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[JovankaB]

Arcomage is a card minigame from Might & Magic 7. It's quite enjoyable to play, actually so enjoyable it was released as standalone game later, because people were visiting inns in M&M7 only to play it. I think it could be implemented as Tragic. From game design pov, it's no-brainer, the minigame is proven to have fun factor and rules + deck exist already. The hard part is scripting and changing graphics/style of cards.

Except that it's not collectible, the cards fit FOnline:2238 lore suprisingly well. Just look:



You can see whole original Arcomage deck here

Although my cards propositions may look like a joke, WHOLE SUGESSTION IS NOT A JOKE.
I really think it's pretty cool idea, because minigame design is actually quite hard and this one is ready.

[Lexx]

Can you provide a more detailed description of how exactly the game works?

[Crazy]

Sounds kinda fun. Finally something to bet on at Ascorti's or New Reno casinos!

But why not using directly Magic modified card/rules (as it's where the "Tragic" come from) ?

[JovankaB]

As far as I know MtG is patented (!!!) and they go apeshit about any knock-offs.
Besides I never played MtG, so I couldn't suggest it

Also collectible card game would require a lot more cards and I think would be harder to implement.

About presenting the rules, sure I will write it later when I have more time along with more serious proposition how to make it Falloutish and maybe even a proposition how a card could look.

[RavenousRat]

But why not using directly Magic modified card/rules (as it's where the "Tragic" come from) ?

That would be nice, too bad this "mini"-game will consume too much time to implement, if only it'll have only few cards but then it'll be boring.
Even PC MTG Shandalar is a game itself lacks a lot content and it's boring to play after 1-2 days.
About Arcomage, I'm playing Arcomage with other people almost everyday in a browser game based on heroes5, of course it requires tactic and experience, but still, there's too much randomness, like in whole FOnline >_>
After playing some days in Arcomage you'll know what cards enemy have, and when each card will come (if you're playing with 1 deck), so if both players know that game well, it's pure random. It's easier and faster just to roll dice and you win on 1-3 and enemy wins on 4-6, I think that game requires less time to implement and can be played even now with dices.
+How MTG or Arcomage will be implemented in FOnline, too much work for interface. Really much work. Easier will be make Pazaak from Star Wars, if each player will have a deck with different cards which he can collect/trade, base deck will have only +1/+2/+3/+4/+5 cards, you can buy - and -/+ etc. this will be easier.
Not Arcomage nor Pazaak are from fallout, and making MTG will require too much work (btw Arcomage too).

[T-888]

Ahh yes arcomage , might and magic 7 one of my favorite rpg's , good times

I think it would be awesome , but i don't think that it is worth implementing due to the amount of work needed.

[Sarakin]

Isnt Arcomage trademark owned by someone as well ? (formerly 3DO, now dunno)

MTG Shandalar is old as hell and even if there are just several card editions (you got shitloads of expansion sets and editions nowadays) I found it pretty entertaining.

Anyway if someone is willing to work on it, why not.

Can you provide a more detailed description of how exactly the game works?

There is just one deck, both players have the same cards and the victory is determined mainly by randomness of the cards you get and how you gonna spend them.
Theres a tower which you must protect with its counter and a wall. When your tower reaches 0 or 100 you lose/win. By having 3 types of resources with their generators, you use cards to either fortify yourself and gain resource advantage or crush foe´s tower and his economy.

[JovankaB]

Also, one resource provides mostly attacks, other mostly defense, and third.... I don't remember what.


Trademark is one thing, patent is another. Trademark protects only name.

About game rules, in M&M7 they were slightly different in every inn, which required different playing tactics.
Also I think player and NPC had it's own decks (with same cards) but I'm not sure about it.

Yea it's quite random but not as much as gambling checks and player still has enough control to make it interesting.

[RavenousRat]

Isnt Arcomage trademark owned by someone as well ? (formerly 3DO, now dunno)

There're alot parodies on that game, in Space Rangers 2 you can play it in some text quest, but you have base instead of tower, shield instead of wall and of course other resources, etc. The game where I'm playing Arcomage it has the same card names, there's simply no word about "Arcomage", it's just called "card game", and everything is ok.

About rules, it's different, 100 tower is usually too much. Most used is starting 20 tower and 5 wall, 5 of each resource and 2 income, you need to get tower to 50 or all resources to 150 (noone never done this) or get opponents tower to 0 or less.

The tactic is very easy, as you both have the same deck and all cards are unique and only in 1 piece, it means if you have card A, your enemy can't have it until you use/drop it and the deck ends and cycle will start again. Don't drop cards that are useless for you but useful for your enemy and he'll never get it, don't rase your wall on more than ~5-10 if you don't have "Shift" card in your hand, or else enemy will change your and his walls if you'll have too high wall, if only you haven't used that card recently and don't let enemy to get tower >29 if you don't have "Dragon's Eye" card, because it's the only card that raises tower on 20. It means that tactic is very easy, and unfortunately you can't affect gameplay much, it's just who's more lucky.

[JovankaB]

The tactic is very easy, as you both have the same deck and all cards are unique and only in 1 piece

Then I'm quite sure that it's a bit different than in M&M7, because you had some double cards there.
Also it could be the case that each player had it's own deck, but I don't remember.

[RavenousRat]

Then I'm quite sure that it's a bit different than in M&M7, because you had some double cards there.
Also it could be the case that each player had it's own deck, but I don't remember.

Well then it's even more random, if each player will have his own deck, then there's no tactic at all, as you're both can do the same things, simply if you're getting better cards than your opponent, you'll win. I think 2 decks are really stupid to play. Also I can't remember well Arcomage in M&M7/8 as I played only once in each tavern just to earn gold and complete quest, and 11 games aren't much+playing with bot is a bit... boring and I wasn't interested much in this game in M&M7/8.

[skejwen]

If theres is any legal issue then its not about trademark or patent but its all about ip (intellectual property). Beside I would rather see it in fallout design and not related to 2238 in any way

[JovankaB]

If theres is any legal issue then its not about trademark or patent but its all about ip (intellectual property).

I think it's not that simple. IP is a basket for all kinds all laws. If you mean copyrights:

See: http://www.copyright.gov/fls/fl108.html

Copyright does not protect the idea for a game, its name or title, or the method or methods for playing it. Nor does copyright protect any idea, system, method, device, or trademark material involved in developing, merchandising, or playing a game. Once a game has been made public, nothing in the copyright law prevents others from developing another game based on similar principles. Copyright protects only the particular manner of an author’s expression in literary, artistic, or musical form.

Material prepared in connection with a game may be subject to copyright if it contains a sufficient amount of literary or pictorial expression.

Rules in a sense of game system can be patented if it's a new invention. Expression of these rules - the text in rulebook is copyrighted. But you can express the same rules in another way, with other words etc.

If copyright was enough, noone would patent new board games.

[Sarakin]

Trademark, patent, IP.. you all know what was meant here - if it can be fully used in other projects.

[Grommok]

Well, i was about to suggest making Tragic playable... so i like this suggestion. We need more "vanity" items to make the game more appealing-satisfing-funny.