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Yes, robbing would be great.

10 (41.7%)

Yes, also add robber career.

5 (20.8%)

No, leave it as it is.

9 (37.5%)

Total Members Voted: 24

[borse]

Ummm I really don't see how this would work at all. Leave the game the way it is.

BTW, there's a flaw in your pirate analogy: pirates thrived way back in the day BEFORE NUCLEAR FALLOUT. If they needed food, ladies, shelter, they could find it. It's a lot different in the wasteland... A lot harsher, and a lot more desperate.

[Jeoshua]

Sounds like yet another one of those great ideas that just wouldn't work, the way the game is set up.  If there were perma-death on the server.... yeah I could see it.

[Andr3aZ]

I was thinkin about makin my own suggestion and think the whole thing through until its a real good idea which can be put into the game easy.
But i came to the solution that as good it may be sometime, it wouldnt help very much as it depends too much on players choice to let another live or die.
We know there are too much killers wandering the wastes that dont give a shit about X xp, they kill for the lulz and full loot.



This can only be done if killing has a disadvantage and robbing has an advantage.

[gordulan]

AFAIK you have a 95% chance of a sucessful steal attempt on KOd people, I've done that with my characters a few times, but mainly to get at their ammo, and half of their caps...

[gorkser]

@Andr3aZ &others

I guess you are right. That won´t work against all those just out for the "lulz".
But I think measures should be taken against those, because it realy sucks to have every MMORPG ruined by them.
I don´t know them personally, but I gues most of them are betwenn 12-17 years old, playing all the day computer games
Why should they be allowed to ruin everybodys elses "gaming experience", just because they need to compensate for beeing bullied on the scoolyard by other kids not playing computer all the day?

It´s not that problem for me. I like boring strategy games like panzergeneral and civilization and thus don´t have a problem with tedious, repeating tasks.
And as I am quite unforgiving, I will hunt them down as soon as I am strong enough to do.

But I would prefer to have some real roleplaying game with MMO. If I want to play a shooter, than I play Duke Nukem 3d with Hi-Res pack, or something like that.
If I want to kill other players for fun, I play a shooter with others using LAN.
A MMORPG is not supposed to be a playground for little real life loosers.

Fonline ist the first MMORPG I play, because I don´t have that much time for gaming that a commercial game would be reasonable (paying monthly), but I loved Fallout 1+2. As far as I have read it is the same in every other MMORPG, so Fonline maybe the last that I play too.
For Fonline thats not the big problem, as it is not commercial. WoW etc. are more sensitive to PK (as far as I know), as Blizzard don´t wants 80% of new players stopping playing (and paying) frustrated.

BUT, as far as I have read here the developers have big plans for the future of Fonline and a lot of good features will be senseless if this problem is not dealt with.
When everybody is just killing for fun and loot, maybe fighting to controll cities with their faction for even more loot and killing fun, then every other feature won´t be used, or cannot be used by players not interested in this, as long as the new feature don´t deals with new ways to kill people for the "lulz" and loot.

By the way (to all those who feel they are addressed):
lulz? What´s that? Are you retarted? Cannot write simple english sentences? I´m from germany, english is not my native language, my english skills are everything else but for sure not perfect. But lulz? And all those other retarted incest mutant english sounds...
Not that we would not have those kind of retards en masse in germany to. To quote my girlfriend after talking on the phone with a customer:
"I think he wasn´t a wog, but just some german hip-hop ape not able to speak any longer!"
Ever watched that great "Idiocracy" Movie? That is the future of our western culture!

[OskaRus]

@Andr3aZ &others

I guess you are right. That won´t work against all those just out for the "lulz".

Ever watched that great "Idiocracy" Movie? That is the future of our western culture!

I drink two cans of this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tbxq0IDqD04 every time before going to slaughter bilions of bluesuits and innocent NPCs just for teh lulz. xD

[gordulan]

Wouldn't this be better?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-3qncy5Qfk&feature=fvw

[borse]

Basically, robbing is going to prevent a kid with a lot of items, who is right next to exit grid, from leaving unharmed. It's imbalanced to shit.
This game is about wasteland survival. It's about teaming up or being so efficient and sly that you can survive alone. It IS about shooting - in case you didn't know, those items you hold in your hand to shoot critters are called guns. Guns kill people/critters. And you're right about WOW. Everyone hates that game because they suck at it and can't level... and yet there's still millions of players that play every day... odd they must REALLY hate that game.

Basically dude, if you can't level and are getting frustrated, you're doing something wrong. Play smart, stop whining, get some decent outdoors skill.

The great thing about this game is the risk factors you must consider before each action. You can lose everything on your person in one wrong move, and for many people that is exciting...  Don't ruin the game by introducing some conservative wasteland stealing system... I mean hell, there aren't even officers of the law out in the wastes, so who the fuck is going to stop you from killing anyone you see anyway? The way I see it, this suggestion should be locked and forgotten.
I'd prefer if this game wasn't ruined. thanks

[Surf]

The way I see it, this suggestion should be locked and forgotten.

Did it ever cross your mind that there are people with different mindets then yours? 

[borse]

Did it ever cross your mind that there are people with different mindets then yours?  

Of course. Did it ever cross your mind that I was expressing an opinion? Hence the "The way I see it" part. I thought the point here was to express our opinions as beta testers (I'll admit, my previous comment was a little heated)

Okay to clerify my main point. This isn't needed because it's redundant. It's not gonna stop blue suit killings, that's up to the player. It achieves the same results as killing players, except killing players has an added ego boost. Before you can click the prompt to rob, the player may have already left the grid. If you are successful... What choice does the other player have then to run? Who is going to offer up all their items just to "live". Being a blue suit makes you as good as dead anyway so run or die is the only option.

@Andr3aZ &others

I guess you are right. That won´t work against all those just out for the "lulz".
But I think measures should be taken against those, because it realy sucks to have every MMORPG ruined by them.
I don´t know them personally, but I gues most of them are betwenn 12-17 years old, playing all the day computer games
Why should they be allowed to ruin everybodys elses "gaming experience", just because they need to compensate for beeing bullied on the scoolyard by other kids not playing computer all the day?

It´s not that problem for me. I like boring strategy games like panzergeneral and civilization and thus don´t have a problem with tedious, repeating tasks.
And as I am quite unforgiving, I will hunt them down as soon as I am strong enough to do.

But I would prefer to have some real roleplaying game with MMO. If I want to play a shooter, than I play Duke Nukem 3d with Hi-Res pack, or something like that.
If I want to kill other players for fun, I play a shooter with others using LAN.
A MMORPG is not supposed to be a playground for little real life loosers.

Fonline ist the first MMORPG I play, because I don´t have that much time for gaming that a commercial game would be reasonable (paying monthly), but I loved Fallout 1+2. As far as I have read it is the same in every other MMORPG, so Fonline maybe the last that I play too.
For Fonline thats not the big problem, as it is not commercial. WoW etc. are more sensitive to PK (as far as I know), as Blizzard don´t wants 80% of new players stopping playing (and paying) frustrated.

BUT, as far as I have read here the developers have big plans for the future of Fonline and a lot of good features will be senseless if this problem is not dealt with.
When everybody is just killing for fun and loot, maybe fighting to controll cities with their faction for even more loot and killing fun, then every other feature won´t be used, or cannot be used by players not interested in this, as long as the new feature don´t deals with new ways to kill people for the "lulz" and loot.

I think players should be allowed to behave anyway they feel in a free roam MMO. And for your information, some of the best and most successful MMO's are HIGHLY PVP based. Take guild wars, WOW, and Aion as examples. I think your main problem here is that you often get killed and it's pissing you off. Make some friends in game and get some back up - watch out for suspicious individuals. you make it sound like it's hard to enjoy this game, but I have had an awesome time playing this game. I don't mind getting killed and I love playing for lulz. This whole idea of robbing someone so they can get robbed again just spells abuse. You're basically scape goating miners to make this suggestion look useful - when in reality it's going to wipe out solo mining. I can tell you already, when I go HQ mining, I go in groups of 5-7. We take 2 sledges and everyone carries a little bit. so what if 1 person dies, but at least we aren't getting robbed over and over just so we get to keep our sledge hammers...

[Andr3aZ]

if we ever would have a robbing system it sure wouldnt work in any other map then a _random encounter_. As i stated before it would need much work and there are much difficulties.
Just some examples i tripped over when i thought this through:

1. Both players are freezed while "you are robbed bitch"-screen pops up. What if there are more then 2 players?
2. No screen pops up but it shows in chat window. victim just runs.
3. Make it only work while in combat mode. - Easy getaway for fights , just rob your friend with all that good stuff so he doesnt loose all.

As many of us stated now, it wont work unless there are other changes to the game that maybe is about killing and maybe bad karma from killing PCs etc. That would be a whole other discussion and there would be many yes and nos and lovers and haters too.


As for gorkser I can only offer help in the wasteland. We are a finnish/german faction that often helps newcomers and friendly guys in trouble without any asking for anything. Contact me here via PM or visit #TheGuardians @ irc.forestnet.org in IRC. As you are german you could get easy help from the kumpels if needed for basic things like hunting, escort for a profession or wasteland taxi drives

[gorkser]

@Andr3aZ
You are right of course with what you´ve said, but obstacles exist to be overcome.
If my suggestion will be considered again, when working on a karma system or whatever, then it was not useless.

But to answer to some of your points:
1. Why not have a pop up window for all players in these encounter?
Maybe like:
PoorBluesuit, infamous robber hotzenplotz tries to robb you blind. Do you surrender?
Maybe if PoorBluesuit has awarenessperk he sees hotzenplotzes HP, Weapon and armor.

3rd Player named Uninvolvedmysteriousstranger gets a pop up:
You stumple apon Hotzenplotz trying to rob PoorBluesuit.
Do you want to: 1. Leave them alone  2. Help Poorbluesuit   3. attack both of them  4. wait what´s happening and pick on the survivor.


I´ll write you a PM. But this suggestion is realy not about me. I´m 1000 points from level 7 and don´t see why I should not be able to achieve Level 15 or whatever. I appreciate your offer though and I sympathise with TheGuardians anyway.
It is just, that I would appreciate the game alot more, if it was more RPG and less 2,5D Shooter, full of teenager nerds out for the "lulz".
Of course there is a clash of interests.
It is not possible to satisfy every Fonline player to full extend. No matter if anything is changed, or just left the way it is.
I would also be happy if you don´t loose some(!) basic(!) tools and ressources.  Like flint, primitive tool, knife (1 piece), maybe also hatchet, sledgehammer.
This would speed up the game for new players a lot, as they don´t have to spend 30 minutes just to get a sledgehammer again. And I don´t think the "poor and underprivileged" PKs would start to cry because the cannot loot flint and primitive tools.
To the contrary, the next time a PK runs over a bluesuit, he will have gathered some ore, wood, fibers or whatever and not just regained a quite worthless tool.
Maybe he even crafted some ammo in the meantime.
So it would very soon increase the loot which can be obtained from the average bluesuit.

Robbing concept would realy improve things for those players who are aiming for maximum loot.
It´s better to loot someone with a full inventory after gathering&crafting, than do it before.

I sometimes even can laugh about PK killing me. Just recently I died and got killed soon after that again.
The second time I just had an shovel and 10caps in inventory. The PK needed to kill me in round based combat, needed 2shots from his flamer (also had a critical miss dropping the weapon).
His ammo used was worth more, than what he looted. I told him before he looted me (after killing me). He didn´t believed me first, saying 2 shots is just 50caps. But he was pissed when I said: I wish much fun with my shovel and 10caps.

[borse]

Listen, honestly I don't care who I run into, if he looks mean, I run. I DO NOT want to have to wait for him to decide to rob or kill me. It PUTS ALL THE POWER in the hands of the stronger player... this promotes blue suit killing.

If you don't like shooting in a game that is based on shooting (and sometimes CQC) thenn... read below.

Don't like it, don't play it.

^Developer

I´ll write you a PM. But this suggestion is realy not about me. I´m 1000 points from level 7 and don´t see why I should not be able to achieve Level 15 or whatever. I appreciate your offer though and I sympathise with TheGuardians anyway.
It is just, that I would appreciate the game alot more, if it was more RPG and less 2,5D Shooter, full of teenager nerds out for the "lulz".
Of course there is a clash of interests.
It is not possible to satisfy every Fonline player to full extend. No matter if anything is changed, or just left the way it is.
I would also be happy if you don´t loose some(!) basic(!) tools and ressources.  Like flint, primitive tool, knife (1 piece), maybe also hatchet, sledgehammer.
This would speed up the game for new players a lot, as they don´t have to spend 30 minutes just to get a sledgehammer again. And I don´t think the "poor and underprivileged" PKs would start to cry because the cannot loot flint and primitive tools.
To the contrary, the next time a PK runs over a bluesuit, he will have gathered some ore, wood, fibers or whatever and not just regained a quite worthless tool.
Maybe he even crafted some ammo in the meantime.
So it would very soon increase the loot which can be obtained from the average bluesuit.

Robbing concept would realy improve things for those players who are aiming for maximum loot.
It´s better to loot someone with a full inventory after gathering&crafting, than do it before.

I sometimes even can laugh about PK killing me. Just recently I died and got killed soon after that again.
The second time I just had an shovel and 10caps in inventory. The PK needed to kill me in round based combat, needed 2shots from his flamer (also had a critical miss dropping the weapon).
His ammo used was worth more, than what he looted. I told him before he looted me (after killing me). He didn´t believed me first, saying 2 shots is just 50caps. But he was pissed when I said: I wish much fun with my shovel and 10caps.

This is obviously all about you. Why else would you post paragrief after paragrief about getting killed at a low level and wanting to profit off of noobs (being able to rob them AGAIN and AGAIN). Pretty soon no noob is going to want to mine or gather because they know they'll be robbed of the fruits of their labor. This DOESN'T help new players, it actually just creates another scenario for which they can be fucked with. All noobs need is a helping hand for about 5 minutes, to show them how to play the game and to perhaps give them a few freebies. It doesn't take 30 minutes to get a sledgehammer, it takes about 3 minutes. Gather broc flower or xander root, make 2 weak healing powders, trade for sledge hammer at vendor... There just needs to be a better newbie guide out there, not an option for higher level players to take advantage of noobs.

And no, it's not possible to satisfy everyone Fonline player to the full extent... So why are you trying to get your way? Isn't that selfish?

If you cry about losing items when you die, you need to learn how to play this game better. I recently lost 10k in items because I was too close to a molerat... A molerat in the sights of a supermutants rocket launcher. He shot the molerole rat and the eplosion killed me outright. I said "Fuck" once out loud and continued on with my daily FOnline routine - a little more cautiously though.

Lastly, if you were to add robbing, the robbers would have to prompt the other party to be robbed. The other party should be allowed to run at any time and shouldn't be restricted to stay. Why should they? We've run from people with guns before, in fact it happens all day in FOnline. We run from marauders and other wastelanders... why should we be forced to be "robbed" because of some shitty new feature.
I think the purpose of a beta is to smooth out all the kinks and imperfections in the game from the point of view of the creators. Adding this will just be another gouge out of the framework.

[gorkser]

@borse

I think you get something wrong. The idea was not to hinder the weaker players from running. They could do so -just as now- if they simply click "no".
They idea was to give the PKs an alternative to killing, if their main goal is loot (not the lulz), while leaving the weaker charakter with a few basic items (if he has)
and in general it would speed up game for all sides.

I don´t see at wich point the concept Andr3aZ suggested (which I approve for its simplicity) harms the interest of any "interest group" that much.
There would only be a difference to actual system if in a specific encounter all involved Players choose to.

If the stronger player(s) don´t decide to "robb", everything will be the same as now.
If they decide to "robb" and the victim refuses to get robbed by clicking "no", then everything will be the same as now.

Ok, all players lost maybe 5 seconds time.


And no, I´m not getting killed all the time. If I die, then in most cases not by PKs.

[borse]

Honestly, I'd rather not have to press no every time I encounter another player. I'd rather just play the game. Basically, you're system just adds 5 seconds onto every players encounter with other players in the wastes. We already have cool downs to deal with we don't need to waste more time opting out of robberies. The way these prompting systems work, like trade, the sender doesn't see the prompt. So, he could easily prompt and kill while the player is selecting 'no'. It's pretty much just like internet spam and pop ups. I'm firm with my point of view. I don't like this idea at all. It'll further complicate and ruin the chemistry that this game has with its players.