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Other => FOnline:2238 Forum => Archives => General Game Discussion => Topic started by: FrankenStone on July 15, 2012, 07:42:58 am
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Hi everybody i was just wondering if the sewers got some more underground lvls than just one , i heard heard from some dude that it got 6 lvls or so but for now i was searching with no luck to find any stairs that are going down .
it would be great to know if this is true ... thx .
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Don't believe everything you hear.
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Yeah, there is only one level. It was cheap witticism from Nexxos on IRC, short after the Update.
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Yeah, i was wandering that myself why there are no other levels, i heard myself it has 6
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Yeah, i was wandering that myself why there are no other levels, i heard myself it has 6
Because mapping the one level already was a work enough? I guess if someone will go and try to add more levels, he should fill them with Deathclaws and less narrow passages for more hardcore HtH. If one stands on a bridge, he maximally takes hits from two rats at a time - a great HtH and FA leveling potential, but at the same time a easy target for a PK, because blocked by rats, especially near entrances.
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Those rats are pain in the ass when pvp players want to pass through the sewers. The rats shouldn't engage anyone unless they are attacked first and even then only the one that was hit should aggro.
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Those rats are pain in the ass when pvp players want to pass through the sewers. The rats shouldn't engage anyone unless they are attacked first and even then only the one that was hit should aggro.
But then you could pop them one after another from range, if your were after them.
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But then you could pop them one after another from range, if your were after them.
It amazes me that you consider this as a problem. Dude there's a chance to meet armed-to-teeth pvp apes in the sewers and you're worried about players getting free xp from rats? Hunting molerats or centaurs is faster way to get xp anyway.
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It amazes me that you consider this as a problem. Dude there's a chance to meet armed-to-teeth pvp apes in the sewers and you're worried about players getting free xp from rats? Hunting molerats or centaurs is faster way to get xp anyway.
It's not about XP but it's kinda stupid when you enter a cave full of beasts and expect them to say "hello" or "meh, another wastelander" so you can shoot them, instead of going straight for your flesh and blood, like every decent beast (or armed-to-teeth PvP ape) would do.
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It's not about XP but it's kinda stupid when you enter a cave full of beasts and expect them to say "hello" or "meh, another wastelander" so you can shoot them, instead of going straight for your flesh and blood, like every decent beast (or armed-to-teeth PvP ape) would do.
Stupid to who? A random guy who enters the sewers once and then never comes back? It's not stupid for the guys who play there all day long, they don't give a rat's ass about the rats or how they behave as long as they aren't bothered. When it comes to designing good features, immersion has to step aside.
I doubt it would ruin a nuub's day if the whole sewer didn't aggro on him when he punched one of the rats.
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Stupid to who? A random guy who enters the sewers once and then never comes back? It's not stupid for the guys who play there all day long, they don't give a rat's ass about the rats or how they behave as long as they aren't bothered. When it comes to designing good features, immersion has to step aside.
I doubt it would ruin a nuub's day if the whole sewer didn't aggro on him when he punched one of the rats.
Stupid to a guy who don't want to be bothered by beasts in a beast cave. You enter a rat cave for whatever purpose, expect to deal with rats. And immersion is a feature in this game, so why should it step aside?
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Stupid to a guy who don't want to be bothered by beasts in a beast cave. You enter a rat cave for whatever purpose, expect to deal with rats. And immersion is a feature in this game, so why should it step aside?
Because immersion is gone once you've experienced it few times. After that only thing that matters are the smoothness of game mechanics.
If you refuse to discuss mechanics, I can also present few points about immersion: shouldn't the rats be afraid of loud noises of gunfire and humans in general? How do they multiply so fast even though they are being slaughtered in their thousands? What do they eat? They only stand still, they should die in hunger. If immersion bothers you, why aren't you already complaining about these subjects? Somehow you're only sticking to the hostility of the rats.
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If you refuse to discuss mechanics.
Haven't say that. Tell me what you think about it.
I can also present few points about immersion: shouldn't the rats be afraid of loud noises of gunfire and humans in general? How do they multiply so fast even though they are being slaughtered in their thousands? What do they eat? They only stand still, they should die in hunger.
That's quite interesting point, btw, avv.
The rats are clever animals and FEV maybe made them even more cleverer. For them gunfire means food. Killed rats lure the living ones from lower levels and they eat the corpses. Well, they also eat ocassional visitors, if not each other. They also have manti to hunt and eat. As for not patrolling sewers, they have no scripts, or maybe they are territorial.
If immersion bothers you, why aren't you already complaining about these subjects? Somehow you're only sticking to the hostility of the rats.
It doesn't bother me. I'm not even complaining. Are you complaining about rats being hostile?
Because immersion is gone once you've experienced it few times. After that only thing that matters are the smoothness of game mechanics.
Maybe you're right about this, still, you can't say to the game "i have experienced you and for now, leave me alone."
It's about general strategic dealing with the caves, either they suck or they are awesome.
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Haven't say that. Tell me what you think about it.
I told you there's bloodthirsty apes in the sewers to balance out the situation if rats weren't hostile but you just bypassed that argument. For me it's weird that someone can think of non-hostile rats being a problem in an area where you can get randomly killed by another player with powerbuild designed for combat.
Plus the rats are no worth to lvl24 chars who wish to use the sewers as strategic advantage in competition situation against other players.
In addition pve and pvp areas should never be combined because fighting players and npcs at the same time is really messy, which was proved by the militia issue and generally when it comes to pks jumping in your farming encounter.
The rats are clever animals and FEV maybe made them even more cleverer. For them gunfire means food. Killed rats lure the living ones from lower levels and they eat the corpses. Well, they also eat ocassional visitors, if not each other. They also have manti to hunt and eat. As for not patrolling sewers, they have no scripts, or maybe they are territorial.It doesn't bother me. I'm not even complaining. Are you complaining about rats being hostile?
See what talking about immersion does: nothing. We could talk endlessly about the fallout lore and get carried away from the actual subject and what's happening ingame.
Players who are dealing with features in daily basis only care that they work fluently and enjoyable way. Immersion is just a top layer to make things look at least credible. Players who try things only few times may find immersion really important, whereas experienced players just bypass it and concentrate on their goals. Who should the features support most: those who are involved with them daily, or those who check them once or rarely?
So if the rats don't bother you, why are you telling they should remain the way they are? If you would have no problem them not being hostile by default, what's the issue?
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So you just complain about rats hindering you to do PvP or what?
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So you just complain about rats hindering you to do PvP or what?
That's basically it.
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I dont have client and i have not time to play Fo, but i am curious how NR Sewers looks like, can someone upload screenshots? Thx
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So you just complain about rats hindering you to do PvP or what?
It's usual doublestandards from avv. At one time they complain they get gnarled off by 0 hp from some rats (omfg no PvE in PvP locations!11) but at the other rate it is totally ok to burst people fighting/levelling in random encounters.
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Surf, new reno sewers and random encounters are apples and oranges.
Those rats in the sewers serve no real purpose, other than hinder the ability to effectively navigate the city through underground.
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How is it different? Are there non instanced PvE locations that get constantly interrupted by people seeking for PvP other than random encounters? I just like what Johnny Nuclear did with the Sewers and people who criticize rats being there are going a bit hyperbole. It is supposed to be some alternative route through the city, if a rat eating your armor for 0 hp is too much for you then maybe use the streets instead?
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Surf, new reno sewers and random encounters are apples and oranges.
Those rats in the sewers serve no real purpose, other than hinder the ability to effectively navigate the city through underground.
This comment made me chuckle, after i realised how selfish it sounded. The PvP players like T-888 think that the sewers are built exclusively for them and complain about a bug which is actually a feature.
Thus, the rats are for them a annoyance, while for others who seek direct PvE action, is a excellent interlude in a adventure maze and a little blood/grindfest.
I think this idea is awesome and we should have more of that. :)
How is it different? Are there non instanced PvE locations that get constantly interrupted by people seeking for PvP other than random encounters? I just like what Johnny Nuclear did with the Sewers and people who criticize rats being there are going a bit hyperbole. It is supposed to be some alternative route through the city, if a rat eating your armor for 0 hp is too much for you then maybe use the streets instead?
Couldn't say any better, Surf.
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Streets can't always be utilized effectively for strategic purposes, due to narrow space between buildings. Sewers comes in and adds flexibility how to navigate the city, both better for players who enjoy PvP, and for players who are just looking for a safer path. Rats makes usage of underground less convenient as those npc's are quite a lot, respawn fast and constantly harrass any player initiating combat, just an annoyance.
How is it different? Are there non instanced PvE locations that get constantly interrupted by people seeking for PvP other than random encounters?
Huh? *error, does not compute *
Thus, the rats are for them a annoyance, while for others who seek direct PvE action, is a excellent interlude in a adventure maze and a little blood/grindfest.
Some molerats and rats? Excellent adventure maze? ;D
wait wait .... under a PvP city, PvE adventure
;D
the map is real cool, but no the rats.
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I just like what Johnny Nuclear did with the Sewers and people who criticize rats being there are going a bit hyperbole. It is supposed to be some alternative route through the city, if a rat eating your armor for 0 hp is too much for you then maybe use the streets instead?
Maybe you could understand how much of an annoyance it is if you played the game yourself.
Since you don't, I'll explain it to you: It takes valuable time to kill these rats. Due to the nature of the map, bg's arent even able to kill these rats properly without sacrificing extra ammo or taking even more time getting the burstlines right. After that you have to wait another 5-10 seconds for everyone to reload and get their ap back and waiting for the battle timer to run out. All while the second group of your team is getting devastated on ground level by the enemy that you were supposed to backstab 15 seconds earlier.It's usual doublestandards from avv. At one time they complain they get gnarled off by 0 hp from some rats (omfg no PvE in PvP locations!11) but at the other rate it is totally ok to burst people fighting/levelling in random encounters.
You may have forgotten it, but one of the specialities of this game is the fact that you can kill everyone, everywhere on the map. I dont see how playing the game as intended can in any way work as an anti-pvp argument.
It is supposed to be some alternative route through the city, if a rat eating your armor for 0 hp is too much for you then maybe use the streets instead?
Alright, let's do that, let's use the streets again.Wait, why do we still have the sewers, then?
As you might know (hah) the nature of the the spawns on commercial often lead to stalemates. Especially this season, since high-ac trolls and duallog sneaks always make sure to have eyes on the enemy. Now the sewers are finally a solution to the problem of how to attack a big group that is camping commercial and as far as I can tell, the whole community appreciates the idea of sewers.
This comment made me chuckle, after i realised how selfish it sounded. The PvP players like T-888 think that the sewers are built exclusively for them and complain about a bug which is actually a feature.
Thus, the rats are for them a annoyance, while for others who seek direct PvE action, is a excellent interlude in a adventure maze and a little blood/grindfest.
Isnt it more selfish of the pve guys to inhibit pvp that most of the server population seems to be taking part in, regarding for example the high numbers of players after the TC fix?
When was the last time you have actually seen a "pve'er" in reno? One that actually made to the closest sewer entrance even? Also, you can kill rats all over the world map. I admit that people are curious about the sewers and will probably want to check it out. But as avv said, they will check it once or twice and then never go back as there's no reason to do so for a pve guy.
The rats however will continue to annoy 95% of the people playing in reno. For months to come, I guess.
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How is it different? Are there non instanced PvE locations that get constantly interrupted by people seeking for PvP other than random encounters? I just like what Johnny Nuclear did with the Sewers and people who criticize rats being there are going a bit hyperbole. It is supposed to be some alternative route through the city, if a rat eating your armor for 0 hp is too much for you then maybe use the streets instead?
It's not the rats hitting armor for 0 damage, but preventing players from leaving because of combat timer. And there's about 100 rats down there, meaning that if you enter from virgin street and run to the commercial entrance you got like half of the sewer rats after you. The rats also block players in the narrow passages.
It's the same old again: a feature is added that apes can use - not only apes, but it has potential for them - but there is a small flaw that prevents the feature from working properly in ape gameplay. So the apes mention it and receive an answer that resembles "u mad, ape?" attitude.
Honestly making the rats only hostile towards intentional attacks wouldn't hurt anyone at all. I doubt any nuubs would come complaining that the rats don't behave in realistic way or that they are getting too much easy xp. Let's be realistic here.
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Did explored the sewer today.
Nice map, nice map.
I like that there is some pve going on.
But there are, indeed, too much rats.
I went there with a pistol and 50 bullets, ready to clean that mess.
I instant killed them, which means 1 bullet for 1 creature.
I think i killed them all (not sure) and left with only one bullet in my inventory.
So they are at least 49...
If the one who travel these sewer is unlucky, unskilled, or a burster, he would spend far more bullets, and maybe out of ammo when he reaches the other side.
So, the stalling is a good idea, so the area is less crowded, but at the end, i doubt players would still want to waste a lot of ammo agains't those rats.
There is also a little issue about the water. I think this is quite a good idea to have these barrier, but there aren't quite easy to recognize at the first time. Is it the same texture than the west beach ?
Ultimatelly, i think the whole map, mechanics and contents are near perfect, but need a little balancing...
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There is also a little issue about the water. I think this is quite a good idea to have these barrier, but there aren't quite easy to recognize at the first time. Is it the same texture than the west beach ?
Should be more recognizable after update.
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I dont have client and i have not time to play Fo, but i am curious how NR Sewers looks like, can someone upload screenshots? Thx
https://i.imgur.com/LzdmR.jpg
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Should be more recognizable after update.
Nice work ;D
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Nice work ;D
There is still some graphics missing, some files that should end in faction002 were overlooked. Hopefully it will be fixed.