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[Attero]

You rise the exp gain today and tomorrow people will whine there is nothign to do at 21 .. that they are max lv and still cant use best weapons coz they lose them so easily .. .that they want no-pk option ... that there should be more whatever...

it is like it is .. right ? ...you can suggest things .. right ? .... whining how much you doesnt like the system and how many players left doesnt change anything .. right ? ... so maybe instead of growing several pages long game whine threads for devs to read you would let them do some developing .. right ?

You think that making game more friendly for occasional/newbie/solo players is bad thing to do? Then think again...

You palayed other mmo maybe ? you would notice that even none mmo is ocasional/solo player friendly (newbie part can be solved by growing wiki and guides). The only way mmos are friednly to such players is when you buy account enjoy it and once you are done sell it

EDIT : @Lordus - like i said above with 3h played a week you should give up on MMOs unless you want to buy accounts (or get them in some other way hurm) Stick ot RTS FPP or solo-rpg

[Lordus]

You palayed other mmo maybe ? you would notice that even none mmo is ocasional/solo player friendly (newbie part can be solved by growing wiki and guides). The only way mmos are friednly to such players is when you buy account enjoy it and once you are done sell it.

 Well, imagine situation, that i will want to join this game after 2 months and i will start to level up my char from level 1. There will be lvl21 PKs everywhere, so i will have to level my char twice a time than i will start it from wipe. Is this the purpose of this low leveling/healing etc. measures? To make harder contidions to players who will join the game later than other players?

 I realy think that devs looking on this problem with static eyes, not dynamic.

 You know, i dont spend money if i play this game, but i spend something more expensive: my time. And i dont know, why i need to spend many hours per day, if i want to do only real entertaining thing what fonline offers. (Do you imagine who played fonline one month before wipes? Most of them was PvP, because others left after few week of post wipe euphory.

 Ok then, if developers wants this, make this game only for 10-20 yers old players, ok, thats their choice, but i heard that WoW is aimed on that scpetrum of playres. :/

[Sius]

Well it really is pointless. These fights will lead us nowhere. If devs consider to apply some exp gain compromise I would like to know. Otherwise current season simply can't represent anything but work for me and thats not the reason why I should spend my time with FOnline. Its sad and I hate the fact that I will have to wait so long until this game with such a huge potential will reach "playable" version once again.

[Attero]

i dont say i dont agree that it needs improvements just that the whine is too heavy.... my suggestion is try not to look at fonline as on game that you focus on. You can do alot of other stuff while playing - like watch TV , read book , browse net even play another game or do work if you are good at separating attention.

[NTR]

i dont say i dont agree that it needs improvements just that the whine is too heavy.... my suggestion is try not to look at fonline as on game that you focus on. You can do alot of other stuff while playing - like watch TV , read book , browse net even play another game or do work if you are good at separating attention.

Please! Are the devs fine with that? Why are you nerfing exping so much while the other ways to exp are not finished yet?
For now, when you want to play PvP you need to spend whole day on crafting and exping. Why? Why can't we just have some more fun from that game?
What are you doing is nerfing occasional players and boosting big factions. The more you slower down exping, the bigger is the gape between no-lifers and normal players.

[virus341]

There is no gape as far as level cap exists. You can be no-lifer and become 21 in N days, or you can just play and become 21 in N*M days. No-lifers should have their advantage too
And to all "WHHYY?"s there is only one good answer: because this game belongs to them.
Devs are working at encreasing of exp gain by adding/separating groups of critters. Give them time.

[NTR]

And to all "WHHYY?"s there is only one good answer: because this game belongs to them.
Devs are working at encreasing of exp gain by adding/separating groups of critters. Give them time.

Why they are nerfing exping then, when they haven't finished with the alternative ways of getting exp?

[virus341]

Damn I hate to quote myself

because this game belongs to them

oh and may be because it is beta test?..

[Rejfyl]

I agree with autor of this topic. This game is to much time consumable at the moment. Pity, that every single talk about it i  usually called "whining".

[Wichura]

I don't understand that some people enjoy the game? Man what drugs are you taking?

Over here!
And I'm clean, only some alcohol from time to time.

Stupid first gear quests is not the reason for playing this game. Only PvP, or some kind of team PvE (which does not exist after 9 months of this project, very very sad) is reason, why i will play this game. And of course, friends. But i will rather spend 3 hours in pub with my teamates, then 3 hours ingame, because of no benefit from this.

 It is sad that this project made one big leap, but only very little step if you look second time.

I'm sure you are experienced player, it's beyond discussion. However I'm not sure what is your experience with new players, beginners, "noobs" if you like. "Stupid first gear quests", as you named them, are something what many newcomers are looking for in this game at the first time. Not PvP, they have too weak/missed chars fot that. Not PKing - who can you kill with a shovel? It may seem strange to you, disappointed but well-educated pure PvP player, but they are mostly really happy because of first shotgun ("crap", you could say) and simple jacket achieved by doing a quest. Yes, 100 xp for bringing item X to NPC Y can be funny and "no reason" for you, but you are not alone in this game, and obviously forgot how it is to begin without friends and gang right from the start.

I have work and family myself, and when I'm reading about making 21-lvl char in 48 hours, it is between cheating, magic and no-life for me. Still I believe that it's possible. I understand now why chars below 21-lvl are useless in PvP, yet I disagree that changes in this game leads to nowhere nor are pointless.

NTR - no-lifers will always have advantage in every MMO game, because they are no-lifers. It was before this wipe and earlier one, it will be always, like it or not. Gap between someone spending in game 8 hours / day and other one spending 5 hours / week is certain, just like advantage of PvP-char vs PvE/crafter-char in combat. It's just numbers, you will never balance it well enough to "punish" no-lifers somehow to protect regular players.

[virus341]

I agree with autor of this topic. This game is to much time consumable at the moment. Pity, that every single talk about it i  usually called "whining".

Almost all MMOs supposed to be time- and life- consumable. The only difference is time:fun ratio for you personally.
If I was Dev, I would create special topic where every single player could make only one post. Something like:

I think, this game is a waste of time/sucks/needs some improvements/is so lame/drains my life/has no fun/is too boring for pvp/whatever because:
1.
2.
...

And this is all, no discussions, no suggestion, no additional whine.
As for now we have tons of such topics, where we can hear the same thing over and over again: how much this game sucks and what a waste of time it is. I would have delete them.

Yes, if I dont like to read them, I dont have to. But, seriously, when you see them poping-up over and over again it sound more like whine than suggestion or discussion. And I belive this is my final post in such kind of topics.

[Sius]

Wichura but its not about pushing no-lifers down. They were never the topic. You can't even think about anything like it or you will end up with bullshit restrictions like WoW has in some countries where if you play like for 3+ hours you will get your ingame char stats nerfed. Thats just unthinkable and absolutely wrong. If someone is a no-lifer and sacrifices a lot of time for this then let him have his reward.

Problem here is that regular player has to sacrifice same amount of time as no-lifer in order to get to 21 lvl. For no lifer its 2-5 day work but for others its 2+ weeks depending on their free time. I don't get this whole exp nerfing stuff. I mean whats the point of introducing it right now? What are pros of such decision? Balance leveling speed for future versions? Thats the only thing I could think as a reason why to introduce slower lvling, but with all that stuff going on around in beta its pretty much impossible to balance something like lvl speed right now (bugs, missing game content, possibilities of changes in mechanics etc.).When the game is released as "v 1.0" then it have to be a long run from 0 to max lvl thats for sure. And I wound not be scared even if that should take like 3 months even if you have a lot of free time for FOnline. But there is absolutely no point in doing it now and as a matter of a fact I think its even bad for beta. People can't test extremes and various builds because that would be incredible time sink even for no-lifers. They stick to what is effective and already well known.

Thats the irony about it. I don't know whats such a big deal here. Its beta, its meant to be tested yet devs are afraid to experiment. Changing exp income shouldn't be hard nor time consuming  change and if it is changed for faster exp, then where are the cons of that? Maybe some people who enjoy mining and RP would rather level up slowly since they have fun ingame already but even this group of people can't be offended by such change. People who don't have enough time for the game would be able to level up faster and start doing things they enjoy ingame sooner and people who RP a lot could always try playing as 21 longer and maybe test even PvP or start a new char. And don't tell me that people who enjoy current FOnline for its PvE and RP possibilities are enjoying it because they are leveling up and as soon as they hit 21 its gets boring for them. They can do all they did as they were leveling up except there will be no next lvl after some time. Yes avatar development is an exiting thing but there again I simply don't see how could faster exp do any harm in current FOnline.

2 virus341: I agree with you but just that fact there are tons of such "whine" topics all over the forums suggest something. By gamers for gamers - so its either do something about it or let it be this way and ignore whiners.

[virus341]

Sius, most of your posts makes sense, and I can't disagree with them.
The only thing I can't totally understand is the magic of 21 lvl. It is like Holy Grail.
Your character has no hands or is a disabled untill you reach it, he can't move, shot, or dig? You can do instant-kills already at lvl 9, with low chance, yes.

Yes, I'd like to test different builds and opportunities too, and it would be fun for me if I could get max lvl in 5-6 hours. But my point is that you are not a doll for a scapegoat (may be bad translation of what I meant), unless you reach lvl 21. It's just another expirience.

I can make an example. I'm playing with a friend of mine. We were lvl 9 and spent about 1.5-2. hours to craft some stuff. Then we began to gang around NCR, after 1 hour we tripled our stuff. That was cool and much fun. Next day we lost almost all we have ganged first day. So what? We are having our fun, we are spending our time, and we are not 21 lvls yet. The game is still awesome for us. Ofc, after a few days/weeks it will become boring, but thats what all games are about: to find something that you enjoy, and when its no more fun - find something else.

And, yes again, if exp gain rate would be higher, I wouldn't mind to test a lot of stuff.

[Wichura]

Sius - lets not start this "PvP<->RP" crap again, shall we?

I also wouldn't mind gaining XP to be faster - since wipe my char is on 13 lvl, that gives me like month+ to get 21 lvl I guess. If I would like to test some more builds instead of simply having fun, it will be real pain in the ass to "finish" more than one char with current leveling speed.
What I want to tell you or Lordus is, that there are more possibilities in this game than just PvP with 21-lvl chars. Yet I understand that when you've chosen this specified way of gaming, it will be extremely hard to adapt now, especially when amount of free time you can spend for a computer game is the same as before these changes.

Hell, I feel like convincing lions to eat carrot instead of meat :>

[Lordus]

 All VSB gang is made of pure PvP players. That is the reason, why VSB exist. Every time, when devs add another restriction, people leave our faction. Kind of people, who made 10 combat chars in first era, 5 combat chars in second era. They were good teamates, very good players. They tested this game a lot and they had a fun from this. But from third era, from experience decreasing measure, many of them leave, because they did not want to spend most of their free time to have combat ready char.

 Maybe, problem is somewhere else than in "magic level 21". Problem is, that in current combat system, where you can be killed by 3 bursts with minigun or by one instakill, you NEED to be lvl 18+ to play PvP. I suggested many changes. Well, is problem to create combat system where you will give dmg 20-50 instead of 70-120? Yes, it is, because you will have to reduce big guns, or "ban them", most people will have to use assault rifles (like in real army) instead of miniguns and rocket launchers.... I admit, that i dont have any experience from other MMORPG, but i think that if you design combat game (entertatining, not frustrating) you have 2 choices: quick death and very quick recovery or long fights. This game does not offers anything from my choices. Because of that, many players started to alting, fast reloging, making pure PvP char is obligatory if you want to raise your chance of survive by little percent. And developers, naturaly, restricted those game abusers, but they did not aim their focus on the core of the problem. It is like healing fewer using aspirin, but ignoring the pneumonia.

 I admit, that there are kind of players, who are crafting, then they loose their stuff because quite better PK, maybe next day they will kill him, but i dont know, if this is the aimed spectrum of players for who is Fonline developed. Dont forget on PvP players, they are here in first week after wipe as well as last week before next one, so far.