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[Sashi]

Are you trying to imply that I only have the one character and have never gotten past level ten just because of the little character information I've made available to you?
yeah lets let the noobs that would make up 80% more of the game population and bring the game to popularity if they didn't quit decide, after all they're noobs and don't know whats best for a game since clearly people who have played fallout 2 since it was made to this day have a wide range of gaming experience, and if you know little of fallout 2 than you have no experience with anything at all in life, especially not other games.

You're also implying that those guys have opposition, when their "opposition" is usually the same exact guys, different tag.

And god knows I know nothing about PK or PvP, I've clearly only started playing online games because I'm new to this one. there is no way i could of had any experience with PvP in the past, and if I did it must be sissy PvP where everyone is at even odds and ultra gear the second they join huh?

I was a major PKer on the first MMORPG made for around six years, I know what earning your way to the top is and thats not what is going on here. Whats going on here is a pyramid scheme being ran and own by one person, with a thousand alts to help them to the top. Whats going on here is people feeling they have the need to make the game harder on everyone else because thats what they think would be fun and if people don't think like them than they shouldn't play or have a voice in how the game should be molded. The only reason any of this has so much back to it is because the only people really left around are with the same mindset, because everyone else quit or are sitting in the corners of the website until beta finishes. If this game gets support the way it is through beta it will turn out like this after beta, and it will become a cult enjoyment that is barely heard of instead of mainstream popularity all because the minority overthrew the majority and took it's place using the games current state to an advantage.

As well it doesn't matter if the pkers loot your objects, either someone else will take them or the pkers will use it as bait for you. And what happens once these noobs finally get onto the same track as the pros? They become the exact same asshole that killed them over and over for no personal gain, either thinking it was fun or thinking they were doing the noobs a favor showing how hard the wasteland is. No thats not how hard it is, thats how hard they're making it. Guards don't do their job, there is no true safe public place, and the only people at fault for this are the people who exploit it for no gain, AKA 70% of the populace.
For this reason noobs can't complete quests, they get killed in between quests and loose the quest items, they get killed after the quest and loose quest items, they get given a tent and end up constantly getting killed in different places until they run out of replacement items, they end up having to keep their heads low 100% of the time, in environments that should of been safe for them. They have to pay a penalty for death by spending 5 minutes walking all the way across the map back to their tent only to get replacement armor, a new weapon, and get shot again.
There aren't any NPCs doing this, there aren't any special events in town that pop up and do this, this is just other people being jackasses to players because they want it to be hard for them. Why? because thats what jackasses do.

Well, there's always WoW *snicker*

[Metal Avalon]

I think a quest like 20 bear asses on here or a reference to it would be kind of Fallout 2ish the way it always referenced pop culture.

[Nice_Boat]

The best part of that is when you said there was no point in arguing with me halfway through, so you argue even more.

I meant that you're basically a person that doesn't know shit about this game yet acts all high and mighty and I won't waste my time countering your laughable arguments beyond that post. Which I won't, and before you bark at me again this post here is just a clarification of the point I previously made.

[Badger]

Well, there's always WoW *snicker*

Hell, why aim so high? Furcadia's more popular than us. I mean, goddamn. That just ain't right.

[Michaelh139]

Hell, why aim so high? Furcadia's more popular than us. I mean, goddamn. That just ain't right.

Only reason FOnline isn't more popular is for the more obvious reasons...  I refuse to name which .

[Metal Avalon]

Only reason FOnline isn't more popular is for the more obvious reasons...  I refuse to name which .

Elitists
Difficulty
Elitists backing up the difficulty
Elitists driving off most of the people who first join so they remain the majority and have the head opinion
The fact its still in beta

The game is tough because of skewed feedback by dozens of bored level 21 players and unreliable feedback from GM's that don't even play the game fairly (4 out of 5 that i've seen had 999% DR or whatever, the 1 that didn't was bombed in NCR and much lulz were had)

This game is not noob friendly and the people who play it are not noob friendly. To be successful you have to play 2 - 4 hours a day with several character builds supporting one another. If you don't do this you better get used to being called a little bitch, fag, pussy or any other variation of the theme and repeatedly killed (i got called 'kurwa' today by a nice polak PKer). Items are meaningless, when you start out you won't get to keep any, when you get to level 21 you will complain about having too many (but you won't give them away) the important thing to remember is to never carry them with you.. anywhere.

Hopefully the next update will bring:
1)Tutorial at start (unskippable to discourage alts)
2)Guarded and thief free starting areas, <level 6 only
3)Leveled wastelander encounter lists (you will not be able to encounter another wastelander more then 5 levels above or below your level)
4)Glitch free karma system, no more guards killing for no reason, no karma loss for shooting thieves
5)PKers and unprotected people marked ie "you see NewbieHelper (Newbie Killer) (Unprotected) (Thief)"
6)Choice of turnbased or realtime for every encounter (not just the ones outdoorsman catches)
7)Guards in shops should shoot thieves, why the hell does buster let people steal money from his customers?
8)Guarded HQ mine (guarded by BoS) in a very far away location, maybe by the glow.
9)Keep broken armor on player death (no more bluesuits running around)

It's a beta. So bare with it. Or don't.

All of this.
Only a handful of an entire community of gamers like games this hard, and I think the only way to cater to all sides would to be to bring up multiple servers, or multiple essences of the same world in one server. Kind of like Ultima Online had Trammel on Felucca, In Trammel there was only PvM, no theft or anything. Guards didn't stop it it was just completely restricted. In Felucca it was pretty much how the game is now, everyone is against you unless they're in your guild, and guards will only attack you in town.
Bam problem solved, the "pussies" get a safe spot and the "assholes" get a warzone, allowing people to play the game however they like without interfering with each other.
You could set up boundries for exploiters, like you're limited to choosing a world per character so you don't just run back and forth abusing the safety of one world and the slide-directly-into-a-blender world.

What this would do is
1. Keep more people playing, the safe world could be like the fallout online the original creators of fallout are making now, where you have to accept a fight with another player, this way those who still want to fight have the ability too without making an alt and going to the other world.
2. Give the warlords and battle hungry no-rules type people a place to fight, and even something else for them to brag about ("Stupid safe-world noobs, I managed to get to level 21 without any safeguards whatsoever, nothin but player against player head to head.")

Less people would quit and we could pass those furfags in strides. The more popular it became the more people would get into the game the more the game would evolve.
It's not perfectly set up but it's a good base for the idea, everyone would get there way and it would turn out for the better with everyone involved with the game.

[JustGreat]

Right, because tram made UO more successful...oh wait

I am at a loss how people can say this game is difficult, I mean once you get your tent (which is pretty simple) you are set to accumulate items.

[Ned Logan]

I am at a loss how people can say this game is difficult, I mean once you get your tent (which is pretty simple) you are set to accumulate items.

Right, the answer is right in that sentence.
The hardest time I've had in this game was before getting a tent. That is why a lot of people whine and quit, and the only thing I would change (some of the suggestion here are really off the rocker).
Make some beginner quest in Junktown or Hub, with a reward of 10 brahmin hides, somehow get the information about the quest to the newbies and lot of people just might not give up on the life in wasteland.

I wonder how many people who made alt really made it without any help of the main character. I doubt it was more than half of them (please do not post how strong, versatile and knowledgeable you were being the one of the minority).

[Metal Avalon]

Right, because tram made UO more successful...oh wait

I am at a loss how people can say this game is difficult, I mean once you get your tent (which is pretty simple) you are set to accumulate items.

The time UO's success went down hill is when EA took over, Trammel increased the amount of players if you did any studying of it at all.

[Sashi]

Make some beginner quest in Junktown or Hub, with a reward of 10 brahmin hides, somehow get the information about the quest to the newbies and lot of people just might not give up on the life in wasteland.

Shouldn't have to, tent creation is in the wiki.

How to make a tent

    * Gather 10 brahmin hides, by buying them or killing brahmins.
    * Go to a random encounter location (The map must be totally empty).
    * Use science on the 10 brahmin hides in your inventory. A message will be displayed, and the map will be turned into a tent map. If you have any followers with you, they will also gain access to that tent : Make sure no one is with you in the encounter.
          o If you have an old tent, it will be destroyed: You can only create one tent per character.

Finding Brahmin is easy too. Roam the area 4 West 1 North from NCR.

[kraskish]

I suggested somewhat OP has said, namely Temple of Trials to be like in F2 a test before real game or any labyrinth that would teach you and provide you with some easy exp. Unfortunately, everyone wanted it to be harsher and no intro benefits :p I still cant figure it out why Fonline has to be different to any other MMO 

The tent part isnt that hard. Once you achieve this youll play calmer. You need to look at the followers. The most griefing thing for me is Hq minerals... wait until that

[Winston Wolf]

The most griefing thing for me is Hq minerals... wait until that

Right. I'm trying to play as a loner and I keep getting killed by random dickheads who stand there the whole day to kill bluesuits. I don't see the point, but if they have fun with it... They don't even wait until I get out with HQ materials.

[Metal Avalon]

The massive problem with this is it is not displayed in easy o find areas, and some people will even not play the game because they have to do so much reading up on it in the wiki, which I agree would be bullshit.

I use to play a game, something nations, where you made your own nation, army, and blah blah blah.
The only way to succeed on that game was to join a faction so they constantly emptied resources onto you, but the catch was you had to do every war and every whim they wanted. 30% of the factions made it so you had to take a fucking test, yeah a test, to join. the rest either had nothing to benefit you or were private. Not a regular ten question test, but honestly, a damn essay. They told me I had a week to study their rules and the clan in the clan library area on the forum, and I had to pass a 50 question test a brief essay to get in. "Excuse me" I said "I'm no longer a high school student, fuck off."
I quit playing after a few months of trying to do it by myself, which I found totally impossible. They also had the gull to tell me I was a pussy for not taking a fifty question exam and an essay for a game that used poorly rendered images ripped from google.

So the game was basically.
1. You have to read assloads and follow all kinds of different guides just to get starting resources.
2. If you want to succeed at all you have to belong to at least a small clan.
3. The people who have passed the "test" feel that they have the authority to judge and give the "test" just because they have passed it.
4. You'll be called a pussy for not taking bullshit.

Notice how we like making lists of numbers here?
Now this game when you join you have to read how to get a tent, what a tent is and why to get a tent. "That's not too bad but I would like it if that information was more obvious in the game. If you have to read it on a wiki than it makes it look incomplete." some will say.
Well the game is incomplete, but they probably won't change the way it is thanks to the regulars of this game, the high leveled characters who have constant alternate for them to climb up off of. "Why wouldn't that change it?" you may ask. The reason why is because they believe that it would be lazy and too easy for something like that to be in the game, as well as many other things such as more obvious quests and a better interface. The reason why they don't want these things to be available to people and probably wouldn't even effect them beyond anything from minor? http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Video%20Game%20Elitist
Because the game had been set up in beta, intentional or not, to filter out people's opinions. The people who found this game too hard quit, the people who stayed are the kind of people who bitch at everyone on MW2 for not using only the FAL. The kind of people who would probably call a game master a pussy just because he's invincible and working on something that requires him to be there.
So you have the test and the test takers, and it goes without saying you would need a clan.
Whats my point? This game is like other MMORPGs, just bad ones that barely anyone plays except people who have picked the game up with all they can and moved it to their own spot, making it almost impossible for anyone who wants to play a game instead of work only have the option to conform with people who whine and bitch about someone using anything that gives them an advantage, or quit. I'm not talking about this MMO, I'm talking about freenations, RSV, FFXI, Tibia, ect.
You may be thinking all of those are bad games, well, exactly.

[Michaelh139]

The massive problem with this is it is not displayed in easy o find areas, and some people will even not play the game because they have to do so much reading up on it in the wiki, which I agree would be bullshit.

I use to play a game, something nations, where you made your own nation, army, and blah blah blah.
The only way to succeed on that game was to join a faction so they constantly emptied resources onto you, but the catch was you had to do every war and every whim they wanted. 30% of the factions made it so you had to take a fucking test, yeah a test, to join. the rest either had nothing to benefit you or were private. Not a regular ten question test, but honestly, a damn essay. They told me I had a week to study their rules and the clan in the clan library area on the forum, and I had to pass a 50 question test a brief essay to get in. "Excuse me" I said "I'm no longer a high school student, fuck off."
I quit playing after a few months of trying to do it by myself, which I found totally impossible. They also had the gull to tell me I was a pussy for not taking a fifty question exam and an essay for a game that used poorly rendered images ripped from google.

So the game was basically.
1. You have to read assloads and follow all kinds of different guides just to get starting resources.
2. If you want to succeed at all you have to belong to at least a small clan.
3. The people who have passed the "test" feel that they have the authority to judge and give the "test" just because they have passed it.
4. You'll be called a pussy for not taking bullshit.

Notice how we like making lists of numbers here?
Now this game when you join you have to read how to get a tent, what a tent is and why to get a tent. "That's not too bad but I would like it if that information was more obvious in the game. If you have to read it on a wiki than it makes it look incomplete." some will say.
Well the game is incomplete, but they probably won't change the way it is thanks to the regulars of this game, the high leveled characters who have constant alternate for them to climb up off of. "Why wouldn't that change it?" you may ask. The reason why is because they believe that it would be lazy and too easy for something like that to be in the game, as well as many other things such as more obvious quests and a better interface. The reason why they don't want these things to be available to people and probably wouldn't even effect them beyond anything from minor? http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Video%20Game%20Elitist
Because the game had been set up in beta, intentional or not, to filter out people's opinions. The people who found this game too hard quit, the people who stayed are the kind of people who bitch at everyone on MW2 for not using only the FAL. The kind of people who would probably call a game master a pussy just because he's invincible and working on something that requires him to be there.
So you have the test and the test takers, and it goes without saying you would need a clan.
Whats my point? This game is like other MMORPGs, just bad ones that barely anyone plays except people who have picked the game up with all they can and moved it to their own spot, making it almost impossible for anyone who wants to play a game instead of work only have the option to conform with people who whine and bitch about someone using anything that gives them an advantage, or quit. I'm not talking about this MMO, I'm talking about freenations, RSV, FFXI, Tibia, ect.
You may be thinking all of those are bad games, well, exactly.

Well then... thats... certainly an eye-opener...

[Haterade]

i agree with the trial, something like F2's starting temple, but much easier, and bit more things to do... like "heres gunpowder to creare 9mm bullets you can gain gunpower by creating them on workbench, for that you require go Mining Site with sledgehammer" blablabla, and of course, option to skip all that.