Other > News and Announcements
Gathering? Waiting?
OskaRus:
--- Quote from: Fizzle on August 22, 2011, 05:54:36 pm ----- Good Observation! - Then how would they fix that problem?
--- End quote ---
by making some pvp free location. Steal attempt => instakilled by guard, activating dynamite or having one active => instakilled by guard, taking weapon to active hand => instakilled by guard, Lockpick attempt => instakilled by guard (to allow cars and caravans to auction), all mercs => instakilled by guard, and more auction npcs in single auction location.
Lordus:
avv: i disagree. I think that devs should create "scenario" ("script"), full it with obstacles and force players to adopt to that situations. Apopt by raising special skills, preparing and acquiring needed requirement.
I like idea that was implemented in single player Fallout mod, Fallout Of Nevada (http://www.nma-fallout.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=58394).
There are locations of abandoned cities, full of deserted buildings, but doors are locked. So you need lockpick to enter, or to open chest inside. Some of the locations are full of radioactivity, so you need rad x and rad away = investition. I suggest to use little rework geiger computer.. he should show another info. The amount of rad. per. sec. (not the maximum dose you get), so you would see if current place is worthy.
Avv, I think that you look on chars customization in bad way. Of course, they would have to invest some points into neccesary skills, bud they dont need to raise it over 150 or over 100.. This number depends on devs.
You know, at this moment, you are still forced to raise some neccesary skills to survive against beasts and players (any firearm skill is needed, or combo of sneak and throwing, ..). Your hypothetical char with tagged speech, gambling and traps is useless now. Why? Because there are not any obstacles you have to overcome with those skills.
IF this game would be very balanced, i believe that every possible char would have its own way how to survive and live in fonline wasteland. But this is an ilusion, because well known facts (less time of devs, hard to realize, bad form betatesting from players,..). So i would rather see entertaining way, the way i need to adopt to the wasteland condition (well, so surprising that i have to adopt to post nuclear world?) if any new kind of gameplay is granted.
Newbies or other players would still have their own ways.. tier 0 (it could be very wide scale of stuff), trading, .... .
Scypior: I see the fear of alting in devs eyes. Alts were not your original idea. But after two years, there was a lot of time that you could realize that there is nothing to do with and you should change your view of this phenomen. Instead of negative, look at it as an chalenge and positive thing. Again, constructing, developing, testing and using new types of chars are for faction players one of the main reasons why to play fonline.
One example: I like to play SG Sniper. Here is evolution of developement in current era only:
1) post wipe basic sniper without drugs, 10 PE, cca 167 HP, 10 LC, weapon handling, max sniper perks
2) then faction get acces to drugs, so sniper char with buffout, nuka and cig. (more perception because of sharpshooter perk thats replace weapon handling,..). = Best classical sniper char with maximized snipers skill (luck and pe, snipers perks). 12 PE, 1677 HP, 10 LC.
3) When large alliances fought between themselfs, it was obvious that new type of sniper char is needed. Because of huge amount of players in each team durign the fight, sniper char dont need as much to protect himself, rather than focus on damage. So builds with 11 PE, 149(or 14x) HP, 6, 7 luck and "almost dualshot" ability were very popular in those huge battles.
4) After many players left fonline, there were small battles (in New Reno,..) rather than huge ones. So player who wants to enjoy this fights, needs to create char with higher HP to stay as long as possible. So snipers with 220 or 240 HP, with lower luck and PE was designed.
This is simple review of developement of SG sniper build in last era. It would not be possible without alting (creating and using more than one alt per person). It was chalenging, it was reaction on situation. And i unfortunately have to tell you, that i dont think that many devs even know about this. This is reason, why i personaly "little dislike" surf in his game position, because he should be connection between playeres and devs and he should report about this to devs. Devs reactions are: "alts are bad, we need something to do agaisnt them, but we dont know what." But i (faction player) want to see "alts give additional gameplay, we need to support alting in some way".
Sorry for little OT post, but its core is related with gathering :)
Bartosz:
Personally, I do not have nothing against such alts as you've described - you just have various builds, for various occasions, sure it's got little to do with RP, but for that we would need entirely different server rules.
The only thing that would effectively reduce your characters number in such context, would be scrapping point-distribution skill system entirely in favor of item bonuses (isn't it what Diablo3 will be doing?).
The problem with alts is bigger - and it is connected to gathering - when they are just used to bypass some game mechanic (cooldown). Players feel cheated when they have to wait for artificial cooldown, so they are cheating back:)
Andr3aZ:
i just had the idea of cooldowns for gathering bound to the ip, that would fix alting, but ecourage proxy usage :-/
Lordus:
There are two basic principles fighting each others.
1) prevent of enourmous amount of stuff (weapons, ammo, armors, drugs, ...).
It has two variants: 1a) quality prevention and 1b) quantity prevention.
ad 1a) means that as devs. you dont want enviroment, where everybody uses only best stuff
ad 1b) means that as devs. you want to create post apocalyptic enviroment with atmosphere of shortage, also this replace the players afraid of perma death of their char and force player to behave at least carefully (not suicide at all).
2) players should get enough stuff in reasonable time to play their favourite roleplay (pvp, pve, ...).
So you created cooldowns (for gathering, for crafting, for NPC traders stuff respawn, ..). Also you created and balanced weapons (armors, drugs,...) strenght and adequate demand of resources that tries to match the weapons strenght hierarchy.
Better and more stuff, better and more resources = more cooldowns = more time.
But there are players, a lot of them, that see entertainment and gameplay only during actions, that requires only best stuff, otherwise they dont have any chance to succeed.
But also, there are players, a lot of them, that see entertaiment and gameplay in slowly developing of their char, using more and more advanced weapons during the time, until they reach some invisible goal and then they left, or join PvP factions, or ... .
So there exist different groups of players with different demands. Cooldowns is for one group almost useless obstacle that has to be overcomed (alting, proxy, but also in game mechanism.. PK for stuff, tent thiefs, ..). For other group, elimination of cooldowns means elimination of their way how to play Fonline.
So in past, you devs tried to calibrate the level using cooldowns that would be ok for all. I think that this aproach is impossible.
So i suggested the "obstacle system".
ad 1a) In PvE, there would not exist such thing as a best stuff. There could be a types of critters, that needs a specific weapons (i.e. knockback shotguns for wanamingos, flamethrowers for spore plants, emp nades for robots, ..), armors (i.e. fire resistant armor against firegeckons) or stuff (flares, lockpics, geigers, ropes, toolkits).
In PvP, there exist kind of balance of weapons, that will i hope continue. (I hope at least 2 or 3 usable weapons in PvP per each weapons skill). Also i suggested low equip locations for PvP (=> not such thing as a best stuff..).
So in general, there should not exist one best stuff item.
ad 1b) Quantity should be reduced in that way, that high tier stuff needs investment of low tier ones (as i wrote in previous posts).
Cooldowns are not needed. They are replaced by obstacles: a) critters (kill, eliminate, disarm, run thru) b) time to get acquire lower tier stuff you need to invest to get higher tier. c) char. developement to survive those obstacles.
Alts in current way are not needed. Chars for mining (scav.) needs to level up to adequate level and because of no cooldowns, only one char is enough (until you develop best type of char for overcome the obstacles, but then you dont need your first alt anyway).
Solo players would have their mountain, they could climb up. PvP players dont need to climb up whole mountain. If they need tier max stuff (i.e. sniper and kevlar armor in mariposa military base stores), they need only emp nades, el. lockpick and science skill to disable some defences. They can trade emp nades with other players for other stuff, from npcs, they dont needs directly start from tier 0 dungeons to fet tier 1 stuff, than tier 2, tier 3 until tier max. They dont need the climb the rock, they can bivouac just under the peak(trading with other players, NPCs,..). Do you undestand me?
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