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[TwistedIndoctrine]

Problem 1: Level 12 and 15's perks are no brainers - take life giver. There's really no choice AT ALL if you want to maximize your effectiveness, take those perks or you're gimping yourself

Problem 2: Occupying two perks slots with pre-defined  choices eliminates character customization which is important for both RPG's and MMO's in general. No brainer perks are an anathema to the ideal of customization.

Problem 3: Combat is too fast, in part due to low hit point levels compared to damage output.

Proposed Solution: Life giver, both ranks given for free at those levels, or at other levels. Thus freeing up more perks for actually player choices and customizations.

Considerations: if the perks are given earlier for free (say you get one rank of life giver at five and another at 7 for example) then hit points end up considerably higher thus throttling combat speed down effectively as a result (bluntly people need to shoot eachother more). The exact level they're aloted at can be tweaked at will by the developers until an ideal medium is met between combat pace and hit point values. Or if current status quo is desired then simply alot them for free at level 12 and 15 as they are now, without occupying character perk slots - the key is allowing more customization while removing the danger of new players ignorant of what are hands down the most effective scaling perks in the game period missing them.

If a perk is "Must have" due to its effectiveness it's no longer a perk so much as a requisite. It's boring having to pick the two perks at those two levels to max out your dude, and it doesn't have to be nor should it be absolutely damning if you do not. Removing the perks entirely is WAY too heavy handed a treatment as people barely live very long in combat as it is, with them; that would do nothing to address the problem of combat being just too fast paced for any real strategy at times. But leaving them in as they are seems counter intuitive to the fun of roleplaying games: customization and fun.


Thoughts?

[RavenousRat]

(40+28)/2=34 HP.
Just make each rank Lifegiver give 34 HP when take it.

[Ned Logan]

I think these perks should be removed and instead every char should have 40 more hp on the start, no matter what stats.
It would balance the builds a bit more, not speeding up the fights too.

[Surf]

If you give them out for free you can aswell just remove them - it would be the same.
So - bad idea. And I dont know where youve heard that these are must have perks. I only have one character with one lifegiver and I am fine with it.

[LeMark]

It is false, we take LifeGiver lvl 12, but not lvl 15, execpt for tank BG/ PLAMSMA REFLE / GRENADER.

[avv]

Oh we're wading through the thickest soup of imbalance here.

Basically the fact that choosing certain perks, stats and skills can make you significantly more powerful at fighting than someone who doesn't pick them is one of the biggest fails a multiplayer game can do. That's why in every multiplayer game where levels or unlocks exist, they only provide more options so that players can specialize in something they like most. It doesn't mean that they become more powerful for choosing all options geared towards their favourite playing style, their gameplay is just geared more towards that activity. For example a fps game could provide sniper-fan more scopes or rifles designed for differend ranges. A rts game would provide more defensive structure options for players that want to play more defensively.
 
Fonline obviously fails in this matter. We have it like this: player decides to become sniper. He becomes super powerful sniper that cannot do anything else.

[Killy]

Problem 3: Combat is too fast, in part due to low hit point levels compared to damage output.


Thoughts?

armors are shit ? no matter what u have on it doesnt help too much, devs want to balance weapon and at the same time they dont balance armors, bypasses, critical hits

[Hydro]

armors are shit ? no matter what u have on it doesnt help too much, devs want to balance weapon and at the same time they dont balance armors, bypasses, critical hits

Especially tesla/metal armor vs. laser rifle, yes they are shit

[Crazy]

Bypasses happen pretty often.

[Solar]

the same time they dont balance ... critical hits

Who said this? 

Bypasses are no problem ... DPS from a sniper is still below what a burst is capable of when you factor bypasses in 

Knockdowns/outs on the other hand...

[avv]

Who said this? 

Bypasses are no problem ... DPS from a sniper is still below what a burst is capable of when you factor bypasses in 

Knockdowns/outs on the other hand...

You know Solar dps in this game is a bit weird factor. That's because we have characters whose hp ammounts vary significantly. Secondly we got factors that can dramatically increase or decrease the dps. Someone can do 10 damage with a weapon which someone else deals 100 dmg. Most used weapons deal even so big damage in the first strike that there's no need to even discuss dps because the opponent is dead.

In fps games dps is easier to visualize when everyone has around the same hp and there are no perks like bonus ranged damage or living anatomy. Same with rts games.

[Killy]

Solar what are u talking about, dude u want to tell me that a laser rifle that uses 1 mfc per shoot ( laser is 500-700 caps) is  just a bit weaker than an avenger burst ( avenger 8k + 1 burst 300-500 caps depends if u buy ammo from players or craft urself )
game's mechanics is broken and u dont even get it, u have super expensive stuff that uses tons of ammo ( i mean im sick of gathering and crafting 5mm just to shoot a few times ) and that gun is 5-10% better than cheap laser rifle, all u need is a ew build ( ofcz its up to perks, critical hits and critical tabels, broken arms eyes, do u know that in turn base battle blue guy with bb gun can kill a guy with an avenger wearing  ca:bh, 1 broken arm and the guy is useless, then legs and thats it, no doc, nothing, the same during real time combat, if someone breaks ur arm with any kind of rifle ( sniper, laser, assault ) u can only use ur doc skill once, u will not be able to do it again b/c the battle will be already finished.


when u think about a gun think about everything, critical hits, breaking arms or eyes, price of the weapon, price of its ammo, how it works against cheap and expensive armors, there is so many factors
it all looks the same, u brought sneak back b/c u wanted remove town prewiev and creat a new scout proffesion, and again u didnt think about 100 other things that will be changed

[Surf]

You probably don't understand that these types of guns you mention are supposed to be more rare then usual Small Guns Stuff. Not everyone in Original Fallout was running around in Big Gunners Stuff. Thats why its more hard to craft. But I agree that Energy Weapons Stuff should be equal hard.

[Killy]

what i mean is u have the tree of guns and armors, some of them are really cheap like laser rifles ( 1 laser rifle is 700 caps max )
and u have weapons which uses almost 700 caps each time they shoot, HOW do u want to balance them and forget the pirce of the gun?

every sniper rifle is as good as critical tabels let it be, and no matter what u say, the expensive gun must be atealst 10 times better than the cheaper one, and dont forget full loot, u can lose laser rifles every day few times, try to do it with avengers and 5 mm ammo, people complain they say bad big guners they killed me and looted my 10 mm pistol, they dont know how much time and effort crafting all that stuff takes

[Haraldx]

Problem 3: Combat is too fast, in part due to low hit point levels compared to damage output.

Play TB... well, unless you want to TC. Anyway, I think it is good - all fallout shootouts are fast , not even looking at Fallout tactics. In Fallout tactics RT - ZOMG, THE SPEED! And its realistic, I don't think you can stand up being hit like with 60 bullets of minigun and then be hit in the eye by a sniper with high penetration and all would happen - you just fall off your feet and have some scars and scratches.

Back to topic - Hell no!!! Then, what is the use of this perk as a perk? If you want slower fights and all that, why don't we just increase the health of all players right at the start of char registration? Why don't we boost Llife giver, making it give more health? Your suggestion is absolutely faulty.