Other > Closed suggestions
Crafting, economy and anti-alting
Nice_Boat:
--- Quote from: Quentin Lang on February 21, 2010, 01:07:07 pm ---Yeah, crafter can be fighter, that true, in fact, my first char was crafter and fighter. But, oh well, if youre both - crafter and fighter - youre not much good in any of them. Low carry weight, low combat skills, crappy stats. To learn profession you gotta be mentats/buffout junkie, gotta invest many skill points in crafting skills so your fighting skills really suck. Youre no good in advanced combat, and crafting is slow for that kind of chars.
--- End quote ---
Granted that crafter-fighter is worse than a pure fighter in combat (what a twist!), but it doesn't mean he can't do well in combat in the hands of an experienced player. The thing balancing it all out is the fact that to level a fighter you need way more effort than to level a crafter. It's just so much more time consuming - and you're basically no good till you reach at least level 15 (some would say 18 or even 21). And since there's a constant progress in fighter builds due to changes in economy and, errr, fashion - people who want to stay at the top generally constantly are leveling a new fighter build up. It's not really that bad, it's just that alts are a part of the game - to have a good alt, you need to spend a lot of time. With relog timeouts and crafting cooldowns they aren't messing anything up. Detecting dual logs seems to work just fine, so I don't really understand what's this anti-alt campaign all about.
And just think about it for a second - if you managed to somehow limit people to playing a single character, who the hell would really enjoy it aside from the odd "true roleplay" bunch? It'd drastically limit the number of things you can do with the game - if you go PvP, you can't craft, can't fight in the unarmed brawls, can't go on a country trip. Who the hell would choose to play high-CHA leaders or crafters if it's hard to convince people to make such an alt right now, even when it's really needed for the team? Alts aren't bad, alt abuse (fast relogs, dual logging etc.) is. If someone has the time and wants to double for an entire army and have an alt for everything - by all means allow him to do so, he's still way behind actual groups capable of doing things simultaneously.
And don't even get started with the usual "but this forces us to alt" and "loners get screwed that way". I made a competent crafter (as evidenced by a constant influx of CAs into BBS storage facilities), fighter (I think a lot of people who did ride my rocket can give a testimony to that), taxi (3 CHA, but hey, it's better than nothing!) and scout (outdoorsman at 150) who could gather basically everything all in one. And that really is the char I enjoy playing the most, because the experience is so smooth (don't have to wait to relog to do something else or ask someone else to drive me around the map). If I could do it, you can do it too. All it takes is a bit of experience and actually thinking about your build for a little while.
Attero:
@Qlang - thats the whole point of my ideas to reduce the requirements to learn proffession or even kick em out totaly so you dont need to gimp yoruself to be crafter.
@boat - none said that one should make alts but its bad that by being a crafter your other capabilities need to drop - in most game you will find that crafting is hard to level up and in most cases dont give exp at all. instead your character got something to earn money with and often become stronger.
but somewhat its against Fallput sense - being able to craft plama rifle with 10 science ... so we could rise the skills points avaible - and then one could become master of them all (thats quie bad) or we need to gimp other stats.
So what we can do ... we can give skill points bonus for having proffession ... if one would spend 120 in repair an 90 in science he could get that 20% free in small guns for free ... the case is however that the game doesnt see somethign as temporaty skill points - so one to benefit full from proffession would need to wait till very last levels and thats quite bad.
Sothe final option would be mayeb give some bonus damage for / resistance / healing for having proffession -but we would then yet mess more the hardly balanced world as its now..
Wichura:
--- Quote from: Nice_Boat on February 21, 2010, 01:24:08 pm ---And don't even get started with the usual "but this forces us to alt" and "loners get screwed that way". I made a competent crafter (as evidenced by a constant influx of CAs into BBS storage facilities), fighter (I think a lot of people who did ride my rocket can give a testimony to that), taxi (3 CHA, but hey, it's better than nothing!) and scout (outdoorsman at 150) who could gather basically everything all in one. And that really is the char I enjoy playing the most, because the experience is so smooth (don't have to wait to relog to do something else or ask someone else to drive me around the map). If I could do it, you can do it too. All it takes is a bit of experience and actually thinking about your build for a little while.
--- End quote ---
+1
Here is my one and only char: 2 lvl Gunsmith Small Guns, 1 lvl Armorer, four-people taxi, a bit medic, a bit fighter. Yeah, sure, it's not some big badass mofo tank, impossible to kill and danger as kissing a sleeping tiger in a butt. But playing pure-fighter would be for me boring as hell, constant slaughter of creatures. Besides how do you get toys, if no-one would craft a thing (no XP for that, remember)?
UbiValkin:
I've never played pure fighter, and don't want to. My "crafter" is only 12th level now, can easy kill high level, if he is dumb enough and don't kill me for 1 turn. And, really, i don't see MUCH difference between pure fighter and fighter/crafter. Both die really fast. Really difference is number, when you're alone, they're 3 or 4, and of couse, if they're in metal armor with rocketlauncher and sniper rifles, and you're in blue suit, sledgehammer and 5 iron ore in inventory. One on one with my armor and weapon i'll kill them easy, even if i'm not pure fighter, my weapon skill and crit chance is enough to crit eye shot them, soon double eye shot per turn with pistols... with 2 action boys.
Elmehdi:
--- Quote from: Nice_Boat on February 21, 2010, 01:24:08 pm ---And just think about it for a second - if you managed to somehow limit people to playing a single character, who the hell would really enjoy it aside from the odd "true roleplay" bunch? It'd drastically limit the number of things you can do with the game - if you go PvP, you can't craft, can't fight in the unarmed brawls, can't go on a country trip. Who the hell would choose to play high-CHA leaders or crafters if it's hard to convince people to make such an alt right now, even when it's really needed for the team? Alts aren't bad, alt abuse (fast relogs, dual logging etc.) is. If someone has the time and wants to double for an entire army and have an alt for everything - by all means allow him to do so, he's still way behind actual groups capable of doing things simultaneously.
--- End quote ---
Here I can't agree with you :P. I was playing with a single character for a long time and I didn't have a feeling that I was limited in any way. The point is that you have to buy a lot of things from other players. It's not that bad, since most of players offer quite decent prices for their products, crafting them mostly to get exp.
At least it was possible before nerfing critical hits. You could build a great sniper without having to limit him that much, now 10 luck seems to be a must ::).
EDIT:
--- Quote from: UbiValkin on February 21, 2010, 01:24:08 pm ---One on one with my armor and weapon i'll kill them easy
--- End quote ---
You are very self confident :-).
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