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Other => FOnline:2238 Forum => Archives => Suggestions => Topic started by: Izual on January 11, 2010, 10:13:31 am
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Edit by Izual : This suggestion is old and I thought somethings could be changed, like item multiplication replaced by an experience/reputation gain. But let's discuss about it, and I leave this post untouched.
Summary
If that suggestion is accepted, you'll be able to set up a caravan and to drive around the wasteland between two towns, making of your trip a safe-travel or a trading-trip. Everyone will notify your caravan and be able to enter it, to trade with you or... To attack you. Once the caravan is over, you arrive at your destination location safely - if not killed before, I mean. The whole thing, with a lot of details, is explained below. Let's start with the most important thing...
Why would I set up a caravan ?
- You can travel directly from your base to the tent or base of another character, friend of you.
- Your caravan cart has no weight limit, so you can transport lots of items in a single trip.
- No random encounter during this trip.
- It can be a good opportunity for you to trade with other people.
- At the end of your trip, all the items in your caravan cart (except caps) are multiplicated by 1.5 or 2.0 .
Why would I attack a caravan ?
- It can be a good challenge for you.
- You can loot the full caravan cart (by killing the caravan owner) and the caravan guards.
- It'd be a good PvP fight, if you like PvP fights of course.
How it works
Setting up a caravan
Let's make it with an example, it will be easier.
The Salvatores want to set up a goods caravan from their base to the Vault Rats base, located near Redding.
Starting point
To choose the starting point is easy : The Salvatores base, near New Reno (of course =p). So all the members of the Salvatores go into their base, with one member of the Vault Rats. Once the goods are in the caravan trunk, all that group arrows the caravan owner (The one that got the cart key). Then the caravan owner will "talk" to the caravan cart, which is already in the Salvatores base.
Destination point
Once everyone is ready, the caravan owner talks to the caravan cart. In fact, he clicks on his cart as usual, as if he wanted to leave with it. But now, the usual leaving is replaced by a little dialogue panel...
- [Leave with the cart]
- [Set up a caravan (Costs 10 water bags)]
- [Cancel]
Of course, here, we are interested with the second option. Once selected, the 10 water bags are removed from the owner's inventory. The caravan tells him that now, he will start a caravan with all the guys that arrowed him. And then, the caravan asks him where does he want to go. And THERE is the interesting point.
The caravan master, using the "say" box, can define one people that will point out on his own worldmap where the caravan has to go. So, in that case, the Salvatores caravan owner defines the Vault Robbers member, who will talk to the caravan cart and define a point on his worldmap (The Vault Robbers base). The location will be saved by the cart, and when the leader talks again to the cart, he will get a message like : "Your caravan destination is now "Scrapheap" ". It could be Necropolis, Golgotha, a Tent, the simple desert, The Depot, The Cave, etc. The caravan master confirms the destination location, and chooses a lenght.
Lenght of the travel
The caravan master will be able to choose between different lenght.
- 6 minutes : It's the minimum lenght, that guarantees quite a safe travel, since no big teams can gather their fighters in less than 6 minutes.
- 12 minutes : That travel lenght is a bit more dangerous, but when the cart reaches the destination location, all the items inside the trunk get multiplicated by 1.5 ...
- 20 minutes : That travel lenght make the caravan a dangerous operation, but when the cart reaches the destination location, all the items inside the trunk get multiplicated by 2.0 ...
- 40 minutes : Still a multiplication per 2.0 but that longest lenght is useful for the people that made a caravan only to trade with other people.
The multiplication rate is explained by the possible trades with NPC.
Once the destination point is chosen, all the caravan fellowmen arrowed on the caravan master and the lenght is chosen too, the caravan starts !
Travelling
From the caravan point of view
Once, the caravan is started, all the caravan guards, the caravan cart and the caravan master are teleported to a desert area between New Reno and Redding (Following our example with The Salvatores and Vault Robbers). They won't move until the lenght of the travel reaches 0. Their only goal during those 6, 12, 20 or 40 minutes is to trade or protect the caravan master, that has got the trunk key.
From everyone's point of view
Once the caravan starts, a countdown similar to the Town Control one appears.
(http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/8745/caravantext.jpg)
The destination and starting areas are selected easily. Around New Reno is a border, if the Salvatores base is inside this border, they belong to New Reno area and the message will display "Starting from New Reno...". Same for the destination area.
From now, the fighters can gather themselves, and the traders reach the caravan location.
Getting inside the caravan's location
On the worldmap, a long location will appear (here, in blue), randomly chosen, between Redding and New Reno.
(http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/7762/caravanlocation.jpg)
Clicking anywhere on this location (while above, of course) will lead you to enter to the caravan's location. So traders can enter it to trade, fighters can enter it to attack the caravan and trying to get the key of the car trunk, etc.
Travelling end
When the countdown reaches 0, the caravan cart, the caravan master and his initial followers, if they are still on the map (even dead, but not respawned yet), are teleported to the destination location, the items gets multiplicated (If lenght >6 minutes) and that blue path on the map disappears.
That's all.
Conclusion
Well, as a conclusion... This caravan idea would make the trade between players possible, and also make the raiders a reality. Crafters, traders, roleplayers, fighters, everyone has a good reason to like it ! =) (Except Xoen, because he hasn't found his cow yet).
I think I forgot nothing, hmm, well, I'll answer your questions and so on.
Help the wasteland... Help the caravans !
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This looks like an interesting gameplay mechanic. I vote for it :).
P.S. But you will have to give me my fokin cow first.
(http://netlor.ru/upload/postdata/2009/march/korovan.jpg)
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HM! This can be good source of loot/cash for lockpickers... oh yeah! Caravan full of stuff, even guarded by players, can be easy target. Just need few players to attack your caravan and some fast evil-smiling lockpicker. When you fight, i take your caravan with all inside ;D
But this multiply thing + unlimited weight of trunk isn't good idea imho - it will be abused easily by bigger gangs / players which plays when server is empty. If we multiply items, we will see minuguns everywhere, just like before wipe and economy changes. Let's leave weight as it is now, and maybe make option to lead more carts (2/3?).
**running to workbench and starts crafting lockpicks**
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I like the idea. There is currently only a little sense in making caravans trip. There should be a prize for making them. I vote for yes!:)
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Hmm, yeah, but abusing that feature could be hard. Even the biggest gangs haven't tons of minigun, and multiplication - if the travel is a success, I mean - is only 1.5 . Buti t has to be discussed of course.
Plus, setting up a caravan would have a cost. Here, I just said 10 waterbags, but it can be 50, or costs caps.
For the lockpickers, yeah, why not. It can be a good opportunity, but it may be easier to kill the caravan master and stealing his key. In my opninion, players will be scared enough of lockpickers to guard the cart heavily and not letting anyone coming close of it. They can even stand right on the hex needed to lockpick the cart. And making a good diversion isn't that easy, but, once again, it's another possibility. So, good point.
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Hmm, yeah, but abusing that feature could be hard. Even the biggest gangs haven't tons of minigun, and multiplication - if the travel is a success, I mean - is only 1.5 . Buti t has to be discussed of course.
Plus, setting up a caravan would have a cost. Here, I just said 10 waterbags, but it can be 50, or costs caps.
Meh just put there 300 miniguns and 100 combat armours... and pufff... 150 minis and 50 combat armours for little effort in no time (comparing to crafting cooldowns).
About those items which would be multiplied - its focking all way long from point A to B? Or what? Magically spawned from nothing? Its bad idea and if you know players you would expect that they would hardly exploit such feature (i.e. putting those 300 minis and 100 CA, and guarding it with 50+ people, so no one would be able to take caravan down).
Btw. I dont like idea of transporting goods from one player base to another.
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HM! This can be good source of loot/cash for lockpickers... oh yeah! Caravan full of stuff, even guarded by players, can be easy target. Just need few players to attack your caravan and some fast evil-smiling lockpicker. When you fight, i take your caravan with all inside ;D
:D
But this multiply thing + unlimited weight of trunk isn't good idea imho - it will be abused easily by bigger gangs / players which plays when server is empty. If we multiply items, we will see minuguns everywhere, just like before wipe and economy changes. Let's leave weight as it is now, and maybe make option to lead more carts (2/3?).
It's already too easy to get miniguns from caravans compared to crafting - 1 minute for 4 miniguns from a caravan, 3 hour cooldown to craft 1 minigun (+ using mats). Crafting and PvE loot needs to be rebalanced a lot.
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its great idea and hope in will be in game fast :)
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its great idea and hope in will be in game fast :)
I hope that it will go where it supposed to be: "cafe of broken dreams" ;)
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I hope that it will go where it supposed to be: "cafe of broken dreams" ;)
Because of this?
Btw. I dont like idea of transporting goods from one player base to another.
I'd have to agree with you on this point.
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Meh just put there 300 miniguns and 100 combat armours... and pufff... 150 minis and 50 combat armours for little effort in no time (comparing to crafting cooldowns).
Well, absolutely no gang has 300 miniguns and 100 combat armors, and you pretty know it. Screenshot or it doesn't happen =P Gangs have, at the maximum, 50 of each.
And even if it was the case, you say they just have to make a good defence with 50 players. I'd firstly say no defence is perfect, and there's always a way to get in it - for example, I personnally fought a lot on TLA to takeover SAD guarded by 50 evil russians, and there's always a way, really - but then, what. They are 50, and they win 25 miniguns ? So what, 5 for each gang ?...Tremendous ! And there is always the risk to lose everything. And setting up caravans costs a bit. That's what I wanted to say.
Btw. I dont like idea of transporting goods from one player base to another.
I really don't see why. It improves interactions between players. Any argument ?
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Well, absolutely no gang has 300 miniguns and 100 combat armors, and you pretty know it. Screenshot or it doesn't happen =P Gangs have, at the maximum, 50 of each.
And even if it was the case, you say they just have to make a good defence with 50 players. I'd firstly say no defence is perfect, and there's always a way to get in it - for example, I personnally fought a lot on TLA to takeover SAD guarded by 50 evil russians, and there's always a way, really - but then, what. They are 50, and they win 25 miniguns ? So what, 5 for each gang ?...Tremendous ! And there is always the risk to lose everything. And setting up caravans costs a bit. That's what I wanted to say.
If such feature would be implemented (which is not going to happen, I bet my left hand on it... eeer... devs you like my left hand? right? ;)) there would be more than we could imagine. Making an example from TLA is totally missed. TLA has completely different economic (eaaaasy to obtain hight tech stuff), combat (ooouch... Im gonna do another coffee before my ap will regenerate) and playerbase (Hi! Im centaur 13!... Nice to meet you! Im centaur 576!)...
I really don't see why. It improves interactions between players. Any argument ?
Yup - only one: Doesnt a group of players (lets call them gang, which is not correct from mechanics point of view) can have more than one base? That would really improve interactions between them ;)
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I disagree, to takeover Sierra is the same thing (speaking of base strategy) on TLA and on 2238. But that was only an example. I just said there's no way to defend a place perfectly, and I'm sure you agree =p
I didn't understand your argument for bases =/ My english skill's bad, I guess.
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I disagree, to takeover Sierra is the same thing (speaking of base strategy) on TLA and on 2238. But that was only an example. I just said there's no way to defend a place perfectly, and I'm sure you agree =p
There is no strategy at Sierra which could beat numbers... And Im sure that you will agree...
I didn't understand your argument for bases =/ My english skill's bad, I guess.
Lets say there is group of players... let name them... hmmm... "Cajuns". They want to have more than one base... Its possible? And considering your idea... it would be possible to transport "goods" from CajunsA to CajunsB?
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There is no strategy at Sierra which could beat numbers... And Im sure that you will agree...
I got two. The first one works with bombs. The other one, I participated in it in person in late August 2009 : 40 players were guarding SAD, around the entrance grid (CA, Rocket Launcher, all that stuff). We were approximately the same number. As I remember, 15 entered the main entrance, and got shot. The rest spawned using a car, in SAD's parking. At the other map's edge. And we won. So there's always a way ;p
For the Base to Base thing :
It's already possible without taking risks. My suggestion would add an optional feature that would put risk into that operation.
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I got two. The first one works with bombs. The other one, I participated in it in person in late August 2009 : 40 players were guarding SAD, around the entrance grid (CA, Rocket Launcher, all that stuff). We were approximately the same number. As I remember, 15 entered the main entrance, and got shot. The rest spawned using a car, in SAD's parking. At the other map's edge. And we won. So there's always a way ;p
There is no strategy at Sierra which could beat numbers... And Im sure that you will agree when you will read with understanding (there is little clue for you though;))...
For the Base to Base thing :
It's already possible without taking risks. My suggestion would add an optional feature that would put risk into that operation.
From my FOV that would only bring huge benefits with almost no risk... So I really dont see any sense in this (:
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Well, I guess I'll have to discuss of this with open people.
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I think it's a good, well described idea, but item multiplying will be indeed heavily abused.
How about other benefits, like activating experience points for both participants of player encounters?
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I don't know if experience points would be really relevant.
I was discussing with Mr Perriack yesterday and I told him that if multiplicating was abused, it has to be balanced, so maybe x1.1 would be better =p
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Well, items don't just pop out of cruising and shooting around, but travelling and combat experience does, IMHO.
But you could get a better chance of stumbling on better loot of travellers killed in random encounters. That would be more realistic than mysteriosly appearing items.
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I, for one, would gladly welcome this new caravan system. Nevertheless, the profit should be determined by distance covered. I mean you shouldn't get 2x more stuff for transporting goods from Rot Gut Base (1 square West of Redding) to Rat God Base (1 square East of Redding). But then again, if those Rat Gods were seated around boneyard, 2.5x more stuff doesn't sound that bad. Oh, and making "caravan hours" would be necessary too - I mean, I could sacrifice 4 hours of sleep to transport 3000 .223 and 5000 5mm across the known world at 4AM to get a 150% profit. I hope you get my drift ;D
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Bringing up the oldies back... Its really interesting, but Id modify the idea:
1) specified routes (not free-based ones, somewhere near Glow, where nobody cares) simply from Town to Town or Town - smaller location
2) caravans would be available during peak time
3) caravans would be available for max 5 people per cart. max 2 carts so that 1 party could stand a chance to win
4) cart has definite space (not to abuse the system)
5) available caravan info would be displayed similarly like the TC with some countdown (with info about the cart no. 1 or 2)
6) countdowns should be longer 15mins for 30% 25mins for 50% something like that OR what would be even better - caravan would get reward appropriate to the caravan trunk (based on caps value (some formula needed) would provide different rewards)
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i love idea :) would like to see that included in game... but ammo... if theres 3000 of cheap .45 caliber, and everytime you do a trip, it gets more, later you can just go and sell it all.
maybe put a cooldown for caravans?
3000 4.5 Cal x 1.5 = 4500 x 1.5 = 6750 x 1.5 = 10125, etc etc etc, it always get doubled a bit. i guess there should be special change for ammo, so it have much much smaller doubling procent.
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Do you really believe, that someone will be dumb enough to set caravans to trade? :D It makes no sense... why would you wait with your valuable stuff for tons of PKs? ;D
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Do you really believe, that someone will be dumb enough to set caravans to trade? :D It makes no sense... why would you wait with your valuable stuff for tons of PKs? ;D
RP? PvP? Oh wait, having many items is much better than having fun, I forgot.
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RP? PvP? Oh wait, having many items is much better than having fun, I forgot.
surely it is good feature for PvP, as there will be more instances than just TC... but PvP and trading and RolePlaying are different things... I am a trader in-game, and I would love to be able to trade to players while traveling with caravans, but we both know it is just a dream, it is impossible because of PKs, suicide bombers, and so on... I love role-playing, but I dont like playing a dead corpse...
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surely it is good feature for PvP, as there will be more instances than just TC... but PvP and trading and RolePlaying are different things... I am a trader in-game, and I would love to be able to trade to players while traveling with caravans, but we both know it is just a dream, it is impossible because of PKs, suicide bombers, and so on... I love role-playing, but I dont like playing a dead corpse...
That happens if you go alone with your level 3 char. Take a few high level guards with you (a caran should have those) and defend your stuff.
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well thats the problem I see in this suggestion... the whole caravan feature will be usable only for players who are doing PvP and have powerbuilds dedicated to this cause... its nothing what could help crafters and traders... the only people who will profit from this are alters... they will craft equipment with crafting alts and then transport it with PvP builded chars...
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That happens if you go alone with your level 3 char. Take a few high level guards with you (a caran should have those) and defend your stuff.
Funny thing... What if the gaurds betrayed you? :-X
Anyways I love the idea, but its true that the trading part... would be kind of impossible. Pkers will raid these caravans with 20 fold powerbuilds and 5-10 powerbuild gaurds wouldn't stand a chance obviously, dur de durp.
What about outdoorsman alts? 300% outdoor leading caravan across map in 1 minute instead of 40 :o.
You forgot motorized cars man awww...
Needs some reworking but I see SOME potential.
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There should be a speed limit of course because you have all the carts to carry. Besides it would be great if caravans could be only seen by people who are nearby.
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Well, absolutely no gang has 300 miniguns and 100 combat armors, and you pretty know it. Screenshot or it doesn't happen =P Gangs have, at the maximum, 50 of each.
As a single force I have 40+ brotherhood armors, around 60 miniguns and avengers and HQ materials enough to double that amount.
Hence the rewards are way too high and the likeliness of players appearing to engage a caravan in fight at nightly hours is near zero, I'm going to have to say no to this idea ;)
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As a single force I have 40+ brotherhood armors, around 60 miniguns and avengers and HQ materials enough to double that amount.
Hence the rewards are way too high and the likeliness of players appearing to engage a caravan in fight at nightly hours is near zero, I'm going to have to say no to this idea ;)
Thats whz I suggested the following:
1) specified routes (not free-based ones, somewhere near Glow, where nobody cares) simply from Town to Town or Town - smaller location
2) caravans would be available during peak time
3) caravans would be available for max 5 people per cart. max 2 carts so that 1 party could stand a chance to win
4) cart has definite space (not to abuse the system)
5) available caravan info would be displayed similarly like the TC with some countdown (with info about the cart no. 1 or 2)
6) countdowns should be longer 15mins for 30% 25mins for 50% something like that OR what would be even better - caravan would get reward appropriate to the caravan trunk (based on caps value (some formula needed) would provide different rewards)
7) travel speed issue - I think Izual meant that the speed wouldnt depend on the player... he proposed route times that means that the actual travel would be automated or decreased to such a degree that youd really need such time (min 6 min as in 1st post) to reach the destination
As for me, the caravan should settle somewhere on the line and do something to activate the countdown. And yes, its worth it. The trunk size would reduce abusing and yes it would be risky to attack it. Well its PvP suggestion but what would you rather like brahmin driven caravans or what :p
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There should be a speed limit of course because you have all the carts to carry. Besides it would be great if caravans could be only seen by people who are nearby.
deffinately that! it would suck if whole world can see where you move.
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deffinately that! it would suck if whole world can see where you move.
Lol. Thats the point! Youre not getting something for free. Its rather something for experienced players not like a lvl 1 party... You risk your items for sake of multiplication of them OR some reward for defending them... plus you get the loot of other players...
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so, practically, rogues would get a fuckload of free items, being the biggest gang out there, they are the biggest still...
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so, practically, rogues would get a fuckload of free items, being the biggest gang out there, they are the biggest still...
they already get a fuckload of free items by just going out in zerg swarms and raping everything anywhere.
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they already get a fuckload of free items by just going out in zerg swarms and raping everything anywhere.
so, practically, rogues would get a fuckload of free items, being the biggest gang out there, they are the biggest still...
thats why I wrote:
3) caravans would be available for max 5 people per cart. max 2 carts so that 1 party could stand a chance to win
Of course if its possible to restrict
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thats why I wrote:
Of course if its possible to restrict
I was just saying it doesn't matter if they get alot of free items because they got more than they could burn off in a year of constant raping, even in ncr.
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I was just saying it doesn't matter if they get alot of free items because they got more than they could burn off in a year of constant raping, even in ncr.
Hm, well as Izual said caps could get multiplied and never enough of caps. Well if they would like to burn or risk items/caps in such way everyone who would beat them in caravan fight would benefit and game would benefit from more action in-game :p
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Hm, well as Izual said caps could get multiplied and never enough of caps. Well if they would like to burn or risk items/caps in such way everyone who would beat them in caravan fight would benefit and game would benefit from more action in-game :p
minimum half of the player can not, cause there not high equipped drug users or in a big PVP or well organisazed gang.
Otherwise i like the idea, except multiplying. I see allready more traffic at night then on highway to hell :P. YEs you need a reason for caravan travelling but this is a very very bad one and one who dont come form the game itself, its just "magic".Hmh in reality there is no reason for doing caravan trading or trading for players between cities at all. i see the picture before me, you make a long caravan ride,, gettin at ncr and got bombed by the jerks there, youre hole stuff is gone and we have another thread full with complaints here. No no, you need real reason, and with this system only transport from faction base A to faction base b or to geting magically an half Brotherhood armor out of the caravan brahmins ass :P. Some suggestions:
-- restrict the seize of caravans to 2-3 brahmin cars with maximum 10-15 people and some npc
-- make it slow, very slow and not depening on outdoorskill
--Let the attacker see wiht high outdoorskill what expecting him inside the caravan, so you can avoid another sort of caravan traps with some powerbuilds who travel around and mix up mid skill wannaberaiders :P. also for allied gangs etc, would be nice ;)maybe single trader can also avoid encs with his outdoorskill-> more humans on caravan, more decectable it should be.
--no multiplying but safe cities to trade for the long travelled merchants. maybe VC, boneyard, NCR,San fran. Maybe we got not enough players for this free-willl-trade system, dont know. you also can make only good secured market place in the cities and let the rest on the prestep of civilization.make some oasis maybe :P , and let cities make some sort of specific good they need and paying good prices for it. Maybe NCR need lots of munition for their growing army, san fran of medical suplies fortheir high radiation of the sunken chinsese submarine, VC need technical stuff to keep their city going. Yeah there will be abuse, but everything need some stimulation :P. Just let them buy stuff from caravans maybe a specials trader npc
--make it usable for stand alone player. let them hire human or npcs mercs to defend their stuff. for the human Mercs, make it also possible that they can be hired by NPC carvans, whos goin from city a to b , and cut the rest of the caravan encounters. reward should be caps, or if you making 20 rides with the same caravan the daughter (or son :P) of the merchant chief and a solar enchancer :D
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-- restrict the seize of caravans to 2-3 brahmin cars with maximum 10-15 people and some npc
-- make it slow, very slow and not depening on outdoorskill
--Let the attacker see wiht high outdoorskill what expecting him inside the caravan, so you can avoid another sort of caravan traps with some powerbuilds who travel around and mix up mid skill wannaberaiders :P. also for allied gangs etc, would be nice ;)maybe single trader can also avoid encs with his outdoorskill-> more humans on caravan, more decectable it should be.
1) I don't think a restriction would work. If you leave the caravan open to attacks, who's to say that they don't just have 30 of their friends 'attack' and really just stay as guards
2) I think 10-40 minutes is pretty damn long.
3) Just allow preview for these caravans.
4) If we want to prevent serious abuse with the multiplication, why not just put some kind of weight limit? I mean if you could take 20 miniguns and 10,000 ammo, I think earning 10 guns and 5k ammo is pretty reasonable.
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Why not let barter skill affect the multiplication amount of items?
Lets say your barter skilll is below 125% you will lose a small percentage of items.
If your skill is between 125-150% it will stay the same.
If your skill is above 150% you will gain items.
Obviously being a non combat char he would also have to buy mercs.
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Why not let barter skill affect the multiplication amount of items?
Lets say your barter skilll is below 125% you will lose a small percentage of items.
If your skill is between 125-150% it will stay the same.
If your skill is above 150% you will gain items.
Obviously being a non combat char he would also have to buy mercs.
I dont like the barter req, because of more alting... :-\
I think this should be max 5 player option (counting mercs and so on) - for bigger actions we have TC. Well if its possible to use some other mechanism, like it would all be available through caravan masters:
1) group of people or 1 person with 4 mercs takes a caravan quest from a caravan master. He gets the destination and so on. He travels through the worldmap.
2) caravan info is displayed like TC - "Valuable goods will arrive to NCR. Hurry! Speak to robbers leader in NCR" (etc. for every caravan master there should be robber leader whatever to give counter quests to kill caravan.)
3) the said caravan travells without encounters until a human counter encounter sent by robber leader spawns the 2 groups on a map. The caravan for the time of the fight is blocked, meaning that no other people can join to the fight from the robber leader.
4) if the caravan destroys the enemies, the quest from robber leader gets available again, if not the countdown stops and of course the quest is unavailable
5) caravan cant be affected by outdoorsman - why? - No alt spawning - equal chances - the time is fixed lets say 10, 15, 20 minutes for multiplication or some prizes depending on the item worth
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3) the said caravan travells without encounters until a human counter encounter sent by robber leader spawns the 2 groups on a map. The caravan for the time of the fight is blocked, meaning that no other people can join to the fight from the robber leader.
Why not make it where the only place you can get the quest is to join the Raider's faction?
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Why not make it where the only place you can get the quest is to join the Raider's faction?
Could be why not. Something to be proud of being a raider rather than just acquiring lvl 3 SG and leaving raiders. Sounds good.
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well generally it's a good idea, but should be developed some more.
but in fact, item multiplication is a bad idea, cos it'll affect world's economics too much making items like minigun n battle armor absolutely on everyone.
but multiplying some limited amount of caps would sound better immo.
for example there can be three types of caravan :
small one witch cost 5000caps and some waterbags. It's unnoticable on wordmap, but can be detected by anyone with 220+ outdoorsman, has short route (for example from NR to BH or from SF to NR).
medium one costs 20000caps n many waterbags. can be detected by anyone with 160+ outdorsman n have medium routes (from gecko to ncr or something)
big one cost 50k n loots of waterbags, can be detected by 100+ outdorsman chars n have long range routes (sf to vc or gecko)
after moving caravan to destination point your caps get multiplied depending on ur barter skill. for more roleplaying purposes caps in chart can be converted into some sort of goods, depending on the city u start caravan from, wich some sort of npcs can turn back into caps after u get to the destination point.
Or even deeper, each town get some goods, n trade between other towns n players are involved in these process. If u bring the needed goods from needed city u'll get more reward.
n ofcourse such trips should have kinda big cooldown, n requirements.
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I'm not sure how to tell you this.
+1
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but in fact, item multiplication is a bad idea, cos it'll affect world's economics too much making items like minigun n battle armor absolutely on everyone.
It needs to be balanced. I think the max should be +25% or 50%
but multiplying some limited amount of caps would sound better immo.
Not really. Spawning only caps would increase inflation. Big factions would have even more money. And what would you need a cow for if caps weight 0?
for example there can be three types of caravan :
small one witch cost 5000caps and some waterbags. It's unnoticable on wordmap, but can be detected by anyone with 220+ outdoorsman, has short route (for example from NR to BH or from SF to NR).
medium one costs 20000caps n many waterbags. can be detected by anyone with 160+ outdorsman n have medium routes (from gecko to ncr or something)
big one cost 50k n loots of waterbags, can be detected by 100+ outdorsman chars n have long range routes (sf to vc or gecko)
after moving caravan to destination point your caps get multiplied depending on ur barter skill.
outdoorsman skill lol. Hardly anyone has over 100. Anyway, I see youd like it to be like a risk-free quest, which is not. I mean, it could be a quest... but it misses the point. If someone would decide for easiest option it wouldnt be detectable at all... and the party that obtained caravan would simply wait without any fight. I somehow like the barter skil although I dont know how it could be evaluated (party's barter skill or the highest barter skill :P Hey it could even be gambling lol) If the second (the person with highest barter)...naaaaaaah... some people would just create alts with 300% barter... this is not the point lol
for more roleplaying purposes caps in chart can be converted into some sort of goods, depending on the city u start caravan from, wich some sort of npcs can turn back into caps after u get to the destination point.
Or even deeper, each town get some goods, n trade between other towns n players are involved in these process. If u bring the needed goods from needed city u'll get more reward.
Again you think of a quest? Like transport drugs from New Reno to Redding etc? This is a topic for another, closely related, idea.
n ofcourse such trips should have kinda big cooldown, n requirements.
Yep, fully agreed once in 3 days or sth :p
But Id rather go with max 5 or even 3 people caravan and quest obtained from NPC. "Caravan" would be small party PvP
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I see someone revived my old suggestion :)
As I said, this suggestion was written... Long ago, really. It needs more work, and you're on the good tracks for that, so thanks for your interest. However, I don't think this suggestion is valuable anymore, because the whole problem of powerbuilds/zerg swarm/kill-for-lulz has to be solved before. When gangs that play the raiders will have the drawbacks of raiders, and when the gangs that play the Rangers will have the advantages of Rangers (that's a raw sum up, of course), then I think we will be able to talk about this suggestion again. ;p
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Actually from mine topic about merchant guilds some of questions about balance of rewards and crafting were solved there I think. About powerbuilds- nerfing drugs should be the most important thing
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Nerf drugs, give advantage to good-sided gangs, drawbacks to evil-sided gangs (since evil have already advantages and good already drawbacks), and finally divide available ammunition amount per two :)
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I see someone revived my old suggestion :)
As I said, this suggestion was written... Long ago, really. It needs more work, and you're on the good tracks for that, so thanks for your interest. However, I don't think this suggestion is valuable anymore, because the whole problem of powerbuilds/zerg swarm/kill-for-lulz has to be solved before. When gangs that play the raiders will have the drawbacks of raiders, and when the gangs that play the Rangers will have the advantages of Rangers (that's a raw sum up, of course), then I think we will be able to talk about this suggestion again. ;p
It was at the last tab of opened suggestions hehe... Well about factions, its was Michaelh139's idea, that I didnt necessarily wanted to be as other NPC factions arent so sophisticated. Anyway I think there could be a chance to have something like this, some small size PvP - 3 or 5 people (option to choose from NPC - caravan master or bandit leader) and it could work rather via NPCs not solely like a real caravan as there wouldnt be any limit of attackers. There are many powerbuilds so they could be better than the attacking party but thats why drugs need to be nerfed down and the chances would be pretty equal (maybe there should be requirement of some non combat skill or SPECIAL to activate caravan meaning more chances to attackers)
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This suggestion is great. One of the best so far. But I think, that some points should be changed this way:
1. You start a caravan with maximum of 5 people, without of any NPC guards. If you want to have some kind of militia inside, then you should travel with a caravan to the closest city and hire a guards there. This travel takes 6 minutes and give no loot multiplication, but it still could be attacked by anyone (As an optional point, that city should belong to the faction, which started a caravan to be able to hire a guards - this will make a connection between TC and caravans)
2. You can't send a distress signal while on the caravan
3. You can only enter to the caravan once with one character (this is to resist those bluesuits, which are always entering caravans to waste an ammo of people inside)
4. I see, that almost everyone here are scared of that "miniguns multiplication". Here is the decision - weapons are not multiplied when the travel are finished, but armors and ammo still should be multiplicated.
I'd love to see that suggestion implemented with all those corrections.
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1. You start a caravan with maximum of 5 people, without of any NPC guards. If you want to have some kind of militia inside, then you should travel with a caravan to the closest city and hire a guards there. This travel takes 6 minutes and give no loot multiplication, but it still could be attacked by anyone (As an optional point, that city should belong to the faction, which started a caravan to be able to hire a guards - this will make a connection between TC and caravans)
I dont know...I think this should be 5 NPC limit. so lets say 5 people will be all CH builds and take 5 mercs each making it 25 NPCs. And if youd like the caravan to be open and visible on the map I guess there wont be any attacker size restriction... and in the outcome no one will participate... I guess the only way it to be balanced is to be available through some NPC (caravan leader, robber leader) so as to block more attacker if they are already attacking.
3. You can only enter to the caravan once with one character (this is to resist those bluesuits, which are always entering caravans to waste an ammo of people inside)
I guess this is not needed... if somebody wishes to die, let him/her die. Anyway caravan should be ready for such attack OR this could be done by simply doing it through NPC - he will not allow 1 person to enter 5vs5 fight, simple. But he/she could enter 1 + 4 mercs why not :)
4. I see, that almost everyone here are scared of that "miniguns multiplication". Here is the decision - weapons are not multiplied when the travel are finished, but armors and ammo still should be multiplicated.
Id go further than that. No lvl 3 stuff. Caps up to 30 000 ? And there could be level caps like 1-15 and 15-21 so like 2 types. The first would cost less