FOnline Development > 3D Development

3D complaints / criticism / suggestions

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Luther Blissett:
There's a few bits of "3D is shit" type off-topic discussions spread around the forum. Thought it might be useful to put a thread in here for such discussions.

I know some people will just never like the 3D work, and that's fine - I'm not expecting this to turn into a magical thread where people change their minds, but if anyone just dislikes it for a few smaller reasons, maybe that's fixable. If anyone's got genuine constructive criticism about the work being done here, it would be useful to hear it.

If we spend hours adjusting and rigging a model to put in game, and it turns out it wasn't good enough in the first place, it would have been a lot more useful to know that it wasn't good enough hours earlier. Same with other areas - are there too many / not enough new models? How close are the models to the existing sprites, and how could they be made better? What about the animations, the lighting, the textures? Are some of the models too good, to the extent that they look out of place in the game?

Please don't turn this into a trolling thread, but if there are people who dislike the 3D work for a specific reason, maybe we can improve or change things to make them better. I'm pretty sure most people want this to be as good as possible, and when you've worked on something for a long time, it's sometimes hard to spot the flaws in your own work any more.

Again, please don't troll or insult forum members' work. People have worked hard on these, and most are still learning as they go (especially me), but if there's something you really feel needs improvement, it's better to know sooner rather than later.

RavenousRat:
Some people don't like 3D, because it doesn't look like 2D, in original fallout, even if you'll make less smooth animation, make it more "pixeled", etc. still it'll be 3D, and 3D isn't 2D. It'll be something new, those people who never played fallout before and, don't really know why, are playing FOnline playing it for thier reasons, they won't care about 3D, and those who played before and now playing FOnline for the same reason as 1st mentioned people, won't care about 3D too as they're playing FOnline without caring about fallout. If people are playing FOnline because they want to play fallout and fallout isn't more interesting for them much, they will care and won't like 3D.

Other people are saying that it's not fallout anymore, as it's not rpg, you can't play your role in some storyline, you can't be thief, lockpicker, tribal or hunter, if you'll "try" to roleplay, it'll look ridiculous here in FOnline. Roleplay possible when you're, usually friends, co-operative completing usually single-player campaign in some rpg game where each of you playing some role in "party" and doing thier actions based on thier aligment/class/whatever or whoever you RPing, choosing thier dialogue options and doing needed actions through whole game. It makes you feel as how you would do actions in that world if you were that character. In arcanum co-op mod you can roleplay dwarf who likes to drink, elf who doesn't like dwarves and technology, or a thief robbing stores at night who will have problems after and other players (as they are one party) will have to do something with it (usually it ends with slaughter whole town, but oh well...). I can't imagine roleplaying in mmo where all actions are player based, if you're RPing in place where are only players, you, probably, doing something wrong, as it's easier to live in real life and talk with people there. So those people (who are saying it's not fallout anymore) don't care if it'll lose something from original fallout as it's not original fallout long time ago and they're playing it as other game.

This way 3D will be disliked by people who wanted to play fallout but with other people, not alone in singleplayer with the same story over and over that they know. And there's nothing can be done, if only 3D will look very very very very very similar to 2D without adding other things, but then... why do need to make it 3D if it'll be look like before without changes? Those people don't need long hair dudes or bald dudes or running supermuties or pinksuits or brown CAs, character description on binoculars will be enough and ability to play some role in game and good old 2D sprites from fallout.

Lexx:

--- Quote ---even if you'll make less smooth animation, make it more "pixeled", etc. still it'll be 3D, and 3D isn't 2D.
--- End quote ---

Did you ever played Commandos 2? Unlike Commandos 1, which was 100% 2D graphics, Commandos 2 uses pre-rendered backgrounds and 3D animated figures. But: Due to it's render technic, it looks nearly 1:1 like the original 2D graphics, which was pretty cool.

So... it is not impossible to achieve a result that is very close to the original. You won't fit it 1:1, that's just impossible. But the advantages are still bigger than any disadvantage.


--- Quote ---character description on binoculars will be enough and ability to play some role in game and good old 2D sprites from fallout.
--- End quote ---
I really doubt this. Checking the description box and all is just way too artifical, time consuming and fiddly. Not even Fallout and Fallout 2 have done this all the time. Various characters had unique models-- Gizmo, Lou, Lynette, Vic, etc. The problem is, all these rendered graphics are using a lot space, which is also the reason why a lot got cut out.

pistacja:
For player characters it's 3d or bust. There's so much pro and so little con.
But still I don't like where the 3d dev is going. Items in 3d will kill the framerate. I just don't belive that fo has the needed options to combine 500-800 items in every tent and base into few geoms. There's no gpu on the market that can render that many independent objects at more then 5-10fps.
Items should stay 2d, for non-weapon-type-items in pc hands a small box, medium box, large box is all that is needed. Time spent making items that will be 4x4px in game is just waisted.

Creatures can also stay 2d. There's no need to customize ghuls, mutants or dogs.

The 3d dev team should focus on PCs and finish all that needs to be done with armours, weapons, hair, phenotypes, animations, etc before even thinking of making anything else.


 

JovankaB:

--- Quote ---Creatures can also stay 2d. There's no need to customize ghuls, mutants or dogs.
--- End quote ---

Yes I don't get why devs made rats and deathclaws 3D for example.
What's the purpose of this, besides lowering framerate? You can't rotate camera anyway.

Especially with rats difference is hardly noticeable and I wouldn't exactly say it looks better.
Animation is a bit more smooth, that's all.

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