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Author Topic: Steal Animation  (Read 5379 times)

Tin

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Re: Steal Animation
« Reply #30 on: July 16, 2011, 02:08:44 am »

Just to keep people on topic, the suggestion is regarding the actual point of having an animation of stealing, not the actual mechanics of the steal skill (beyond the animation). All of that is a totally different argument  :)
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SBBM

  • Amerikan
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Re: Steal Animation
« Reply #31 on: July 16, 2011, 02:57:40 am »

Why not remove the animation for the initial "inventory-check", but leave it for the actual stealing. I mean, why are you fondling someone to check their inventory, you aren't taking anything at that stage in the process.
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Re: Steal Animation
« Reply #32 on: July 16, 2011, 06:19:53 am »

The main problem with being a thief on this game is you are quit noticable with or without the animation because you stand out in such a small crowd and bluesuit/f6 shows you are another player getting a bit to friendly right next to somebody.
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Tin

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Re: Steal Animation
« Reply #33 on: July 16, 2011, 10:24:57 am »

Why not remove the animation for the initial "inventory-check", but leave it for the actual stealing. I mean, why are you fondling someone to check their inventory, you aren't taking anything at that stage in the process.

Yeah, but why show it for the steal? The whole point of a pickpocket is stealing without being noticed, if you have an animation then even if your successful then your noticed. You might get the item but you'll get a bullet in your head for the trouble.

The main problem with being a thief on this game is you are quit noticable with or without the animation because you stand out in such a small crowd and bluesuit/f6 shows you are another player getting a bit to friendly right next to somebody.

I think thats how having no animation would work best. Would no longer be run up, steal, run away. You could do stuff like chat to the person to distract them, walk past them slowly and steal etc
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Josh

  • The Armegeddon Arms Co. is temporarily on hiatus
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Re: Steal Animation
« Reply #34 on: July 18, 2011, 03:33:53 am »

That doesnt really hold up, because the way the game is with skills it already opens itself to alts for combat, barter etc. Also,in the second part, crafting has no combat purpose so soloists would suffer..... (I know it creates items but steal also acquires items, just in a different way)
From whats been said here and in chat, I think people are thinking along the lines of "I don't want to be stolen from" rather than what would actually fits the skill. Some people dont want to be shot but guns skills say otherwise!
1. Please don't compare the users of the useful skill of crafting equipment to the human garbage that steals their equipment. Thank You.
2. Combat is an integral part of the game, removing it would mean the nullifying of the majority of the gameplay. Getting stuff with no real effort on your part is not, and (imho) removing it would greatly improve gameplay as you wouldn't have to watch out for thieves all the time when crafting or bartering. If you can think of a reason it should stay other than "its more realistic" than please feel free to share it with the rest of us.
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jonny rust

  • Caravan Dan
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Re: Steal Animation
« Reply #35 on: July 18, 2011, 03:51:00 am »

1. Please don't compare the users of the useful skill of crafting equipment to the human garbage that steals their equipment. Thank You.
2. Combat is an integral part of the game, removing it would mean the nullifying of the majority of the gameplay. Getting stuff with no real effort on your part is not, and (imho) removing it would greatly improve gameplay as you wouldn't have to watch out for thieves all the time when crafting or bartering. If you can think of a reason it should stay other than "its more realistic" than please feel free to share it with the rest of us.

I don't like getting thieved anymore than the next guy but try to remember that "human garbage" is also an integral part of the fallout world. There is no place in the wasteland that is sacred and the sooner you develop a healthy sense of paranoia the better, and thats really the way it should be. I have dealt with thieves for a long time and weather or not the animation is there really won't make their job that much easier. If someone gets in your face you should move for reasons beyond just the risk of getting thieved anyway. Having said that, I am all for this suggestion from a purely logical standpoint, thats all I really need.

At the end of the day everyone playing this game is gambling, thats what really makes it fun imo. Everything you do has a certain amount of risk attached to it, and that risk keeps you on your feet and makes you a stronger player. So when you get annoyed at thieves remember that they are low risk players who don't want to put any chips on the table which generally means low gain for them in more ways than one.

However they are necessary. What is not necessary is the harassment they sometimes dish out, but that goes for any character class.

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Josh

  • The Armegeddon Arms Co. is temporarily on hiatus
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Re: Steal Animation
« Reply #36 on: July 18, 2011, 04:08:41 am »

<Insert "its not practical to move at all times" Counter>
What is not necessary is the harassment they sometimes dish out
I agree that this is the main problem. Perhaps a distinct animation and increased cooldown would be the best idea.
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When you hear people talking about the great leader of the Armeggedon Arms Co., there talking about me. On the flip side when you hear them laughing about the Plague who stood next to guard and died or something else like that, that would be my brother Ben.
Re: Steal Animation
« Reply #37 on: July 18, 2011, 04:34:24 am »

Just to keep people on topic, the suggestion is regarding the actual point of having an animation of stealing, not the actual mechanics of the steal skill (beyond the animation). All of that is a totally different argument  :)
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jonny rust

  • Caravan Dan
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Re: Steal Animation
« Reply #38 on: July 18, 2011, 05:08:18 am »

you can't suggest something like this and expect people not to debate weather or not it would effect the mechanics.

right now people respond to the animation, that makes it part of the mechanism.
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Re: Steal Animation
« Reply #39 on: July 18, 2011, 08:32:39 am »

i suggest kill animation but limit stealing making it available only from behind.
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Re: Steal Animation
« Reply #40 on: July 18, 2011, 12:25:52 pm »

2. Combat is an integral part of the game, removing it would mean the nullifying of the majority of the gameplay. Getting stuff with no real effort on your part is not, and (imho) removing it would greatly improve gameplay as you wouldn't have to watch out for thieves all the time when crafting or bartering. If you can think of a reason it should stay other than "its more realistic" than please feel free to share it with the rest of us.

Getting stuff without effort is possible without stealing too. So we shoudl remove PvP too than. It's rather easy to burst someone in a guarded town and have a friend take the loot. It's even easier in unguarded towns and mines. Not to mention setting traps or doing a distress call when entering someone's encounter.

What is not necessary is the harassment they sometimes dish out, but that goes for any character class.

Exactly. This weekend I got harassed by someone who refused to wait till I finished trading. He used the animation on me to get me to run. Unfortunately for him I was trading with my thief alt, so I was kind enough to return the favor ...

<Insert "its not practical to move at all times" Counter>I agree that this is the main problem. Perhaps a distinct animation and increased cooldown would be the best idea.

Stealing currently has a 30 seconds timer which resets with every item taken from someone's inventory. Having a unique animation only available once every 30 seconds will remove most of the grieving problem there is now.
If people can't grief with the animation, they'll find other ways to grief. Like pushing people out of the trader's range.

i suggest kill animation but limit stealing making it available only from behind.

That's rather ridiculous. It would make the pickpocket perk less interesting and it makes no sense. Why couldn't I steal from the side?
This will result in people having a friend standing behind them, a thief pushing the trading character away and standing behind him to steal. All in all not a change.


As I hardly visit NCR and when I do it's not for trading purposes, I don't understand much of the thieving problem.
I haven't seen any thieves in the Boneyard and hardly see them in SF, the Hub, Junktown or VC. In my experience you're more likely to get shot for loot in SF or VC courtyard than be stolen from those places.

Stealing is part of the game, whether people like it or not. In this game you need to be paranoid and trust no one. Which means being careful everywhere all the time. There's no need to to be careful or not to pay attention when trading.
However that doesn't justify the amount of people (thieves and other players alike) who use the animation to grief.
Change the animation and the amount of grieving will seriously reduce. Removing the animation won't have that effect as it will just mean people will walk up to others and stand next to damn. The target walks a way, the griever follows.
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jonny rust

  • Caravan Dan
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Re: Steal Animation
« Reply #41 on: July 18, 2011, 04:20:33 pm »

Which is why I don't believe that this animation, or lack of, will effect the amount of grief that thieving, or pretending to thieve, can already inflict.

Dealing with that kind of harassment really is a completely different topic.
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Re: Steal Animation
« Reply #42 on: July 19, 2011, 02:58:25 am »

I'm fine with it being removed IF you have a chance to detect when someone is just looking at your inventory and that makes them unprotected. I would say the % chance should be partially based on perception obviously. Should also help with people just trolling away by standing next to you without you have to check your inventory constantly to see if things have gone missing. I know that if someone was going through my shit in a world like Fonline I would probably burst them and it should be represented.
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Re: Steal Animation
« Reply #43 on: July 19, 2011, 04:28:23 am »

That's rather ridiculous. It would make the pickpocket perk less interesting and it makes no sense. Why couldn't I steal from the side?
This will result in people having a friend standing behind them, a thief pushing the trading character away and standing behind him to steal. All in all not a change.
As alternative there could be basic penalty(BP) like in front - 150%, front sides - 100%, back sides - 50%, back - 0%
and stealing should count: steal-BP*(PE of target)/10
or (i like it more): steal*(your AG)/10+50*(your LU-target LU)/10-BP*(PE of target)/10

Then kill animation on attempts and show animation only when fails.

Ofcourse it's just an idea, so any changes to this idea r welcomed
« Last Edit: July 19, 2011, 04:53:28 am by ASDu »
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jonny rust

  • Caravan Dan
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Re: Steal Animation
« Reply #44 on: July 19, 2011, 04:30:14 am »

I'm fine with it being removed IF you have a chance to detect when someone is just looking at your inventory and that makes them unprotected. I would say the % chance should be partially based on perception obviously. Should also help with people just trolling away by standing next to you without you have to check your inventory constantly to see if things have gone missing. I know that if someone was going through my shit in a world like Fonline I would probably burst them and it should be represented.

great idea! thieves generate lots of paranoia, make that process a risk for them!
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