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[Solar]

Right, finished the (tedius) number crunching factoring in bypasses, critical damage modifiers, the right armour stats, the right ammo stats, AP cost, reload time etc.

You will do on average ...

... presuming you have 75% crit chance (not hard) better crits (you're a sniper, duh!) and you are shooting a 6 luck target (reasonably typical) who has Metal Mk II on him ...

+3.8% damage for Sniper Rifles!

As you approach 95% crit chance the damage becomes almost equal.


Other interesting bits:

vs CA Sniper will only do 78.3975% of the damage that a Laser will @ 75% crit chance vs luck 6 target.

Tesla still is a hard counter to Laser ... Sniper is +44% damage

[Pandemon]

So how would it be with new energy weapons and/or laser rework? 

[Solar]

Well, outside of intending to introduce the turbo plasma at some point, seems the rest are fine to me.

[Pandemon]

So there is no way to add any pulse/electrical ranged weapon? 

[baelzaron]

Straight damage comparison isn't fully justified because:

LR has 5 less range
LR requires 1 more STR
EW starts at a lower skill% then SG above 1 AGI (min/max +2%/-25%)
MFCs are more expensive/rare then .223
*EW shots have a "traceable animation"

[vilaz]

Straight damage comparison isn't fully justified because:

LR has 5 less range
LR requires 1 more STR
EW starts at a lower skill% then SG above 1 AGI (min/max +2%/-25%)
MFCs are more expensive/rare then .223
*EW shots have a "traceable animation"

Those are actually heavy arguments

Last two which makes laser rifles almost useless in PvP.

EDIT: ow yeah I wanted to suggest, some EW weapons thread merging or something ^^ this is a looooot out of topic

[Elmehdi]

Straight damage comparison isn't fully justified because:

LR has 5 less range
LR requires 1 more STR
EW starts at a lower skill% then SG above 1 AGI (min/max +2%/-25%)
MFCs are more expensive/rare then .223
*EW shots have a "traceable animation"

.. more:
223 ammo substracts 20 from AC of your target (which results in extra accuracy with sniper/hunting rifle = less skill needed),
Laser rifle + MFC is much heavier than sniper rifle + 223.

Well, personally I play only SG, but I agree that EW should get some boost. Maybe introducing turbo plasma rifle would do the job..

[Solar]

Very minor considerations indeed.

Laser rifle does more damage to every Armour type except Tesla (does less) and Metal Mk II (does about equal).

Weigh against this that it is slightly more difficult to hit with, where hitting is generally pretty easy for a decently made char and needs 1 more point in Str.

A worthwhile trade for +25% damage to CA? Of course.

EW are fine in comparison to SG.

[Midnight]

Laser Rifle ignore psycho an Toughness and do 49 base damages on critical bypass (multiplie by 3 to 8 for final critt dams).
So if the guy have a Tesla ok you are screwed (you still do 0-3) , your only way to do something is critical bypass, but for a sniper, don't think it's that hard ...
On the other hand, even with a x3 critical you kill almost anybody 147 dam for the worst crit in the torso, i'd really like to do so, even only once per 10 shot ...

Maybe laser sniper should simply not use Finesse to avoid the 100dr (but anyway bypass ignore finesse ...), and this is maybe why you have issues, since apparently players don't know how finesse work (Atom fixed the minds on another topic about that)

[Drakonis]

Laser Rifle ignore psycho an Toughness and do 49 base damages on critical bypass (multiplie by 3 to 8 for final critt dams).
So if the guy have a Tesla ok you are screwed (you still do 0-3) , your only way to do something is critical bypass, but for a sniper, don't think it's that hard ...
On the other hand, even with a x3 critical you kill almost anybody 147 dam for the worst crit in the torso, i'd really like to do so, even only once per 10 shot ...

Maybe laser sniper should simply not use Finesse to avoid the 100dr (but anyway bypass ignore finesse ...), and this is maybe why you have issues, since apparently players don't know how finesse work (Atom fixed the minds on another topic about that)

bypass does not ignore finesse

[Midnight]

Atom just said it on the sg balance thread and it's written here http://falloutmods.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_engine_calculations

So crits bypass armor AND finesse.

[Drakonis]

Atom just said it on the sg balance thread and it's written here http://falloutmods.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_engine_calculations

So crits bypass armor.

gimme a sec to check and verify. However i have tested this in game, so last time i checked every crit was dealing less damage, even bypass

[Midnight]

The only thing not ignored by bypass ar ammo modifier and DT (which is divided by 5 apparently) so that could make some slight differences toward base damages.

[Drakonis]

The only thing not ignored by bypass ar ammo modifier and DT (which is divided by 5 apparently) so that could make some slight differences toward base damages.

Strange I remember a thread about finesse(maybe on NMA forums)... It was stated there that it actually gives a 30% damage penalty but in FO not by adding DR to a target, but by simply reducing the damage. hmmm. I belive a dev said it too also. Atom can you confirm please?

[Solar]

Finesse is ignored when armour is bypassed.