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Mercenaries are an AWESOME feature.

Mercenaries are a pretty cool feature.

Eh.

I don't like mercenaries really...

Mercenaries can all go suck a brahmin tit.

[Michaelh139]

Alright, Mercenaries (Not slaves seeing as no one ever mentions them otherwise) are a very unique feature of 2238.  They allow a person with the correct stats to "hire" (buy them off these people who brainwash them into slaves!) to do your bidding combat-wise.  If you choose the correct type, they can practically use ANY WEAPON you give them.  This creates really interesting squad-creativity.  Although sadly most tend to either go with full on rocket or full on EW squads.  (Which I promise is not the most effective squad out there, although they have their purposes).

Merc vs merc squads are also extremely fun if you ever have the rarest chance to do it, seeing as only 1% of the playerbase even bothers with them unless they're dual-logging.

However, they aren't very smart, although their brutality/numbers generally make up for this, they tend to do dumb things like running after the enemies into a building with no aps to save themselves from the obvious 1hex bursts of death.  They also tend to get stuck for no apparent reason in areas and you have to (What I like to call) "Refresh" them to get em moving again.  (Thankfully however I am told this will be fixed in next update/wipe).  Depending on the weapons, they can easily cause friendly fire to anyone, and with rockets/grenades/anyexplosiveszzz, kill themselves.  

There is also the problem of Grid/spawn camping which frusturates the playerbase the most.  Where you spawn in with mercs set to auto attack, insta killing or practically causing someone to piss their pants from the extreme lightning attack.  Or leave mercs Riiiiiiight at the grid on auto kill to kill everyone who enters.

So the point to this thread is....  What do you think about mercenaries?

P.s. please explain why/whynot.

[runboy93]

I think Mercenaries are pretty useful at 2238, because mostly players are alone.
It's cheap (Depends) method to get guys to hunt/protect something.

[Surf]

They are ok for a change and I tend to use "Merc Leaders" in Singleplayergames very often, as for a multiplayergame on the other hand, where the factor "competition" kicks in, it's a  fail to have such strong mercenaries doing everything for the player in the game. It's an ok-ish feauture and I get why people like that - but not in a multiplayer game.

[avv]

Like said, grids and mercs just don't add up because there's too much abuse related when the two meet.
Having just one merc is fun because it's easier to keep control. When there's five mercs they might scatter all the hell over and then it's dumb to try to locate them behind walls because the leader doesn't have contours on them.

In the end the ammount of firepower one player can posess through mercs is rather over the edge. In my opinion skill should have the highest outcomes in pvp, however if someone happens to be in a big tc gang or farms alot caps he can just buy 5 rocketmercs and pwnish basically every individual player he encounters without even trying.

[JovankaB]

They aren't doing everything, the powerful ones cost a lot, leveling them takes ages and you can lose them in less than 30 seconds if you do a mistake:




Using them (or slaves) is the only way for people who like to play a balanced, multi-purpose character (charisma, outdoorsman, crafting professions) to have a chance against pure combat builds from big gangs, who get weapons from craft alts, get to battlefields in taxi alts and get healed with drugs made by doctor alts and are unable to do anything else except shooting.

There is already a mechanism limiting their number - dynamic prices (or the time you need to gather new slaves). If it was so great everyone would just spend half a million (and eventually more) for 5 big gun mercs. In the long run nobody can afford to play this way all the time.

Yes, one player against one player with 5 mercenaries has little chance, but shouldn't he? He wasn't the one who spent 30 - 400k on them and he isn't the one who risks losing whole "investment" with one bad move. And he isn't the one who is a lot weaker without them because he needs extra 5-8 SPECIAL points.

The only thing I would change is removing equipement of new mercenaries, so you would have to equip them by yourself.

[Badger]

I've got mixed feelings about mercs. I like them, but I don't like the fact that they exist as very expensive, one off protection. They're not something you keep with you for when you bum around the wastes, but instead they're instant purchasable fight winners. And as Jovanka pointed out, very easily lost. They're toys for the rich kids, and the ones that aren't will die pretty quickly (poor old dog mercs).

I guess I'd prefer all followers to be a permanent part of how you play, as you level them up, equip them and they respawn alongside you. I'd prefer it if every player was using all their available companion slots most of the time. Although I do think being able to have five followers in tow is too much for a PvP game. One, two or maybe three seems a lot more sane.

[Solar]

Then you should like post wipe.

[Haraldx]

Then you should like post wipe.

Oh god, now all the GMs and developers are talking about wipe!

[Ulrek]

I think the main problem with mercs is the fact that they can use rocket launchers. as far as PvP goes. that's the best long ranged squad you can get. since they just bombard the enemy.

A fight where LSW mercs are running around shooting people and being smart about it is still tough, but you can still just shoot them from close range easily. same with plasma mercs.

But all and all. i think slaves and mercs are an important feature, since they can be used to guard bases. and act like the companions you could get in fallout 1&2. so that CH builds are viable.

The only extreme nerf i would consider for them. is making a custom set of sprite packages. where the rocket launcher sprite is removed. rather then them using the normal player sprites, they use the custom non-launcher sprite.

-Ulrek-

[SIGISMUND]

We are better of wouthout mutants I hope they newer return it was a stupid idea in the first place to insert mutant mercs.

[Johnnybravo]

Yes, one player against one player with 5 mercenaries has little chance, but shouldn't he? He wasn't the one who spent 30 - 400k on them and he isn't the one who risks losing whole "investment" with one bad move. And he isn't the one who is a lot weaker without them because he needs extra 5-8 SPECIAL points.

This is why it needs to be changed ASAP, everyone things it is so righteous to spend thousands on stuff that gives absolute advantage.

[Swinglinered]

Perhaps a tradeoff for limiting merc numbers is to make better commands available with high CHA/Speech.

Also, give dogs Swift Learner (doubled if handler has Animal Friend perk- put it in), have more dog options, and maybe have a merc that is a dog handler.
That one maybe should take up 2 merc slots, since he has his own mercs.

I want to be able to independently target dogs in combat.

[Suupah]

Suck a brahmin tit

[A concerned wastelander]

Interesting feature, but so exploitable. Grids/spawns without previews camping and setting mercs to shoot anyone on sight. Poping from world map with mercs (mutants with RL) killing one or 2 player and leaving before ennemy can kill mercs, since mercs dont have combat timers of there own so they can leave even when attacked if leader dont have is combat timer on.

It was an interesting idea back when some players decided to put plenty of mercs in Gecko mine, claiming it as is own. But the way it worked was less interesting, anyone spawning would have is Fonline freeze, and would need to log off and back fast enough to survive the mercs attacks and then kill them or manage to run away, there was like 30-40 of them, so you were likely to be dead before loading was complete anyway.

[JovankaB]

This is why it needs to be changed ASAP, everyone things it is so righteous to spend thousands on stuff that gives absolute advantage.

As far as I know, everyone started this game with level 1 character and some junk in his/her pocket. If someone has advantage, he/she had to work for it. It's not Quake to play 20 minute matches with perfectly equal chances. At least not yet. But yea, rocket mercenaries are too powerful, they should have combat timeouts and so on to prevent obvious abuse.

The discussion is pointless anyway because we don't know about the changes after wipe and it seems like they were made already.