fodev.net
Other => FOnline:2238 Forum => Archives => Closed suggestions => Topic started by: cerberix on December 27, 2009, 11:35:04 am
-
Hello everyone.
I want to admin remove "crafting time", because it only lengthens the game and upset. What is it? Wait 2 minutes to make metal parts! " M glad that gatherning been halved but that "crafting time" is even worse! Please take this unnecessary and can be added extras ", which will only worsen this game.
Thanks.
-
The time for crafting items is the same as before. Gathering timeout has been lowered and crafting timeout raised. If you search material and craft item x, it needs now the same amount of time as before. With the different that you can gather stuff in a whole now much faster.
-
Hello everyone.
I want to admin remove "crafting time", because it only lengthens the game and upset. What is it? Wait 2 minutes to make metal parts! " M glad that gatherning been halved but that "crafting time" is even worse! Please take this unnecessary and can be added extras ", which will only worsen this game.
Thanks.
Cerberix has right. Waiting 2 minutes to make Alloys or Gunpowder is like "wtf" and 7 minutes to make weapon like BB gun or 310 minutes to make Plasma Rifle and playing with Minigun is useless because 3 bursts and you need to make ammo again which needs you to waste a lot of time. New crafting system is fail and I bet 90% of people will agree with me that is destroying Fonline.
-
Before the wipe crafting was way better and faster. It slows the game too much now.
-
I agree with both cerberix and jodwig, this is just insane. Now everyone will have tons of resources but won´t be able to craft anything from them due to timeouts. You gotta be kidding about the same time as before. For example, before, you were able to make 5 BB guns in roughly 700 seconds (300? + 120 + 5x50). Now its more than 2k seconds(150? + 60 + 5x420). So yeah, its the "same". Sometimes i wonder if devs tried to play this game because its getting harder and harder and its more time consuming than ever.
-
Crafting is probably the most dynamic game mechanics sub-system when it comes to design, we change it pretty often. Thus far, we were experimenting only and shall keep on doing the same. The current crafting mechanics shall not remain forever, but you'll have to use it whatever time it requires, sorry... That's the life of a tester, I guess.
-
Really it's a little boring now, it doesn't work. Solo players will be unable to play. So what if you make a good gun, when you can lose it in a second of lag even.
The craft time on basic materials has to be lower. 10-15 seconds at most IMHO. The rest doesn't make such a difference for me, but if you play a BG char and have to wait 60 minutes to craft enough ammo to play 5 minutes - it will be boring eventually for everyone :p
This should be reversed, 5 minutes fo crafting - 60 minutes of playing. I don't find going after 5 ore, an interesting way of playing in FO.
-
NO WAY 35 mins cool after making 100 ammo .223 and 20 mins for preparing materials (neer 1h)and then 20 min of fun and game over ?? and what shoud we do in this 40 mins ?? harvest resourses and and then again have 20 min of fun something is wrong here.
Game should be for fun and not for grind but that is only my opinion :D
-
Ok so if you are letting us to test because we are beta testers then we are telling you it's epic fail and please change it as soon as possible :P
-
We test - you have first hand feedback, so we whine about what is bad : )
The game should provide fun, you have to ask yourself - is waiting so much time for basic items fun?
-
Stop spamming, it won't help.
Let's think the opposite: imagine every items are very easy to craft, low timeout for everything=> why should you craft a simple pistol? =>everyone will go on best weapons (big gun currently).
No-one will care to die because it will be so easy to respawn and craft again.
Perhaps, crafting time-out is a bit too high and needs to be reduce (but only a bit imho)
Perhaps it's good as it is now and it only needs to have another way to find stuff=> bring back good stuff spawning in shops so that trade starts again (which will mean more protections against robbers too)?
-
@ Lisac
I think that "crafting time was good before the update. It was not enough to wait to do a bit of ammunition or a weapon. Now it is massacre. Like the fellow above, write wait a few hours / minutes to make weapons or ammunition. I know that you are working a lot, you want to do a good update but they are wrong. I'm not talking about bugs, because they can be repaired.
I think that the next update should restore the good old system of crafting without the cooldown, and others. I understand now waiting to collect the raw materials - good I can wait those 5 minutes to collect 5 minerals. However, I can not understand that it takes a dozen minutes / hours just to do something that I can lose in just 5 minutes after leaving the base.
I lose my gun within 5 minutes of what? Again I have to do a new one? But I have to do it for a long time to wait, then I have to collect raw tone at zajmnie me most of the day. The next day is to recycle different materials. With the option "cooldown crafting" extends to all again for some few hours. And how can you play?
Lena is right. Crafting should occupy less time than the game. FOnline not Settlers.
Jodwig it is right. "Cooldown crafting" this is a bug that needs to be removed.
-
Hello everyone.
I want to admin remove "crafting time", because it only lengthens the game and upset. What is it? Wait 2 minutes to make metal parts! " M glad that gatherning been halved but that "crafting time" is even worse! Please take this unnecessary and can be added extras ", which will only worsen this game.
Thanks.
Cerberix you are right, the game is veeeery boring now. 2min coldown for mp or alloy? its a joke? this game dying...::(
-
Crafting time-out is needed to hold the economy together. If everybody could craft things with no timeout whatsoever for either gathering or crafting, then they'd all sell things way more often, emptying the coffers of the merchants, and BAM, new post-apoc recession strikes once again. I sure don't want that.
-
But not so long. Before you upgrade the crafting was good but now times have to suffer to make better armor. Before you upgrade the crafting system was better, and let such a return. Admins should arrange a game, add interesting encounters, group quests (COOP) and improve the game or eliminating various bugs. Remove "cooldown crafting. If someone you nazbiera sufficient material for several weapons will not be able to do so, because of course you must wait several hours to be able to do a second weapon ...
-
its more like a browser mmo now than a real game...
takes 50 minutes to craft small energy cells twice, thats really no fun
-
The second problem is when you let's say make Plasma Rifle you need to wait 311 minutes and in that time you can't make even alloys or metal parts, so I need to choose - make alloys for gang members or make Plasma Rifle and they need to wait 5 hours for alloys >.>
-
I figure the best way of stopping crafting ruining the economy is to make the best gear uncraftable. You can only craft low to middle end gear. 10mm pistols, grease guns, flamers, laser rifles, that's it. Maybe mk1 metal armour. Stuff that is only practically useful - not for the accumulation of wealth. Make the best gear only craftable with 'SUPER RARE KEY ITEMS' - some crazy 'firing pin' for the .223 pistol, or whatever. I figure that'd be a good way to bring back special encounters, too.
The second anything is craftable, it becomes grindable. And FOnline players love grinding.
-
140 for laser rifle, 311 for plasma.. i think developers will cut down -50% this time SOON. ;)
-
no 50% reduction, CD should be reduce by your skill. The better you are the less CD you get!
-
Yeah, what i like most from RPG is that when your character makes progress, some things become easier or quicker. Before update, repair and science had some impact on the speed of crafting, now they are just nearly useless.
-
I disagree with the skill level making you craft faster, I want to craft the god damned ammo to PLAY. Not wait 30 minutes because my crafter is lower than someone who played 24/7 for the last month... Games are about FUN. Some of you may feel fun now because you craft or something, but you will get bored of it after a few days, It will eventually become stupid just sitting in once place and bringing ore, Sim-Fallout. I quit until a better crafting system is in place, it's too much time consuming and it's too boring.
-
CRAFTING TIME ?! :o
it bullshit...
please remove it... and admin please don't deostroy the game .
-
Ok so obviously, most of us are unhappy with the cooldowns. It would help much more if everyone who complained provided a solution. So here's my two.
1. Remove gathering and crafting cooldown. Instead make each harvest/craft rely on the actual skills needed for that. So when making a pistol, you would have repair and SG cooldown and when mining, you would have a science CD. Keep the times as they are now, but have them only be a maximum. So with each raise of a skill, the cooldown for that particular skill becomes much shorter.
2. Return cooldowns to prewipe times, where you would have to wait a few seconds between each craft. Then raise the amount needed to higher levels. I mean, make alloys take ten ore and ten minerals or something. They're already heavy to the point that you can't carry much so it's going to take longer. And if you really want to limit people's gathering in this system
a. Don't let caravans sit on resources
b. Make resource encounters more rare
That's about all I have for now.
-
Crafting is probably the most dynamic game mechanics sub-system when it comes to design, we change it pretty often. Thus far, we were experimenting only and shall keep on doing the same. The current crafting mechanics shall not remain forever, but you'll have to use it whatever time it requires, sorry... That's the life of a tester, I guess.
Are you f***ing insane? Crafting one gun per day is crap, we want to play the game, not waste time on crafting. It should be like: gather materials, craft, go fight.
No, people just wont play, I quit, my whole gang too, we are just spaming everywhere on irc or here how crafting times now are insane. If you keep up like this there will be no sane people left on server to test-play the game.
I want to know who's smartass idea this was? I mean wtf is there to test, are you so stupid that you can't calculate simple game economics?
I say that game was much better before this shit update, and criticals are not fixed! And game was much more fun before even with slow gathering I could have enough ammo and weapons to fight whole day.
140 for laser rifle, 311 for plasma.. i think developers will cut down -50% this time SOON.
lol I say 90% I don't want to wait 140 minutes to make 1 laser rifle! not even 70 mins!
10 mins is too much for some. But better 10min then 140, time is worth more then money and any resource. Again who's idea this was, does he/she/it even plays the game?
-
i will post this here as well, this game was great and now is ****
The fact that there's two big alliances is simple because of how the new name colorizing makes it possible to have a very large organizations. This is both good and bad.
I don't know if there's any easy way to resolve these huge "lag fights", but the modoc entry points have been fixed, so camping the southern entrance mindlessly is not possible anymore, which is one of the most popular things right now.
With the new system, you have a potential to earn 60-120k caps per day. This reward system may be refined a bit (decreased/increased, but using trader derived items didn't seem to work that well, as people just got "crap" that they didn't care about. It will also create an influx in the economy, which is pretty stagnant right now in some ways. Factions may actually buy their equipments from some larger player controlled merchant company. Just a theory though.
This depends if the alliances can hold themselves together or if they will break down into smaller factions again because of fights over resources.
This is not a bad idea, I like it, but I don't think it will work any better than how it worked before, namely, that income from town control was items traded. So more trade meant more income. But gangs figured it was easier to just kill everything that entered the town and grab the stuff instead.
It's easy to leave an equipped sneaking alt hidden. This will never work good in larger towns where you can easily hide in some small house.
There's global message when some factions tries to take control, then there's a countdown, and they have to protect it during that time. Money is always generated at end of town capture period.
u don't get it, do u ? how much is one bh ca ?
30k-40k plus guns, multiple by ammount of people in ur gang? thats why gangs are camping spawning points together, b/c ur "new great" crafting system and cooldowns make this game unplayable, people are trying to get the edge over opponents, the best and easiest way is get as many soldiers as possible.
how many people have u got on the serv 200 ? are u blind dont u see it? before the wipe u had 500 and more.
No matter when u logged in, u could always meet someone in encounters or in towns. now what? 200 people is not enough and most of them are hid in the caves, scared of losing stuff which takes aged to craft, big gangs that shoot at everything that moves make northern cities even more dangerous than pre wipe ( thx devs )
a single crafter have even less chance than before the wipe, on top of that if he lost his stuff, it'd take ages to get it back b/c of cooldowns of gathering and crafting ( just digging ore makes me sick to get a good armor and gun u need atleast 20 alloys, dont u think its already too much ? )
u said "you have a potential to earn 60-120k caps per day", im a player and im telling u its not enough, make it 300-600k,
gang's stuff armors, weapons are worth at least 600k there is no point in going with 5-7 mates against 20-30, thats why 2 sides war will stay as it is,
and even without "the new name colorizing" gangs could do it( i mean fight together), all we have to do is add the tag of our alliance or gang in front of our nicks, names, besides most of the people know akas of other players and opponents, yeah u are right it helps in battle, although most of the time u have a wall of soliders against another, its not so difficult to pick ur target, they are not mixed up
no encounters- another problem, its hard to find anything bigger than a rat, u could just keep the new xp system that gives u less and less xp instead of removing creeps ( on top of that u can still loot encounters when u find them ( lets say at night).
u could just remove their ammo and guns in the same way as u did with town guard's stuff, who cares about karma in sf? atm that caravan gives u lsw, avenger and laser rifle + ammo ...
look how many people are playing now and before keep doing ur great job, only super crafters will stay, i mean 10-20 people ...
-
yes yes mr dev, now you have problem with potential serial murderer which prefers only killing, pk'ing and waiting for "dangerous" bluesuits near enter-grid in every town. so.. do something, give us blood, tanks, soldiers, weapon factories ! bored pro-game-killers.. they ask you.. oh wait.. they ORDER: encounters with many guns, super fast crafting for gangs and.. of course: massive war on wasterland !
what a hell.. ok, new crafting time is just wrong, but you can still play on two computers and killing people using c4 with alter-accounts, you can still DM'ing, destroying, stealing.. now think why exactly fo owns limitations? dont see it ? because of you.
but you right - now you must just use your brain, i know this is hard. im not a crafter, i have one account(how much you have ?).. shit i dont know maybe im stupid newbie with no imagination... we have 200 players on server, TLA - 200 players on server, im play both of them - go ahead, go DM'ing with encounters with russians, you are free !
yes i like better fo after wipe, i dont know why exactly SORRY GUYS and i hate sims for sure.
-
what are u talking about, i said no guns nor ammo in encounters in the same way as in towns, atm if u kill a guard in any town u will not be able to loot anything, - bring encounters back remove weapons and ammo, keep the new xp system ( just to have some fun from time to time )
again 5 min cd for ore and min is enough, u have to spend ages to get a few alloys since every one is 3 ore and 3 min
( pre wipe way of gathering ore and min was better, bring it back + keep the new way of crafting stuff
no fast nicks - very good
and for the god sake make up ur mind, are u gonna do another sims there is nothing to do, no quests, no encounters, no people LOL apart from big gangs its hard to find anyone even in boneyard or junktown ( called safe towns ) a few people in ncr and thats it,
and for the god sake what are all the armors and guns for ?
200 are playing now, but i know many who will not do it anymore; the problem is b/c of the gathering system they are sitting in caves, dont u see it? all they do is just stand in front of the workbench for hours just to craft stuff which can be lost in a minute
no matter what u think about it, u dig the ore, craft guns and armors and u dig more and craft better guns ( waste ur time) to be able to kill ur opponent u are not doing it just to put all ur stuff inside lockers to get orgasm from looking at it, this game is about killing, fighting, go play sims and stop talking bs son
-
go play TLA, game about killing, figthing, son.
-
is this all u can say? tell me what all the guns and armors are for, huh ?
i dont speak russian, i will not play there,btw i donated fo not tla.
-
this game was good before the wipe, all they had to do was remove ammo an guns from caravans and add the new crafting system, i would add more stuff like "a piece of machinery or sth" to craft better guns and armors, to buy them u'd need control over a town, many traders and crafters, it would make people defend the town, crafters and traders
-
The reason I started playing a naked hth character was because of how boring fonline had become due to crafting. It's way too time intensive for easily lost rewards. Everyone who pvps walks around in the best gear anyways, they can afford to because they have faction resources to replace lost gear. The people who get screwed are solo or small faction players. Your options are either play real time and risk dying from lag or bad luck losing hours worth of gear, or play turnbased and be able to clear out like 1 cave an hour. The game has become way too crafting centric and has lost track of what made fallout fun, the combat and quest interactions. Maybe you could make recipes involve items you could only get from supermutants or hubologists and put the encounter rates back up. That would mean people would have to work in groups to hunt bigger prey and there would be a reason for doing so.
-
I agree with the above posters. Thngs are too weighed in favour of the huge factions. They get it all, with no drawbacks. I vote all faction bases are made visible in the name of keeping the game interesting. If you want to your own private bank vault, you're going to have to defend it.
Or just place so many slaves at the entrance that attackers lag out, whatever works.
-
Nothing should be discoverable until the slaves/merc issue is resolved. Not everyone with a faction base has the means to defend it and you can't be logged in 24/7. This would actually benefit large factions as they could wipe out all the smaller ones and still have enough people back at their own base to keep it safe.
-
The time for crafting items is the same as before.
rly ?? 28 min cooldown on making 5 mm ap ammo is as it was ?
-
Just don't be afraid to continue reading.
The time for crafting items is the same as before. Gathering timeout has been lowered and crafting timeout raised.
"Crafting time" in this case is time needed for obtaining material AND crafting itself.
However I'm not sure how much (or if) is time needed for craft all prerequisites (alloys, metal parts, ...) counted in.
-
It's the crafting method wich will change for us.
Before mining was too long (like getting fiber) and someone said "reduce the time!" and they reduce the time of ALL ressources, wood was short now it's very very short(you cut tree, go stock it and you can cut an other tree ..). So before the method was : "get some ressource to make items".
I have a doctor who can get ressources some days and at the end make 20 super stimpack.
I get fruits and can make mentats quickly!
That's nice!
(same as make many gunpowder to make ammunition)
Now, because of ALL ressource gathering reduce, the time go in the crafting. The old method cannot works :
We can't get many ressources for make 10 or 20 stimpack .. it's tooooooo long, we can only make one .. and sleep before make an other one. If we want to make more than 1 items we have to WAIT, like it was before between 2 mining of iron/minerals.
And get ressources and books to go vaultcity/sierra to make 1 super stimpack is not very fun. No more big operation.
You want to make 10mm ammo, you have to waiiiiiiit for creating all secondary ressources (metal part, gundpowder)
So the problem was "we have to wait" and now it's "we have to wait".
And the solution was not really bad but I think reduce ALL ressources by 50% was not good. Reduce that only for mineral/iron and fiber(or get more fiber in 1 time) will be better.
And the idea of reducing cooldown with profession, tool or/and skill may be nice.
Maybe we have to wait more weeks to test the actually system but now I don't want craft items because when I craft I want to craft! Not waiting. (And I don't want to make an "average character".)
I hope what I wrote is a little understandable :p
-
I have a sugestion.
Lets throw out gathering coldown all together. Instead make resources gathering spots apear radomly in random enconcuers but not to often. Each one of them could be mined only once and give amount of resources dependant on lvl of science , repair, outdorsman, depending on type of resource. Make advanced resources be mined with lover chance on gathering instead of created. That way people would travel the map searching for gathering spots insted of standing in place and gathering from same spot witch would be much more fun.
Example:
repair 1-30 0%-50% on finding 1 ore
repair 31-60 50%-100% on finding one ore
repair 61-90 1 ore +0%-50% on finding second one
repair 91-120 1 ore+50%-100 for second one +0%-20% on finding one alloy
repair 121-150 2 ore +0%-50% on 3 ore +20-50% on finding one alloy
and so on.
And so on.
Gathering would be harder but more interesting and thanks to harder gathering also crafting cooldowns could be decresed.
-
As most can agree that the current cooldowns are too high I think I have a solution that makes perfect sense. Make it so that the players combined stats of Science and Repair and weapon/armor (repair would be 2x for armor crafting) skill for said crafting item directly effect the amount of time removed from your crafting cooldowns. For example a player with 20 sci and 30 repair would have an 8 min cooldown after crafting a gun, but a player with 100 sci and 120 repair would only have a cooldown of about 2 mins. As for alloys it would go from 130 seconds to 30 with the same stats. Something like a % reduction in time based off your combined stats is basically what I'm suggesting.
-
Developers! Why do you think the crafting system before was bad?
So what if it takes 15 seconds to craft gunpowder - it is FUN. Game should be FUN.
Players should be able to get FUN guns. This is ridiculous, stand 20 minutes in the cave to create 100 bullets... It is easy for you because YOU DON'T PLAY THIS GAME, all you do is throw ridiculous limitations or CREATE ammo for yourselvs(admins can create items yeah).
Game is right now _unplayable_ and is very NOT fun. There will never be a Fallout Online where you make quests and interact with players - because the world of FO is too small, the economy is simple. You don't need to barter for food or water or anything else, it's a game of fighting. There are no quests which reward crafting players and so on.
As in any enviroment, when there is a lack of resources, nations form to support themselves(big factions killing everything) and they start reigning war.
Simple things, yet it seems you can not grasp it. If you want to leave this system of hard craft - you have to make the world much more interesting.
Adding quests, more crafting materials, more items to be traded for them, etc. (not gonna happen in the near future, let's be honest)
It's not that this system is bad, it just doesn't fit the FO world, at least for now. Also I don't see how solo players or small factions are gonna game now.
Make crafting fun again, make it so that people don't have to stand 20 minutes in ONE PLACE AT A CAVE to craft 100 bullets. This is Ridiculous. What kind of fun is that? I'm standing in my cave pressing gunpowder evey 2 minutes... haha such fun, yeah the thrill of the game. You get a huge slap for such a developement failure - and you deserve it.
My suggestion:
-MP, Alloy, GunP - 5 - 15 seconds craft + xp points like before, around 40.
-Crafting Ammo - max 120 seconds(it is essential for playing anyhow)
-Crafting Guns - limits can be bigger
-Crafting items - very low limits
Fast and fun, yes people have to play with guns. Yes people should be able to reac lvl 21. They PK anyway, and they do it because it's the only way to go.
I'd love to add RPG features to the game, but let's be honest, you (Devs) concentrate mostly on PvP fighting. Anything else right now is far away.
I'm waiting for shooting cooldown. 1 Shot = 2 minutes cooldwon :D Just a joke that sums up the situation now.
Player economy will never grow, because people have factions supporting them, thus they don't need to trade with others on a regular basis. The resources are plentiful so theres no real trade and there never will be.
-
Good Lena said.
Like I wrote earlier to remove completely the cooldown crafting and crafting a system restore before the update. If the admin does not want to play this game there was tons of things that unfortunately they will not do it. In this game played to 200 people and not 10 Another idea, which will reduce the time and skills is through the medium but have found application in the game.
This could look like this:
iron ore & minerals> 40% of science - 7 minutes
iron ore & minerals> 70% of science - 6 minutes
iron ore & minerals> 100% science - 5 minutes
fibers & apples> 40% Outdoorsman - 6 minutes
fibers & apples> 70% Outdoorsman - 5 minutes
fibers & apples> 100% Outdoorsman - 4 minutes
NO CRAFTING TIME!
"MP, Alloy, GunP - 5 - 15 seconds craft + xp points like before, around 40" - Good.
No cooldown for making weapons, armor, ammunition, and ordinary objects.
-
My suggestion:
-MP, Alloy, GunP - 5 - 15 seconds craft + xp points like before, around 40.
-Crafting Ammo - max 120 seconds(it is essential for playing anyhow)
-Crafting Guns - limits can be bigger
-Crafting items - very low limits
Not such stupid idea, especially with xp for MP and Alloys.
They PK anyway, and they do it because it's the only way to go.
I'd love to add RPG features to the game, but let's be honest, you (Devs) concentrate mostly on PvP fighting. Anything else right now is far away.
Hold your horses - not everyone have fun from PK, and it's not only way to go. And no, 21 level is not a goal of itself for everyone. Strange, no? :>
Devs, as I see it, are now concentrating on basic things, like mechanic, economy and combat. Pimping game with quests will be (I hope) added later, I guess at the end of testing. Because this still are tests, you know.
The resources are plentiful so theres no real trade and there never will be.
Funny, there is no day in NCR without some solo player shouting "buying/selling junk/electronic parts/alloys/wood". How do you call that if not "trade"?
cerberix - "no crafting time" means you will get miniguns, plasma rifles and combat armors all around. C'mon, this was already before wipe - remember dozens of bored people, that were making carpets of ammunition everywhere? You miss that? I think "no crafting time" is even worse idea than "no stealing in towns".
-
I won't mind if I can craft only three energy weapons per day or something, it would be right for me, but the worst thing is, that I just upgraded a power fist and now I can't craft anything for 3 hours. This means I can't even make some metal parts, alloys etc., which is just stupid. If I run out of ammo or someone from my faction needs something small, I'm just screwed and useless for those 3 hours.
I think it would be ok, if there is some counter instead of cooldown. For example you can make "2*your level of profession" items of the given profession per day - no matter if you make those in 5 minutes or 24 hours. And it would be best if you can make f.e. 2 upgraded servos/ 3 extended capacitor batteries/ 200 MFC etc. instead of one weapon, counting as one item from the counter. This way you can set it according to economy and let players craft their goods and don't just wait most of the time. Items not requiring profession should have some minimal cooldown (I don't suggest having people wait like 7 minutes for making BB gun or something.. just set some small cooldown). That way the economy should be ok and people not bored of waiting hours and hours (and you can't expect normal players to make their time-schedule according to FOnline - like at morning I'm gonna make some plasma rifle, then I'm gonna live real life and in the evening I will make ammunition so I can play).
Recapitulate: I suggest using counter instead of cooldown for Mid and Hi level items requiring profession. That way players can still make fixed number of items per day, but they don't have to plan their time just because of this crafting. Low level items not requiring profession should have very short cooldowns, like before the change or ranging from ~15 seconds to maximum of ~5 minutes.
P.S.: In fact we are getting to the pre-wipe situation with the cooldowns and now also more NPCs in one encounter - you can harvest more from killing NPCs than crafting (I just collected 2x Needler, 2x Laser pistol, 3x Ripper, 2x Uzi, 3x Power Fist, 18 Plasma Grenades, 4 stimpacs and nice amount of ammo in about 3-4 encounters - just few minutes.. I bet I can't even craft those items in one day). I don't say it's bad to have those items from encounters and you should nerf this, in fact it is equal to the risk, cause it was quite hard not being killed and I had a lot of luck (luck 1 - having humanoids in enounter, luck 2 - being shot many times and not dead). :)
-
Crafting cooldown isn't bad in itself, it's just too bloody long. average 30 minutes cooldown for 100 ammo (without considering crafting time from components) is awful, and crafting anything beyond lvl 2 profession means the character becomes next to useless for the next 2-5 hours (can't make any ammo to go out hunting, can't meke MP or alloys for next big thing...)
This actually encourages the use of several crafter alters used in rotation and severely hurts more casual (less obsessive) players.
How about splitting the crafting cooldowns into 2-3 sub cathegories:
1. Simple items and crafting materials (MP, alloys, gunpowder, tools, hammers, ecc...)-stuff that doesn't give Xp should have it's own cooldown and 30 s max.
2. Ammunition-all kinds of ammunition and lesser drugs (powder, stimpaks, radaways ecc...)-these should have their own cooldown cathegory wich should be from 2 (most common ammo types) to 10 minutes (for Mfc and rokets).
3. Complex items (all weapons, armors and doctor lvl 3 drugs)-the cooldown on these can go from 2 minutes to a couple of hours for the end tier weapons (plasma rifles and CA).
This way there won't be a flood of end tier stuff on the market, but crafters will still be able to craft ammo and components while waiting for the 'big thing' cooldown to pass. With this system I wouldn't even mind the 5 hour cooldown after crafting a plasma rifle:)
-
We've zeroed craft timeouts for mid-resources (alloys, metal parts, gunpowder...), in fact it was meant to be this way.
Rest is unadjusted for now, I mentioned it somewher that our 'craft designer' is out of internet now, and we don't want to jump into his design with hotfixes. So it takes time to make even such simple changes.
-
Game feels already a little better, good work. All you need to do is lower the crafting time on ammo, this is where the game becomes dynamic. I personally don't care that much for guns, it can be 2 hours ;P People will make alts to make guns, but that's life I guess.
-
We've zeroed craft timeouts for mid-resources (alloys, metal parts, gunpowder...), in fact it was meant to be this way.
Sorry to have a stupid question, does this mean, that you can make f.e. a plasma rifle and immediately after it some parts or alloys without cooldown or you must make the alloys and parts first, then the gun? In short: is it possible to make those mid-resources when you have already cooldown running because of crafting something bigger?
-
I won't mind if I can craft only three energy weapons per day or something, it would be right for me, but the worst thing is, that I just upgraded a power fist and now I can't craft anything for 3 hours. This means I can't even make some metal parts, alloys etc., which is just stupid. If I run out of ammo or someone from my faction needs something small, I'm just screwed and useless for those 3 hours.
I think it would be ok, if there is some counter instead of cooldown. For example you can make "2*your level of profession" items of the given profession per day - no matter if you make those in 5 minutes or 24 hours. And it would be best if you can make f.e. 2 upgraded servos/ 3 extended capacitor batteries/ 200 MFC etc. instead of one weapon, counting as one item from the counter. This way you can set it according to economy and let players craft their goods and don't just wait most of the time. Items not requiring profession should have some minimal cooldown (I don't suggest having people wait like 7 minutes for making BB gun or something.. just set some small cooldown). That way the economy should be ok and people not bored of waiting hours and hours (and you can't expect normal players to make their time-schedule according to FOnline - like at morning I'm gonna make some plasma rifle, then I'm gonna live real life and in the evening I will make ammunition so I can play).
Recapitulate: I suggest using counter instead of cooldown for Mid and Hi level items requiring profession. That way players can still make fixed number of items per day, but they don't have to plan their time just because of this crafting. Low level items not requiring profession should have very short cooldowns, like before the change or ranging from ~15 seconds to maximum of ~5 minutes.
P.S.: In fact we are getting to the pre-wipe situation with the cooldowns and now also more NPCs in one encounter - you can harvest more from killing NPCs than crafting (I just collected 2x Needler, 2x Laser pistol, 3x Ripper, 2x Uzi, 3x Power Fist, 18 Plasma Grenades, 4 stimpacs and nice amount of ammo in about 3-4 encounters - just few minutes.. I bet I can't even craft those items in one day). I don't say it's bad to have those items from encounters and you should nerf this, in fact it is equal to the risk, cause it was quite hard not being killed and I had a lot of luck (luck 1 - having humanoids in enounter, luck 2 - being shot many times and not dead). :)
Wichura your idea look like sux. please don't quote Cerberix and Lena post. They have good Idea about Game.
i Testing Encouters today and it NOT good idea to get 20 Miniguns or 20 laser rifle in few minutes lol... One SF caravan is easy to meet, but second is hard. 20 minutes to meet next.
So please say ONLY true .
'' 2x Needler, 2x Laser pistol, 3x Ripper, 2x Uzi, 3x Power Fist, 18 Plasma Grenades, 4 stimpacs and nice amount of ammo in about 3-4 encounters - just few minutes ''... hahah , nice bullshit...
/edit...
And please dont licking Admin Ass. :-\
-
Sorry to have a stupid question, does this mean, that you can make f.e. a plasma rifle and immediately after it some parts or alloys without cooldown or you must make the alloys and parts first, then the gun? In short: is it possible to make those mid-resources when you have already cooldown running because of crafting something bigger?
For now it's not possible. Sorry to have stupid answers for that, but I dunno if it was meant to be that way or not. And Solar is gone again. If it was meant to, then I need to fix it.
// EDIT: Wish I understood the post above this one :/
-
Wichura your idea look like sux. please don't quote Cerberix and Lena post. They have good Idea about Game.
i Testing Encouters today and it NOT good idea to get 20 Miniguns or 20 laser rifle in few minutes lol... One SF caravan is easy to meet, but second is hard. 20 minutes to meet next.
So please say ONLY true .
'' 2x Needler, 2x Laser pistol, 3x Ripper, 2x Uzi, 3x Power Fist, 18 Plasma Grenades, 4 stimpacs and nice amount of ammo in about 3-4 encounters - just few minutes ''... hahah , nice bullshit...
/edit...
And please dont licking Admin Ass. :-\
And you please don't quote me, if (over)reacting on someone called Wichura. Thanks a lot.
It's not bullshit, smart boy, it's just the way it was. There is no need to BS, you can just react like a rational person (who you are, I believe.. just when you don't make your emotions win over your brain ;) ) and use some arguments . This is the last time I react on your senseless vulgarities with none information value.
@edit: You better think, then write. I have no need to lick something, boy and if I have, it's just MY need and none of your business. Thanks for being polite and not bothering again, big boy.
P.S.: It's possible for everyone to get the items I wrote in just few encounters. And it's totally NOT something like 20 minutes between encounters, more like 2 minutes. It's nice of you, that you "tested" one or two caravans, but if you can't even imagine getting those items in a little time, you just have to test a little more. It's not even as hard, if you consider you can encounter ~8 mercenaries, ~6 press gang members, ~5 hubologists and so on in one encounter. Write then.
For now it's not possible. Sorry to have stupid answers for that, but I dunno if it was meant to be that way or not. And Solar is gone again. If it was meant to, then I need to fix it.
// EDIT: Wish I understood the post above this one :/
Oh thanks, the answer is totally OK, I understand.
@EDIT// I wish I can as well. .)
-
Totally understending situation, I'm pretty sure that long cooldowns when adding just a mag to Assault Rifle and such is a mistake. Still - as i was hoping, there are a lot of good changes. Its a good proof for all those whiny boys that devs don't exist ONLY to ruin that game ;)
-
Totally understending situation, I'm pretty sure that long cooldowns when adding just a mag to Assault Rifle and such is a mistake. Still - as i was hoping, there are a lot of good changes. Its a good proof for all those whiny boys that devs don't exist ONLY to ruin that game ;)
Yeah, reasons are trivial (like that weapon expanding, most likely mistake...reason? problem with IRC communication, we're not real dev-team working in office after all...), consequences...terrible. Life changing consequences (at least judging by tone of some posts:P )
-
for sure, this server in this moment is pretty totally insane fucked up !
excellent job. ;D
but.. i have some things:
1) about some bloody mess guys.. - they can collect now much stuff from caravanas.
so game is playable, you wanted it and, i think - you sell this stuff in good prices. ok.. but when you killing traders from vc, broken hills or NCR why you dont lost your karma in these cities, please tell me ? easy job for guys in PA with plasma rifles or something else..
2) crafting system and economy is GOOD. yes, i must wait 140 min for gun, ammo and rest of goodies, however is not problem for me and guys from bigger gangs, so please.. dont cry, dont lie, dont bother never more. end of problem.
3) gathering is not bad, it must be some balance among war and living.
4) in my opinion this server is ready for new nice ideas about quests, fun in towns(like boxing for cash, visibility enter area, interactivity, stocks, mine camps or something else) please pimp the 2238 !
5) rest of smallest errors/bugs..
edit:
6) special complains thread about lamers, multiaccount-bombers and rest of sh... destroying good fun.
sorry for "ass licking bullshit", but really - i like it now. 8)
-
It is better to restore the old system, because doing so takes a lot of time armor but not so to make this game a game for a "no lifers". Crafting should be reasonably fast. Alloys, metal parts, gunpowders and others should be dealt from 5-15 seconds as it was before. Waiting to do the next weapon is totally stupid. And perhaps you think why? So now I answer.
Where can I get a decent weapon? Only with the craft. So he wrote Dark Angel time to find a long caravan, caravans are stronger and that is the plus. But these weapons, which are also broken right? In addition, even the "golden handle" you can not fix these things sometimes. The stores do not have what to buy. This game should be enjoyable and not to turn up for something I need to do is not willing to have the 2-3 weapons somewhere in the store if I was killed by players.
"The storm" did not talk foolishly, I see that you do not have their own opinion and do not know yet how it was before the days of the first days of beta testing. Needler''2x, 2x laser pistol, 3x Ripper, Uzi 2x, 3x Power Fist, 18 Plasma Grenades, 4 stimpacs and nice amount of ammo in about 3-4 encounters - just few minutes - I think this is playing on another server, that such things you earn in 5 minutes.
Important issue. Fallout is one game where you have several options for solving the task. It is not a linear game like those desperate games today that are so linear that the injury talk. You should have several ways to find the weapons in this case, crafting, loot the caravans, stolen or simply killing someone. The same should be with exp - crafting gives exp, killing scorpions and other creatures on wasteland gives exp. Please do not limit it to 1 thing that will pay off. I'm still in favor of this to completely remove the cd crafting time or shorten it to a few seconds (5-20 seconds).
Another thing. I would like to see in-game special quests for players, something like COOP. We could make them a lot and different. Would be a reward in the form of weapons, money, things to crafting and many others.
-
And here we are again - standing in caves crafting basic resources for 1 minute. I need ammo for a gun:
Gunpowder, Wait 1 minute, wait 1 minute, Wait 1 minute, 3 times more, add metal parts, craft. Yeah FINALLY, after standing in one place for 7 minutes I have ammo.
But what aspect of roleplay is that? What does it add to the game, apart from making players wait? Constructive comment from the guys in charge appreciated.
I don't see it. All it does is make the player wait and wait. It produces only minutes of boring time near the workbench. It is still too long for basic resources.
Ammo craft time should also be cut down.
-
Gunpowder, Wait 1 minute, wait 1 minute, Wait 1 minute, 3 times more, add metal parts, craft.
Hm, that was changed yeterday. Mid-resources are not subject of waiting.
What does it add to the game, apart from making players wait? Constructive comment from the guys in charge appreciated.
Well, what it adds is the compensation for shortened gathering timeouts - the goal was to retain whole crafting process time (gathering + crafting times), while making gathering a bit faster. Of course we've introduced few bugs and mistakes on the way there (like issue with mid-resource timeouts), so whole process ended up longer, but goal wasn't to make it so.
Other items that have their whole craft process longer now might be victims of some bugs/mistakes. I do not have the exact calculations for it by myself, but at least I assure you making everything slower wasn't the goal.
-
"Hm, that was changed yeterday. Mid-resources are not subject of waiting."
Yes they are :D 1 minute actually.
-
Yeah, thats a bit better now.
But I've noticed when I have CD on science (from making gunpowder) I can't craft ammo/guns and when I have CD on crafting I can make gunpowder etc, strange...
-
How about removing all time limits to crafting and applying another method of controlling this feature?
My idea is to introduce Crafting Points - a number telling current crafting capability of a character. To craft an item, you will have to spend some of your Crafting Points. Naturally, some things will be more demanding than others, just like now there are different cooldowns to different items. Additionally, Crafting Points will slowly regenerate over time, possibly at rate dependant of your character's skills.
That way you can make an advanced weapon and not be useless for the rest of the day. You will still be able to craft simpler things shortly after. You will have to wait more for more complicated items, however.
-
Have an Idea too, but I'm not sure how to do it.
Something like "During crafting you learn how to craft it better and faster"
Well the cooldown on all items would be high (eg like now) but when you craft that gun (item, whatever) over and over the cooldown will be shorter and shorter. First time it'll go down faster and after some time (clicking) it'll go down slower.
There will have to be some kind of statusbar in each item info shoving you your progress on that item crafting.
An example of lowering cooldown:
100-90% ... go down by 1% / 10 attempts
90-80% ... by 0.5% / 20 att.
80-70% ... by 0.25% / 40 att.
70-50% ... by 0.1% / 200 att.
something like that... it can go to 50% of original cooldown or lower... 8)
-
Hahah, gotta say the crafting cooldown is bloody awsome... I had really way too many materials BEFORE they implemented the crafting cooldowns. Had a supply of iron ore and minerals for my whole goddamn life of wasteland travels. Now, with the epic cooldowns of epic proportions I CAN SUPPLY A WHOLE FACTION. Way-to-fuckin-go. Well, id love to see crafting cooldowns removed and instead get back good ol' gathering cooldowns, but i suppose thats impossible, so i'l hope for decreased crafting cooldowns on metal parts/minerals/alloys and ammunition.
-
"Hm, that was changed yeterday. Mid-resources are not subject of waiting."
Yes they are :D 1 minute actually.
hmm, this is what is happening if you are not reporting properly. Instead of asking about roleplay aspects, you could just point out the fact that i've written '0 timeout' in changelog, and it's not zero. A bug then.
Well, id love to see crafting cooldowns removed and instead get back good ol' gathering cooldowns
I will repeat again - the whole process is supposed to take the same amount of time as before. Check your recipes again. Check that ones which require 10 metal parts or something. And now realize that for each metal part you need 2 iron ore, which used to have gathering timeout twice as long as now.
-
Can we have the wait time (repair and science, 60 seconds) lowerd or removed for med-resources?
(edit: fixed already)
Also repairing of items takes 1 minute for me now, it is just boring time where you sit in one place and wait... This does not help the general gameplay in any way. It may be real life, or it may modify the economy, but it makes the game boring. I suggest cutting the repair time by half.
-
Ok, realistically you are not going to be able to craft a complex laser rifle by yourself in the wasteland in a short amount of time, it would take days of work in my opinion and i think the items reflect that, I feel the people complaining are people that exploited the ability to overproduce goods by taking supplies from other poeple. Now stockpiling the materials to craft is easier so there has to be a balance.
-
Ok, realistically you are not going to be able to craft a complex laser rifle by yourself in the wasteland in a short amount of time, it would take days of work in my opinion and i think the items reflect that, I feel the people complaining are people that exploited the ability to overproduce goods by taking supplies from other poeple. Now stockpiling the materials to craft is easier so there has to be a balance.
agreed 100%
-
I can suggest another thing, for example chopping wood should last not half a second (and then 60 secs recharge) but last like 10 seconds (he chops wood for that long) and take not 5, but 1 piece of wood, and for 60 secs he will have 6 pieceses of wood. Same goes for the Ore and Mineral mining. And for crafting. You cant make a pistol for blink of an eye, and then wait 30 mins to make another, to make a pistol you need some time, and if this game is realistic-based (not too much realistic thou) should be like 20-30 secs for 1 simple gun. And maybe for all the simple made items, and for some advanced ones can be 60+ secs.
This sounds more fair and kinda realistic (as realistic can be)
-
I actually like the present crafting (half gathering cooldown, no cooldown for materials, crafting cooldown relevant only when over 60 min).
U can easily craft 300-400 ammo in a flash, go hunting for an hour and craft some more later, i love it...
But it limits the amount of end tier items ( for example one char can't make more than 2 brotherhood armors per day).
This is the best crafting system we had since server transfer. Way to go!!!
-
Agreed on few posts above
Current crafting system also got some additional benefits
One of them is that alloys no longer will be a currency within the game (hell of a good thing imo)
Onother one is that longer crafting timeout serves better for ingame "reality" (you can't make hi tech complex items in a few seconds)
And so crafters cannot make from 1 to 21 level in no time (like before "bunch of B. Armors for you my dear faction buddies? got the mats? Great! here you go! thx for 3 levels! come back soon with more mats!) plus now they have to think and plan what they ot their faction is going to need most
Yet another thing is: now crafters got plenty more time for repairing stuff
I'm writing this from a point of view of a of a 19 level crafter, one and only armorer of my faction and one and only reliable repairer of my faction
However i'm still waiting to fix timeouts for upgrading stuff
-
the best solution, for me at least, was to craft what guns,ammo i could then check the time if it's really long
i just turn the damn game off!! :D and do something else come back to it some other time
-
Having big cooldowns for end tier equipment, and no cooldowns for middle-materials is a good advancement. However, there is still a hellish crafting cycle going on. It goes like this: search mats -> gather -> then either repeat first 2 parts or go to workbench to craft. Repeat. During 1-5 minutes gathering cooldowns you can't really do anything else but prepare to gather again.
To free players from this cycle gathering should be done either more interactive, or allow players to gather large quantities so that they get bigger cooldowns and get time to do something else than preparing to gather again.
I can suggest another thing, for example chopping wood should last not half a second (and then 60 secs recharge) but last like 10 seconds (he chops wood for that long) and take not 5, but 1 piece of wood, and for 60 secs he will have 6 pieceses of wood. Same goes for the Ore and Mineral mining. And for crafting. You cant make a pistol for blink of an eye, and then wait 30 mins to make another, to make a pistol you need some time, and if this game is realistic-based (not too much realistic thou) should be like 20-30 secs for 1 simple gun. And maybe for all the simple made items, and for some advanced ones can be 60+ secs.
This sounds more fair and kinda realistic (as realistic can be)
Being able to craft and gather "in seconds" is because of more enjoyable gameplay. I'd rather not watch my character chop wood for even 5 seconds.
-
Cumulative gathering timeouts would work fine, I don't know why it isn't implemented yet.
And please reduce ammo cooldowns, I heard that Scypior was saying it isn't supposed to be that high but you aren't changing it.
-
I like new crafting system :D
-
Who told, that 1 people can make ammo for all faction, want be GOD like with minigun, so plzz - 2-4 crafters will do ammo for you, want to have medium range of dmg and consume of ammo , take rifle. Crafting system is awesom!!!! It`s like Ultima Online :D But like to have in game reare minerals, for some superior weapon , ammo, armor... and only 2-3 point in game can be, with big cooldown. So war will happen all time in some area.