play THE character, as long as there's A character who can get items. The characters themselves don't get any better when max level is reached, but the ammount of items at certain group's or person's disposal can always be raised. So characters are used as tools to get items, instead of items being used as tools to get something for the characters. This causes people to regard their chars as tools and the game fails as role playing game.
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Wouldn't people be less important than items in a postnuclear world? They sure are in low-tech Fading Suns, which doesn't stop it from being an excellent RPG system. Why would that be a problem at all anyway? And you're not even right with that, cause the game isn't about items (can be replaced/restocked in a day or two), it's about knowledge and having a lot of friends and aquintances. Anyway, the reason people aren't roleplaying is because they don't really want to,, not because the mechanics are set this way or that way. To have a roleplaying experience you need a carefuly selected bunch of guys and girls caring about having a roleplaying experience - 2238 is an open server, so there's never gonna be serious rp here, sorry. As far as less serious rp is concerned (ie. people not doing stuff out of character), 2238 looks quite good - gang leaders engage in diplomacy on their own initiative, there's player-player trade, players care about their equipment more than about themselves which fits the setting, technology is limited to the best organized groups etc. Not really much to complain about - it's as good as it gets in a game that basically lets everyone in.
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