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[Lordus]

BIG GUNS vs SMALL GUNS



 BIG GUNS vs SMALL GUNS

 If you have PVP combat experince, you know, that there are only 2 real combat classes. The BIG GUNS with a lot of firepower and
big number of action points and in oposite, SMALL GUNS snipers with single shots and criticall rolls. For PvP there is nothing
between. (LASER snipers were similar to SG snipers.. big luck).

 But in fonline there are many guns, bullets and shells. So why not try change some of them and maybe little edit some combat
mechanics to balance it. Some of this changes may be implemented now, some after next wipe. At least i hope it will be inspiration for others.


 I understad that many players like firepower of big guns, minuguns, LSW, avengers. Ok then, let the firepower stay at this level
and change something else to balance the game.

 1. Lower the range of big guns and raise the range for assault rifles weapon class.

          LSW      from 40 to 35
   Minigun  from 35 to 30
   Avenger from 40 to 35 hex.

        Assault rifle   single from 45 to 40
         burst from 38 to 35
   FN FAL      single from 35 to 40
         burst from 30 to 35
   XL 70E3   single from 35 to 45
         burst from 30 to 40

  Assault rifles will get little advantage against BG with this range modification. But in most fights in cities, streets, buildings will BG still dominating. So there must be additional changes.

 2. Add bigger magazines for as. riffle class (30 ammo instead of 20) and let them burst 10 piecies of ammo instead of 8.

 3. Add 2 action points to reload the big guns. (+2 AP to reload BG)

 4. Disable fast shot trait. Traits should add advantage in one way and disadvantage in other way. But for biggunners, there is
only advantage. So for biggunners this is not trait, but 1 free perk. Free perk for most powerfull and dominating class of weapons.
Is this neccesary?

 5. Add (enable) bonus rate of fire perk -1 AP

 6. Add aimed small guns burst perk.

 This perk will add special kind of attack for assault rifle class. 3 aimed shots, 0-3 hits (depends on luck...), every shot 1/3
damage, criticall roll for all hits, chance to hit another body part (except eyes),burst range (except XL 70E3 - single range),
+1/(eyes) AP instead of classic burst.
 
 7. Rain in city (encounter) = -1 PE
 
 8. Night = -2 PE (Twiligiht = -1 PE)

 9. Night sight as. riffles class upgrade (reduce the night -2 PE to only -1 and -1 twilight PE to 0 penalty). Only for as. rifle
class.

[Vindict]

I like your idea... probably because I'm a small gunner. Big gunners won't like it 

But perhaps I shouldn't state my opinion... I don't have much pvp expierience ( other than being killed ) yet.

I'd also like to see more shotguns and pistols in use.


There is also one more thing... something I want more than anything.... something I could sell my soul for..... SNIPER PERK ( and how it worked in fallout 2 ) .... it's probably imba, I know

[Lordus]

I know that some of guns are only good for leveling nad others are good for PvP. At this moment, there is only 1 usable small gun for PvP = sniper rifle. And this is shame.

[Quentin Lang]

I see some BG worshiping trolls incoming. Anyway, the suggestions good except

4. Disable fast shot trait. Traits should add advantage in one way and disadvantage in other way. But for biggunners, there is
only advantage. So for biggunners this is not trait, but 1 free perk. Free perk for most powerfull and dominating class of weapons.
Is this neccesary?

Fast shot actually is the essence and main perk of BGs. Disabling it would pretty much break the gun class.

[Solar]

No, BG without Fast Shot is good. Fast Shot is just a no brainer because you can't aim with Big Guns anyway. I'd like to see Fast Shot affect only guns that are capable of aiming honestly.

         LSW      from 40 to 35
   Minigun  from 35 to 30
   Avenger from 40 to 35 hex.

We had the same idea a few days ago, this has been the case for 2 or 3 days.

For Assault Rifles, well, we need to do something, but I don't think changing their range will be it. Perhaps an increase to to their base damage, maybe an increase to magazines. We shall see what Mr Atom says about it when I bug him next  

But keep the ideas coming, we may steal the good ones

[gordulan]

yeah, fast shot and bonus ROF should be small guns reserved, if that happens you'll see more people using the small guns, (more commando builds)

[Lordus]

please, add range at least for   XL 70E3. The most expensive riffle witu bull pop and scope and it has lower range that assault rifle. This does not make sense..

[Solar]

please, add range at least for   XL 70E3. The most expensive riffle witu bull pop and scope and it has lower range that assault rifle. This does not make sense..

Well, either that or make it hit hard enough to deserve the shorter range.

[Szef]

XL 07:

This was an experimental weapon at the time of the war. Manufactured, primarily, from high-strength polymers, the weapon is almost indestructible. It's light, fast firing, accurate, and can be broken down without the use of any tools.


Add more durability? (almost indestructible)
Decrease weight? (light)
Decrease burst cost? (fast firing!!!!)
It's accurate already - so maybe burst range should be = single? (accurate)
Make its disassembling return whole parts used? (-50 or -100 science req.?)

[Attero]

i think the solution should lie alswere... but it would requrie some heavy code changes that im not sure if devs are capable of doing

say why to keep so meany weapon skills ? why not adjust it so one can use multiple weapon types and he is only limited by perks / traits ?
i mean
small guns , big guns , energy weapons = aimed weapons
rocket lunchers and thrown - balistic
unarmed & melee = melee weapons.

then one would be capable of using big guns and small guns and he would be only limited by what he has on him / carry weight

Rifles should never be  near in power to miniguns - that would make no sense. and while they are such they make BG exclusive / expensive (avengers LSW non craftable). But it still wont stop people from making power characters and so there would be no stop this way either.
the only way i see o balance here is to narrow the weapon skills so a SG user can use miniguns and other way around ;].

[Lordus]

Another unpopular idea.. NO RUN for biggunners. If you have big gun in your action slot, you can not run..

[Crazy]

What a good idea! Add all these suggestions!
... But don't be surprise when all player gonna open thousand of topic "Small Guns Cheated" or "Give interest to Big Gun?".
Man with those suggestions Big Guns just gonna become useless. They are very expansive and their ammo too, Big Guns builds are hard to pex, you can't run with them, they have mid range, they cost an indecent cost of PA... What are their advantage after that?

But it's true the XL 07 need some improvement, too useless now.

For me good ideas: improvement of range of SG, more damage for shotguns.

[gordulan]

maybe also boost the range of the h&k caws and jackhammer by 4 hexes?

[vedaras]

i like only one idea, but i think it is great, big gunners cannot run!

[Yamcha]

BIG GUNS vs SMALL GUNS


 1. Lower the range of big guns and raise the range for assault rifles weapon class.

          LSW      from 40 to 35
   Minigun  from 35 to 30
   Avenger from 40 to 35 hex.

Just decreasing the accuracy would do the trick, so its only effective in low range