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[gr1m099]

Maybe this belongs is suggestions but...

I think next wipe should have the same crafting cool down as it does now. It makes no sense to me why it we have to wait 1:30minutes to craft a combat armor and then another hour after making a brotherhood armor. 3 hours between making each armor is ridiculous. For us town controllers and faction fighters the old cooldowns would take days or even a week to even obtain a decent amount of gear. I think they should keep it the way it is now after wipe so there is more fighting and more action for PvP. I also think it makes it a better game when crafting cool down it is the way now.

Or I think maybe the profession should cost more to obtain or require more skill points so you have to level the character more than 6 levels to get each profession.

PvP is so fast paced that what takes like an entire day or even a week crafting is lost in minutes. I think the crafting cooldown should not change after wipe.

[Kelin]

But what pvp faction "craft" armors, dude

I think every pvp faction. It is the only way how to get BA (yes you can loot it from your enemies but what if your enemies don't carry it? Someone had to craft it, anyway)

I remember when I lost like 7-8 BAs during one day. So like 20 hours of crafting (if you use one crafter alt) and you lose your armors in 3 hours. Personally I absolutely love this crafting cooldown until now I never crafted any armor and was carrying only armors I could loot or buy. Now I craft almost every day and you know what? I enjoy it!

[Michaelh139]

I think every pvp faction. It is the only way how to get BA (yes you can loot it from your enemies but what if your enemies don't carry it? Someone had to craft it, anyway)

I remember when I lost like 7-8 BAs during one day. So like 20 hours of crafting (if you use one crafter alt) and you lose your armors in 3 hours. Personally I absolutely love this crafting cooldown until now I never crafted any armor and was carrying only armors I could loot or buy. Now I craft almost every day and you know what? I enjoy it!

By god this is exactly how I feel about the new cooldowns as well.  I actually made an Armorer for once in my lifetime.

A bomber too!

[Luther Blissett]

... and then every single character in the "wasteland" (the wasteland where the people have almost nothing, and struggle daily for basic resources such as food and water) can have 30 BA stored at his tent - but then so will the opposition, so you'll need MORE, so the cooldowns will need cutting further... and further and further...

Apologies for slight sarcasm, but I think the idea behind the cooldowns was meant to try and restrict the availability of weapons and armour, so you didn't end up with each individual character being personally armed as well as the military of a small country (or as said "decent amount of gear")

Really, nobody should have 7 or 8 BA in the first place - you should feel pretty lucky if you've got a single copy of anything better than a leather jacket (though currently this is clearly not the case). You shouldn't be able to "pop out" a new top quality armour every few hours.

Anyway, though I think it's been agreed that the cooldown method doesn't quite work, and changes are needed somehow, I have a feeling that if the lower cooldowns are kept, something else will be put in place to try and discourage massive stores of weapons, ammo and armour (there's been thoughts regarding gathering in the dev blog, it may be that something similar is done with crafting) - so either way, it's probably not going to end up like you're hoping.

[gr1m099]

I am in disagreement and I do not like realism in video games. I get the impression you are more of a roleplayer than a town control fighter.

I assume that you have not PvP or town control and do not know how irritating it is to spend days playing this game getting a good stock pile of gear to lose it all in less than 3 hours if you lose a fight. Or maybe you do I do not know, its my assumption. I think the current cool downs are good more town control and more day-to-day PvP fighting.

This game is built around PvP, it was originally called factions or gangs mods or something so it makes sense that it should be easier to craft items so there is more PvP fights and it keeps the game exciting.

I mean if we go by that logic "it should be a realistic wasteland" there would be no point in the playing the game because everything would be impossible to obtain and we would all just be fighting each other blue suit unarmed for a 10mm pistol.

I mean in a game where you die and lose your gear and everything in your inventory we should be able to make 3 combat armors an hour.

[Crazy]

When all the stuff is too easy to obtain, loosing it and winning it loose it's taste, and therefore PvP become less interesting. But when it's too hard to get, everyone is afraid of loosing it, which mean less interesting fights.
Good luck to dev to balance this!

[gr1m099]

I think its good the way it is now and they should keep it that way post wipe its in the the middle.

[Luther Blissett]

Personally I like "small group PVE" for my fun, but regardless, I can see what you're saying. It's not one we're personally going to agree on, as our interests are too different.

I think the main problem is that there's 2 (or more) groups of people trying to play 2 (or more) completely different games, using the same game engine and occupying the same universe. It's a balancing nightmare.

There's those who see "getting, building and making the stuff, levelling up etc" as the "actual game" (like playing Fallout 1 or 2, but with lots of quests / characters missing and currently no "endgame").

Then there's those who see "getting, building and making the stuff, levelling up etc" as a really annoying distraction, before they can play the "actual game" i.e. a fallout based isometric shoot-em-up vs other players, with all top equipment (like playing a team deathmatch in Doom, Quake, Return to Castle Wolfenstein or newer games of the same type).

Obviously there's crossovers, there's people who do both and there's other groups such as roleplayers etc, but if we're to simplify things a lot, there's essentially these two very separate "games" within the game, which both have different needs.

Regarding factions mod etc, as far as I'm aware, yes - the first change from the original "Fonline" (other than the language) was to add factions in, and it was called "Factions mod" - so it's true that 2238 is based on a "Factions mod", but whether it's still meant to be that, I'm not so sure. There's been a lot of changes, improvements and development to the game that is not purely PVP related. If you have a run around on an unaltered SDK version, it very quickly becomes apparent how much they've improved and developed throughout ALL of the game.

Ultimately, the devs may decide to focus on one part or another, or they may hunt for the elusive balance where everyone is happy, or perhaps even split into two separate games.

I'm completely in agreement that for what you want from the game, you're right about this suggestion i.e. "in a game where you die and lose your gear and everything in your inventory we should be able to make 3 combat armors an hour". However this spoils the other "game in the game" if that makes sense?

On the other hand :

[...]everything would be impossible to obtain and we would all just be fighting each other blue suit unarmed for a 10mm pistol.

Wasteland is actually harsh? Sounds awesome to me - BUT this would probably spoil your game just as much.

[Josh]

I also agree with keeping the current cooldowns. Large factions will always be able to outfit their senior members in the best while others will have to work for it. The reasonable cooldowns allow start up factions to have access to decent enough equipment to compete in small skirmishes with the rest of the gangs.

[Savager]

I agree whit the new cooldowns, Even now i hate when i lose a BA, so always i carry CA because its cheaper. I think that cooldowns are good balanced now, and i really like this way.

[A concerned wastelander]

Apologies for slight sarcasm, but I think the idea behind the cooldowns was meant to try and restrict the availability of weapons and armour, so you didn't end up with each individual character being personally armed as well as the military of a small country (or as said "decent amount of gear")

Indeed, it was and is even more too easy to mass unlimited stocks of bas, not only cooldowns should be bigger, but tier 3 gear should not be craftable. They should be relics of the past worth fighting for (like gauss pistols or power armors).

[gr1m099]

Nah that's kind of ridiculous and not fun for PvP/TC.

I think tier3 gear should have a 300 skill requirement or cost more caps to make but keep the same cooldown as it is right now.

[A concerned wastelander]

Nah that's kind of ridiculous and not fun for PvP/TC.

I think tier3 gear should have a 300 skill requirement

That would be a nice way to promote alting and discourage players from playing a unique crafter character.

Still, im not saying its ridiculous...

[gr1m099]

Well maybe 300 is too much maybe like 200 or something so you can add other skills. I mean you can make like 50 characters and have tier3 crafting at level 6.

I think having a higher skill requirement makes it to where you have to level a character to level to 15-21 before you can make brotherhood armors and other tier3 gear. Or maybe cool downs should be based on skill requirements like for example if you have 300% repair you can make 5 combat armors or something just an idea for the developers.

[OskaRus]

high skill requirements are bad idea and even devs know it now and are working on mayor changes. Making alt with 300 skill takes three evenings and then you would crap BHs like before.

But presenting serious challenges in getting materials requiring cooperation of players (not just proxies). There are also lot more comfortable ways of getting armours (trading).