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[DakaSha]

Click on the worldmap the Town/World button and choose a different spot.

Thank you very much.. i feel so dumb about wondering what that button was for and never using it

[Nice_Boat]

Yeah, but then again so is nobody reacting to people getting repeatedly shot to death outside their homes. If Modoc's prepared jam a shotgun in your face if you have sex outside of marriage, I'm pretty sure they'd react to murderers.
(...) The fact that Modoc of all places is a PVP hotspot is kind of crazy to me.

And attacking people armed with enough stuff to wage World War 4 with bare hands and 10mm pistols makes perfect sense, right? Wrong. Modoc, Den, Broken Hills, Redding and Klamath are all towns that have no military power and as such are controllable. The proper and realistic civilian reaction to being in a combat zone is to flee, even if you have your grandpa's shotgun under the bed. Attacking people belonging to a faction that is in control is even more stupid. What those NPCs are doing right now is simply suicidal - it's more like 28 Weeks Later than anything else, makes no sense whatsoever and is a general pain in the ass. I think that the best idea would be to make those guys generally passive and, even better, make them, aside from the mayor, leave the town (ie. disappear) during town control time.

[Badger]

And attacking people armed with enough stuff to wage World War 4 with bare hands and 10mm pistols makes perfect sense, right? Wrong.

That's more a result of how inhumanly powerful player characters are allowed to become in comparison to every other human being in the game, (Edit: And how much gear they can amass. If it took the rest of the world that little time to build a laser rifle, all towns would be armed to the teeth.) NPCs aren't a threat to any reasonably levelled character, like you said, they're just 28 Days Later zombies to be mowed down without thought or challenge. Even mercs. If you think five guys, no matter what they're armed with, should be capable of mowing down an entire town then you and I want to play very different games.

A lot of those towns may not have military power, but they have a system of law and order. Broken Hills has a sheriff and a jail, so does Redding. Hell, the Den has the Slaver's Guild. The only problem is that these pose no threat because they're NPCs and are inexplicably easier to kill than the other humans who populate the world. People weren't getting murdered every day on the streets of Broken Hills because any group of psychopaths could be overpowered.

I don't like the thought of a town upping and leaving just because of town control. That seems to represent the entitlement complex FOnline players seem to have. They don't want to find their place in the Fallout world, they want the world of Fallout to be their plaything. They want an entire town to up and leave so they can have their little gang fight.

[Nice_Boat]

Even mercs. If you think five guys, no matter what they're armed with, should be capable of mowing down an entire town then you and I want to play very different games.

Both my characters were schooled in the art of war by the Enclave, I think that when I come with 20 of my mates taking on a little town along with its sheriff fits the setting perfectly.

A lot of those towns may not have military power, but they have a system of law and order. Broken Hills has a sheriff and a jail, so does Redding. Hell, the Den has the Slaver's Guild. The only problem is that these pose no threat because they're NPCs and are inexplicably easier to kill than the other humans who populate the world. People weren't getting murdered every day on the streets of Broken Hills because any group of psychopaths could be overpowered.

I didn't see any "groups of psychopaths" taking those towns, I did see large raider organisations (more or less like the one harassing NCR) doing it though.

I don't like the thought of a town upping and leaving just because of town control. That seems to represent the entitlement complex FOnline players seem to have. They don't want to find their place in the Fallout world, they want the world of Fallout to be their plaything. They want an entire town to up and leave so they can have their little gang fight.

I think that "upping and leaving" would be more realistic than a zombie-like attack and death, especially since living in the wasteland is all about survival, no? And if you think that player factions that have more members than some towns have residents shouldn't have any impact on the Fallout world than yes, you and I want to play a very different game. I'm just glad that the devs are sort of on my side with this one, because they're the people that came up with the idea of town control in the first place. We're just telling them that the way guards are in some towns sort of f**ks this idea over.

[jodwig]

Well, I shot in accident NPC and they attacked me so I killed them and now I have bad karma in Modoc. Whenever I try to enter it from east 5+ NPCs are starting to rush at me and when I shoot them about 5-10 more starting to come :/

[Aryan]

http://i46.tinypic.com/f1iaut.jpg

good example of why karma system kinda sucks in unsafe towns. bare in mind i didnt rage these guys into one spot i ran form the east entrance into the centre and this is the result. as you can see any pvp in this pvp town is kinda imposibble atm for me.

Personally i feel that karma shouldnt apply in unsafe towns and while agreed npc should rage when attacked it should be reset on exit. even better is niceboat suggestion, have the lower lvl npc's flee. not completely out but out of the way

[Froggeryz]

this shit still needs fixing and is still retarded, especially with guards seeing through walls

every time you enter a town tons of guards rush out a nearby building and starts punching you for no damage which makes it a goddamn pain in the ass doing any sort of activities in towns

"woops I shot that guy by accident, well I'm sure nothing bad will happen"
<20 guards rushes out and traps you>

...

fuck.

e: oh yeah it's awesome collecting the money from the town you defend and get trapped by 20 guards

this shit should not happen

[Delamore]

Why has this issue still not been fixed?

[Hayabusa]

Please fix this karma in towns, NPCs are really stupid and are attacking us every time we enter.. because of this all our actions are bad organisated (for example someone still in combat mode and cant join to the group leaving the town). Also NPCs which are giving control in towns must be neutral because they are attacking someone, running on all of the map and it is impossible to take city by other gang on the time..

[Aryan]

It's gotten to the point now where we have to make some alts just for town capture because our pvp chars have accidently killed a guy in most towns and cant capture due too the capture npc raging fro half way across the town inside a building

[Froggeryz]

It's gotten to the point where I have stopped playing until this is fixed.

[Aryan]

Bumping this to the top agian because its still a pain in the dick.

Also noticed one of your newest features, not only are we still being infinitely swarmed by npc's but now they are doing some decent crits too so now we are getting swarmed, lagged, surrounded AND damaged lol

I had a fight with kalem2 in kalamath just now and after killing hit i had 42hp remining, i caught a dog in the crossfire in the battle and this dog proceeded to come over too me and critically hit me for 42hp with 2xtoughness and bos armor lol. piss funny but slighlty irritating in a pvp city

[Lexx]

Please fix this karma in towns, NPCs are really stupid and are attacking us every time we enter..

this shit still needs fixing and is still retarded, especially with guards seeing through walls

every time you enter a town tons of guards rush out a nearby building and starts punching you for no damage which makes it a goddamn pain in the ass doing any sort of activities in towns

Why has this issue still not been fixed?

You know, point of reputation (we don't use karma) was, that you cannot run into every town, shot around, go away and come back later and everything is like nothing happened. So if you fucked up with a town and there is no way to gain reputation back, then that's it. This is to prevent people to run into NCR, Hub, Boneyard or whatever else town and kill everything there twice a day.

That this is / can be bad in TC towns is true and will be adressed in future updates.

That's more a result of how inhumanly powerful player characters are allowed to become in comparison to every other human being in the game, (Edit: And how much gear they can amass. If it took the rest of the world that little time to build a laser rifle, all towns would be armed to the teeth.)

I agree.