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Knock outs

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Sarakin:
@Mayck
Are you sure about these calculations ? I remember times (I agree, it was quite a long time ago), when i received KO and because of full AP, I could get on my feet instantenously (thus, those numbers would be absolute substraction, not final value)

Roachor:

--- Quote from: JovankaB on September 30, 2012, 09:15:18 pm ---I just tested it with a character similar to your Zombies. Killed a 500 HP BoS in PA with one MPF.
Yes, you might run out of ammo (if you get lucky you don't), but you can still manage to switch to 2nd hand and finish BoS off
(tried that too, it's doable). Remember this is one of the strongest NPCs in the game, so what exactly do you expect?
That you will just easily punch them with bare fists with no risk involved whatsoever?

You can still farm them alone with a HH character, just not a bare handed one.

--- End quote ---

The whole point of unarmed characters is they don't have to be armed, sure its fun for you just spawning items but honestly go get a mpf and see how long it takes. HH are already weak due to low damage (unless you have fast shot im talking 3dmg punches vs ca) and since hh builds are so special heavy you cant have luck, which means enjoy dropping your powerfist. I use spiked knuckles mainly because i can craft one on the spot from scienced guns if I get lucky dismantling and can re-equip relatively quickly. SEC is one of the most annoying ammo types in the game to get other than 7.62 and is only farmable far from populated areas, hell I have mfc just piling up and sec is scarce. Fact is HH build with MPF is still not on par with a pvp build and pvp builds are way easier to equip.

Mayck:

--- Quote from: Sarakin on October 01, 2012, 03:08:50 pm ---@Mayck
Are you sure about these calculations ? I remember times (I agree, it was quite a long time ago), when i received KO and because of full AP, I could get on my feet instantenously (thus, those numbers would be absolute substraction, not final value)

--- End quote ---
Yep I am sure... The substraction was here sometime ago. What we have now is (in)convinient side-effect of cancelling the chaining of the KOs (back then AP could be substracted to very high negative values).

Sarakin:
Seriously, who makes these ridiculous changes ? If you ask me, KOs should be only -MaxAP.

avv:

--- Quote from: Roachor on October 01, 2012, 03:24:45 pm ---Fact is HH build with MPF is still not on par with a pvp build
--- End quote ---

And won't be. Because unarmed can only do damage in onehex range it automatically has less options in combat. The more range, the more options in combat. But utilizing these options is up to the player and his personal skill set. So that trying to compensate the lack of options with raw numerical bonuses like pure damage can't work because skill and buffs can't fit the same scale.

You can't balance or make it fun a fighting style which only option to win is to get close. It's the most predictable strategy ever.

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