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[T-888]

T-888 you are wrong.

Just because some new players didn't find it discouraging to level up multiple alts, grind gear, bases etc. etc. to fight doesn't mean it applies to all players and gangs, i saw your list of faction, few new players, that is not some achievement to be proud of or proves me wrong.

For the billionth time, they can't stop fr so it's better that everyone can do it.

For the infinitive time, FR wasn't ever that common, usually those were small cells that generally didn't have high impact on gameplay, just don't start giving examples from years ago or for that matter point fingers to some factions. I just know already what to write and how to argument all this.

FR in PvP = BAD

[Roachor]

game is infinitely better without having to wait ten minutes every time you switch alts, pvp isn't everything

[T-888]

and that doesn't mean the waiting shouldn't be there, but just not when you aren't fighting.

[manero]

game is infinitely better without having to wait ten minutes every time you switch alts...

It was 3 minutes.

[Daryl]

They shoul stop fast relogging, like I said your 15 guys U kill there 15 but U gotta fight another 100 people its bullshit, it shoul go bk to 3 mins

[AdolphbinStalin]

Maybe there should be a 2-3 limit of characters per IP/IP range.

I know when we set up PvP games in Fallout Tactics we prefer even teams; just more fun to know you have won due to skills and not because you outnumbered the other team. A win when you have more in numbers is expected; nothing skillful about that- it only demonstrates lack of skills if you loose.

I play other PvP games and its always preferable/more of a challenge/fun when teams are even and players are all of good skills.

[naossano]

What would be the point of forcing players to use proxies ?

There are multiple interpretation about what kind of gamestyle Fonline is fitted, but in any of these styles, alts are needed.
Unless you're a GM, you will always need a new kind of build for any specific purpose...
Game is what it is. If you want to limit characters by players, you will have to limit the need of these characters.
By doing so, you may also remove some diversity in types of characters...

[Blazekin]

Maybe there should be a 2-3 limit of characters per IP/IP range.

I really like that idea. You'd have to choose what kind of characters you want carefully, and also would need to have more friends for more variety of character types for different situations.

[avv]

If you simply add 3 minutes timer on death in pvp, it will be bypassed. People who think this timer will solve everything will just be even angrier when they will face cheaters who shamelessly bypass this artificial obstacle.

If proxy is too laggy for pvp gaming, it will be used for spawning mercs.

Perhaps the game should try to aim towards improving a single character contiguously rather than making alts for everything and increasing the pvp strength with relog-alts.

But in the end the game will always boil down to one fact: farmers gonna farm. Only place where everyone is almost equal is hinkley.

[Bulldog]

Would love to see the GM's enforce the fast-relog rule that would state that fast-relog should not give an advantage in pvp combat. They could just ban every single char that has been used at that moment by the rule-breaker. I know, proxies-blah-blah. Back in the days I've been caught even using proxy, all it takes is a little more attention on the GM side. I realize that there are not enough "active" GM's at the moment, perhaps we need some responsible people who are willing to watch the player base for fast-relog at least in TC combat? They don't have to have all the GM options, just some monitoring tools. I know the idea written in the text above is kind of old, but still, if well thought, it could solve the problem to a certain degree. At least it could be given a try, it's a beta after all.

[AdolphbinStalin]

Would love to see the GM's enforce the fast-relog rule that would state that fast-relog should not give an advantage in pvp combat. They could just ban every single char that has been used at that moment by the rule-breaker. I know, proxies-blah-blah. Back in the days I've been caught even using proxy, all it takes is a little more attention on the GM side. I realize that there are not enough "active" GM's at the moment, perhaps we need some responsible people who are willing to watch the player base for fast-relog at least in TC combat? They don't have to have all the GM options, just some monitoring tools. I know the idea written in the text above is kind of old, but still, if well thought, it could solve the problem to a certain degree. At least it could be given a try, it's a beta after all.

This would work. Its not like the game has 100's of players to watch over. Maybe also give the DM's some fun tools in the form of a 'special gun' that does insta-kill damage to initially deal with any char(s) joining TC after a certain time etc. This will stop the fast-relog. The offending char(s) can then be traced to the player later and a warning given before outright banning  the char (on subsequent offences).

[Brujah]

Would love to see the GM's enforce the fast-relog rule that would state that fast-relog should not give an advantage in pvp combat. They could just ban every single char that has been used at that moment by the rule-breaker. I know, proxies-blah-blah. Back in the days I've been caught even using proxy, all it takes is a little more attention on the GM side. I realize that there are not enough "active" GM's at the moment, perhaps we need some responsible people who are willing to watch the player base for fast-relog at least in TC combat? They don't have to have all the GM options, just some monitoring tools. I know the idea written in the text above is kind of old, but still, if well thought, it could solve the problem to a certain degree. At least it could be given a try, it's a beta after all.

This is extremely easy and doable, especially now with all those "channel zero come help me!" events, people fast-relog shamelessly there.

[T-888]

If you simply add 3 minutes timer on death in pvp, it will be bypassed.

What does "it will be bypassed" mean, process that, think about what happened previous session, think about what is happening now.

I've explained how this is not a reason to not implement such a limitation multiple times now, "it will be bypassed", some unknown players, mole people, they live underground and plan to seize the control of governments and eventually the world, right? Do mole people hurt you? No they don't, even if they existed, they would most probably so few you couldn't give a shit about them.

People who think this timer will solve everything will just be even angrier when they will face cheaters who shamelessly bypass this artificial obstacle.

It'll not solve everything, it solve something.

Yeah and who would they be, "cheaters" tell me who would be those who would still come with multiple waves in TC just like now and ruin everyone's day? Even better tell me by what do you mean "bypass", what is that? I understand on basic level, but if you went into more details, please?

I just want to hear the big, magic flaw how FR CD will not achieve anything?

[Fat Man]

What does "it will be bypassed" mean, process that, think about what happened previous session, think about what is happening now.

Means somebody well use proxy address or remake the dual log/fast relog cheat program which modify fonline.exe and was able to open a new window with multiple .bat files. 

I've explained how this is not a reason to not implement such a limitation multiple times now, "it will be bypassed", some unknown players, mole people, they live underground and plan to seize the control of governments and eventually the world, right? Do mole people hurt you? No they don't, even if they existed, they would most probably so few you couldn't give a shit about them.

o0

[youtube]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykWPyaqbebo
[youtube]

Look best option is to give everybody same advantage do not think ban hammering everybody who use fast relogs and dual logs solves anything.

I think you shouldn't be able log in and out of game when replication timer is on, and if you try to ctrl-alt-delete and close program that way it won't let you on until that character disapears in game. Just figure out what causes "character with this login already in game" bug and work with that. Its sheer laziness its either put an effort into fixing fast relog and dual logs or say fuck it don't enforce such rules, less work.

[avv]

What I mean with bypassing is using multilog or proxy to avoid the timer.
In last session people did multilog and fastrelog in pvp, not at the same scale as now but it was more annoying because I was playing clean and there were people cheating in pvp and it was rarely punished.

Yeah and who would they be, "cheaters" tell me who would be those who would still come with multiple waves in TC just like now and ruin everyone's day?

Hell if I know, but what's certain is that there will be people doing it. It's common knowledge that if there's something you can do to gain advantage over others, it will be used. If the players are tempted to cheat, it shouldn't be surprising that some will do it.

I just want to hear the big, magic flaw how FR CD will not achieve anything?

You ain't gonna hear that from me because I never said it's not gonna help at all. Just said it's flawed way to fix pvp fastrelog because it can be bypassed.