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Other => FOnline:2238 Forum => Archives => General Game Discussion => Topic started by: jacky. on November 19, 2012, 03:29:00 am

Title: mercs salary
Post by: jacky. on November 19, 2012, 03:29:00 am
their salary is to expensive. 25% is to much. after 8days u are doubling their prices. maby lower their salary to 10% or even 5%. it is now imposible to lvl up mercs because it cost to much.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: S.T.A.L.K.E.R on November 19, 2012, 07:19:05 pm
Who uses mercs?

I prefer companions now since they are cheap and awesome :D
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: greenthumb on November 19, 2012, 07:39:10 pm
i dont pay salary i prefer to make them die and buy new....
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: DocAN. on November 19, 2012, 07:44:36 pm
i dont pay salary i prefer to make them die and buy new....

the easiest way
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: DeputyDope on November 19, 2012, 07:45:20 pm
Who uses mercs?

people who MAYBE use rocket mutant mercs?
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: Roachor on November 21, 2012, 01:13:26 am
Who uses mercs?

I prefer companions now since they are cheap and awesome :D

some people can't camp 24/7
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: falloutdude on November 21, 2012, 05:39:57 am
yes 1/4 of their price per day..... what troll dev thought this up.
It does not stop people from useing mercs it just makes them waste time killing them when their loyalty is low.
no one actually pays them more than the first time they buy them.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: JovankaB on November 21, 2012, 06:14:16 am
yes 1/4 of their price per day..... what troll dev thought this up.
It does not stop people from useing mercs it just makes them waste time killing them when their loyalty is low.
no one actually pays them more than the first time they buy them.

I don't understand.
Their cost is smaller than the salary? Or is it simply not worth because loyalty goes down when people don't play?
If their loyalty goes down when owner is offline, then I think it's wrong. At least if they are in non-aggressive mode.

Or maybe loyalty should go down with every kill or attack - so when they actually do something.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: falloutdude on November 21, 2012, 05:01:39 pm
I don't understand.
Their cost is smaller than the salary? Or is it simply not worth because loyalty goes down when people don't play?
If their loyalty goes down when owner is offline, then I think it's wrong. At least if they are in non-aggressive mode.

Or maybe loyalty should go down with every kill or attack - so when they actually do something.

The salary is 1/4 the cost everyday. How does it make sense that after 4 days I have to pay the mercs full price and have less loyalty. when loyalty goes below 60percent i usally just murder them because thats more cost effective then paying them daily.
also yes the fact that they are still loseing loyalty when I am offline and not useing them also is a factor as to why I think the salary is too high. what if I just bought a merc for say 20k and then have some unexpected real life things to do for days. I just wasted 20k and have done nothing with that merc. I personally think as jacky said the salary price should be 10-5 percent or even 25 percent every week. I also think that loyalty should decrease weekly not daily by 25 percent.

so for example for the weekly one
i pay merc 1 time per week 25 percent of oringal bought price.
at the end of the week loyalty does down by 10-25 percent
I just payed merc for the week loyalty does back up by 10-25
also what would be cool is if he could decide how much to pay the merc. This way if we only have a couple hundred on us we can give them what we have and they will increase loyalty based on how much we gave them.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: Roachor on November 21, 2012, 05:09:51 pm
Mercs are shit because you can't manage their inventories and their bodies are black holes which destroy everything on death. Only good one is unarmed mutant for pve farming.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: falloutdude on November 21, 2012, 05:47:30 pm
Mercs are shit because you can't manage their inventories and their bodies are black holes which destroy everything on death. Only good one is unarmed mutant for pve farming.
This also.
I think mercs should be lootable. I mean I see tons of muties in pvp and when you kill them you get fuck all even thou there is rockets, miniguns and lazers on them. Why not let us reap the rewards we deserve for killing them? we waste ammo on killing them let us get weapons and ammo they have on them. make it so that armors on mercs cannot be looted also.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: avv on November 21, 2012, 06:10:11 pm
Doesn't matter how much the salary is, some people will buy them anyway and some won't. And those who do, have the advantage. Caps are just a matter of farming.

Mercs might as well be removed completely without negative impact on gameplay.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: DocAN. on November 21, 2012, 06:45:08 pm
Mercs might as well be removed completely without negative impact on gameplay.

Agree in 100%.

Since we have companions mercs could be removed.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: jacky. on November 21, 2012, 06:50:03 pm
still loyality sytem is lill crap. -5% and to imcrease 10% i need to pay 25% of buying price. 1 week and it is cheaper to buy new one. last season i had max lvled muties 600hp and i liked them. now it is imposible.
so maby salary would be 5% not 25%?
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: foonlinecurious on November 21, 2012, 06:59:28 pm
Agree in 100%.

Since we have companions mercs could be removed.



Like Roachor said, not everyone can camp 24/7 waiting for companions to spawn, don't be stupid.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: Malice Song on November 21, 2012, 07:02:24 pm
Since we have companions mercs could be removed.

In which case recruitment process would seriously need to be revamped, though. Companion availabily is semi-limited and the current model would not scale well with a positive change in player numbers.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: Mike Crosser on November 21, 2012, 07:04:05 pm
loyalty goes down when owner is offline...
....maybe loyalty should go down with every kill or attack - so when they actually do something.

Agreed.
The hate that every time I take a break from the game I have to worry about some asshole who wants money from me for not doing anything.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: avv on November 21, 2012, 07:13:02 pm


Like Roachor said, not everyone can camp 24/7 waiting for companions to spawn, don't be stupid.

Companion spawning system isn't working too well anyway. People use quick towncheckers in companion spots and the more players online, the less companions everyone gets.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: Roachor on November 21, 2012, 07:18:56 pm
I found two companions since the season started and I play a lot more than is reasonable. Imo mercs should respawn too and only lose loyalty from dying, this would justify the price as you'd be paying 50% of the merc cost without speaker and 25% with. Most mercs are paper thin anyways, 200 hp in leather for thousands of caps? seriously?
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: T-888 on November 21, 2012, 07:21:29 pm
Buff mercenaries, hurray!
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: OG on November 21, 2012, 07:27:48 pm
Mercs might as well be removed completely without negative impact on gameplay.


OR better yet TAKE EVERYTHING OUT and only leave a fucking shovel. Der balance will be 100% because there is not going to be more than 1 type of build. Make the game simple as possible. Dont try make the game better more diverse more complicated. Devs as it turns out make the game simple as fuck its already too complicated. Make a game where player vs player, shovel vs shovel.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: T-888 on November 21, 2012, 07:31:12 pm

OR better yet TAKE EVERYTHING OUT and only leave a fucking shovel. Der balance will be 100% because there is not going to be more than 1 type of build. Make the game simple as possible.

2 options is too much, it'll confuse players, see there is shovel and unarmed, if shovel is going to be better, then there will be no balance and players who like unarmed will be offended. Let us just delete all weaponry, leave unarmed with only punch option.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: jacky. on November 21, 2012, 07:38:34 pm
Sot wisemans spokes again...better run to ur shelter because their wisdom will just blow ur mind. Mercs unkeep is to high, i dont care about their basic cost but 25%salary to rise up 10% loyality level
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: DocAN. on November 21, 2012, 08:15:40 pm


Like Roachor said, not everyone can camp 24/7 waiting for companions to spawn, don't be stupid.

Im finding companions everyday and im playing this game like 3h/day

Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: avv on November 21, 2012, 08:41:56 pm
OR better yet TAKE EVERYTHING OUT and only leave a fucking shovel. Der balance will be 100% because there is not going to be more than 1 type of build. Make the game simple as possible. Dont try make the game better more diverse more complicated. Devs as it turns out make the game simple as fuck its already too complicated. Make a game where player vs player, shovel vs shovel.

But if you take everything out, doesn't that reduce diversity?

My point is: npcs shouldn't interfere with pvp.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: OG on November 21, 2012, 09:22:55 pm
But if you take everything out, doesn't that reduce diversity?

My point is: npcs shouldn't interfere with pvp.

First I was making a point that if you want to remove mercs why should we stop there. The second point that i tried to convey was that I disagree mercs should interfere with pvp. If mercs are present in pvp. That minor but at the same time strong element is that adds to the diversity of pvp. If there are mercs in pvp your enemy has to take an account that you might be going to use them as such they make appropriate precautions thus making the pvp harder more interesting. More tactics more variety of things that you can use in pvp = more fun.





After you saw the pic...


I remember the times when 2 players stood against each other and shot their magazines until 1 dropped dead i loved those time i truly did. But it doesnt mean that i should stagnate and not improve.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: avv on November 21, 2012, 09:44:10 pm
First I was making a point that if you want to remove mercs why should we stop there. The second point that i tried to convey was that I disagree mercs should interfere with pvp. If mercs are present in pvp. That minor but at the same time strong element is that adds to the diversity of pvp. If there are mercs in pvp your enemy has to take an account that you might be going to use them as such they make appropriate precautions thus making the pvp harder more interesting. More tactics more variety of things that you can use in pvp = more fun.

All mercs cause is more farming and more preparing. That's something many people simply hate and don't even bother to fight because they know their enemy has prepared themselves better.
They kill gang-diversity because only strongest and hardest farmers can afford mercs in daily basis.
To counter mercs best idea is to simply have mercs of your own or more fastrelogs, but more something anyway.
Nobody mains a merc-leader, it's just a fire and forget character. That's because it's impossible to regear as fast as other builds. You can't store mercs in base and get more if you die. Thus merc leader is often just a relog or like in last session, a proxy.

More variety doesn't equal more fun in this case because the needed amount of work to get mercs simply drives people away. The more equal people are in terms of wealth, the more action we will have.
Buying more militia was a strategy too, it added diversity. But diversity doesn't equal fun or more action.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: JovankaB on November 21, 2012, 09:55:01 pm
I think mercs shouldn't have ability to "attack everything that moves beside my teammates trololo".
They are too automatic. Instead more options to control them would be nice. But beside this they
are part of the game whether you like it or not and NPCs are part of the game whether you like it or not.
This is not some 3D tournament shooter with regular "fair" matches in predictable arenas, if you want
play this way then WTF are you doing in an open town, if you don't like the environment then go to
Hinkley or switch to Quake.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: avv on November 21, 2012, 09:58:57 pm
I think mercs shouldn't have ability to "attack everything that moves beside my teammates trololo".
They are too automatic. Instead more options to control them would be nice. But beside this they
are part of the game whether you like it or not and NPCs are part of the game whether you like it or not.
This is not some 3D tournament shooter with regular "fair" matches in predictable arenas, if you want
play this way then WTF are you doing in an open town, if you don't like the environment then go to
Hinkley or switch to Quake.

Is this your message to new tc gangs?
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: JovankaB on November 21, 2012, 10:04:37 pm
Actually it's message to everyone.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: avv on November 21, 2012, 10:06:29 pm
So "They are part of game" overrules all counter-reasons?
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: OG on November 21, 2012, 10:26:46 pm
All mercs cause is more farming and more preparing.

Yeah they cause farming but so does each battle char required different type of farming. As does the preparation for a sg sniper char you dont take laser rifle you take sniper rifle but for big gunner you take avenger or RL but with merc leader you go to town and buy those walking weapons. Thus for each different char has its own preparation and appropriate farm style.



That's something many people simply hate and don't even bother to fight because they know their enemy has prepared themselves better.

To start off there are towns where you can be out of mercs usage range i am not going to tell you which towns they are. + If they go into battle knowing they have lost. Why dont they just shoot themselves?


They kill gang-diversity because only strongest and hardest farmers can afford mercs in daily basis.

No just look at the the Hawks really.


To counter mercs best idea is to simply have mercs of your own or more fastrelogs, but more something anyway.

YES more something more brains exactly.


Nobody mains a merc-leader, it's just a fire and forget character. That's because it's impossible to regear as fast as other builds. You can't store mercs in base and get more if you die. Thus merc leader is often just a relog or like in last session, a proxy.

Its more like balance issue we shouldnt delete the whole idea based on how it is presented currently and yes you can get more after you die thats the whole fun of it you can get as much as you like as long as you are up for it.

More variety doesn't equal more fun in this case because the needed amount of work to get mercs simply drives people away. The more equal people are in terms of wealth, the more action we will have.

People should start to think as one, the faction commanders should start to think outside the box that is their ''job''. Tip of the day Organize the players and do the hard work in easy way.


Buying more militia was a strategy too, it added diversity. But diversity doesn't equal fun or more action.

In my view everything that adds something to the picture equals more fun because as i already mentioned it makes the picture more complicated more interesting more in depth. Militia was a great thing i remember the time when SoT made full militia of RL in redding and alliance of 80 people attacked us SoT was 20 players. After we killed all the guys in redding(about 2-4 times untill the alliance alts had ended) it was at that moment that i saw each hex of reddings from top spwan to mids spawn covered in loot.


ANYWAY i got flashback just now as i mentioned before just because the presentation was bad doesnt mean the idea was bad.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: Brujah on November 21, 2012, 10:58:47 pm
Jovanka gave a good point on how automatic mercs are, removing the "kill everyone except faction lulz!" would force the merc leaders to stay in map coordenating the mercs to attack a group of players.


At least that way merc leaders wouldn't be bluesuits with less than 100 HP who get logged off right away.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: avv on November 21, 2012, 11:02:52 pm
Yeah they cause farming but so does each battle char required different type of farming. As does the preparation for a sg sniper char you dont take laser rifle you take sniper rifle but for big gunner you take avenger or RL but with merc leader you go to town and buy those walking weapons. Thus for each different char has its own preparation and appropriate farm style.

Arming a single char is not a big deal. Arming a mercleader costs thousands of caps, a visit in a town and likely arming the mercs with preferred weapons, setting their fighting mode. Then you likely need to arm the mercleader too, if it can fight. You can load much more firepower in a mercleader than in a single character.
I claim that it's not good for gameplay that preparing a lot gives significant power in the battlefield.

Players must be rewarded with their actions in the battlefield - not in the farming fields.

To start off there are towns where you can be out of mercs usage range i am not going to tell you which towns they are. + If they go into battle knowing they have lost. Why dont they just shoot themselves?

Because it's a game and they want to have fun.


Quote
No just look at the the Hawks really.

Hawks team is full of eager people who left teams whose other members quit.

Quote
YES more something more brains exactly.

More equals farming and preparing. That's exactly what pvp doesn't need.

Quote
Its more like balance issue we shouldnt delete the whole idea based on how it is presented currently and yes you can get more after you die thats the whole fun of it you can get as much as you like as long as you are up for it.

The whole idea isn't that good. It's not good at all that players can spend lots of time to prepare and this way gain a big benefit in combat. It basically forces the other team to prepare as well or get the hell out. Then the team that prepared is wondering where everyone is and why nobody wants to fight them. Of course people will be up for something that gives victories, people will be up to ridiculous things to win in a game.

Quote
People should start to think the faction commanders should start to think outside the box that is their job. Tip of the day Organize the players and do the hard work in easy way.

You mean farm more? Many guys in my team (coa) have simply stated that they don't have time or willpower to farm all day. Instead of thinking out of the box, we as players need to question current ongoings and think what's reasonable.

Quote
In my view everything that adds something to the picture equals more fun because as i already mentioned it makes the picture more complicated more interesting more in depth.

I simply can't agree. Everything that involves more preparing, more one-task only alts, more dual logs or proxies or relogs don't add anything good in the game.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: Roachor on November 22, 2012, 12:14:12 am
You guys are amazing, so hth is bad because it requires less gear, merc leaders are bad because they require more gear and BG is perfect despite the fact you can farm everything you need while unarmed requires crafting for top gear and mercs require tons of money and gear.
Title: Re: mercs salary
Post by: jacky. on November 22, 2012, 12:35:40 am
ohhh come one...now after update it is much better. u can farm and use ur damaged armor almost like new one. it was big step foward to help us. mercs allways are good if ur team use it, and bad when ur team died by them. i remamber fight when we were 9in redding and bbs ally attacked us with same numbers and droped 4mele with palsma and 3rl muties with car