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[Badger]

Problem with this game is that you don't know which level is

Awareness does that pretty easily. Then you look at their gear and connect the dots. You can usually get a rough idea.

I like the idea that some gear is destroyed on PK. I don't want to deny all loot, but I think full loot for every kill might also be too much. Maybe gear is destroyed with all guns, proportional to how far past -20hp the character was killed. If he was pushed down to -150hp regardless of what gun the attacker used, there's not going to be much left.

[RJ]

@up

Do you really belive that people will be good boys and take this kinda useless perk when they can take something that is actually usefull during whole game (toughness for example) just to check if one is new player or not? It should be implemented for everyone (not awarness but that info I suggested in my earlier post).

[naskiel32]

Do you really belive that people will be good boys and take this kinda useless perk when they can take something that is actually usefull during whole game (toughness for example) just to check if one is new player or not? It should be implemented for everyone (not awarness but that info I suggested in my earlier post).

Awareness useless? u shitin me? i got that on my chars and its great. For me  fighting and slavery without it is a pain in ass. i dissagre with idea of "implemented for everyone" u want it u take it that all

[archaon98]

This is what i think

There should be some sort of option until a certain level that enables or disables PVP for example

>PK'er targets player
<Text pops up for player asking "Enable PVP?"
>The player chooses "No"
<Combat is avoided

and then when the player gets to a level when he can handle himself well against other players, that option vanishes.

[gordulan]

what level?

[naskiel32]

well for lvl 1-3 not more  but its kinda not fonline thing imo u know "wasteland is cruel" and  "only strong will survive" 

[gordulan]

well, i personally would suggest lvl 5 to be the final "avoidance" level, but then again it can be abused.

[Nyan]

@RJ
lol, yeah after the world ends people craft and gather ammo only to gain something as a reward. wasteland is harsh - the main use for ammo and guns should be surviving, gaining big amounts of loot ought to be luxury not and everyday thing.
Also i'm kind of against the -hp idea, because let's say a sniper will shoot you in the head *puff* suddenly your rubber shoes, tragic cards and knife are destroyed because he critically hit you for 345. Yet damage should be used as a modifier

low damage yet killing burst - 30% for destruction
high dmg burst - 60-80%
explosion (rocket, nade, explosives) - 60-80%
plasma weapons - 50 %
plasma when melting you - 100%
electrical weapons (i dont remember the names, those which shock you) - 70% for destroying electronic stuff, works like EMP
flamer - leather, paper, wood - 80 %

all ammo, nades, bombs, rockets, bottles should explode with 100% rate after hit by fire or explosion

[Crazy]

Hum, guys, you know, when someone explode with a rocket his armor is lost, same if the plasma kill him, and pretty often when I kill with minigun, the armor or the weapon of my ennemy is broken, sometimes beyond repair.
Very bad idea for me to disable loot.

[Badger]

The reason I suggested it be damage based is that otherwise I can see the people who kill for gear just switching out to sniper builds.

@RJ
wasteland is harsh - the main use for ammo and guns should be surviving, gaining big amounts of loot ought to be luxury not and everyday thing.

I agree with this wholeheartedly. And far as I'm concerned, losing all your stuff when you die is hardcore. But your killer getting absolutely everything you were carrying isn't. If anything, it's easy. Just shoot a guy in the head when he's a lot weaker than you and you get a whole bunch of stuff you barely had to work for. EASYMODE.

[Forrest]

How about loot gets scattered and damaged instead of falling on the spot where the guy explodes? That would be much better than no loot at all.

I like that idea best but i think the items should get damaged by 60-80% along with the scatter idea

[RJ]

@Nyan

Survival says thief-bomber You play this game your way and I want to play this game my way.
Until there will be some means of surviving done by devs I don't want any of those suggested changes happening. It will result in less PvP between gangs which is intention of devs (well we got town control, right?) because not everyone will want to spend their time on crafting new armors that will get destroyed in a first firefight AND you won't be able to get them back later (if you died loot goes to enemy and you can still killl him later and get back your armor and what you suggest is that loot is lost so it doesn't go circle between players).

@naskiel32

Of course it got it's advantages (displays weapon name, max/current health and if gun is loaded) but it seems you didn't read carefuly enough what I wrote (look at part down). Still I belive that awarness got limited use even for slaver.

I didn't say to implement awarness for everyone only to implement system that when you look at someone it displays additional info than "He looks unhurt". It would be something that when you look at someone additional info appear in messagebox like for higher levels: "He looks unhurt. You feel aura of confidence from him." and for lower levels: "He looks unhurt. He seems to be scarred and a bit confused." <- now improve this and we will have a bit less 21 lvl PKers killing newbies and more low-medium levels PKing
People. Understand that this doesn't work like awarness and still awarness give you some benefits, so what's the deal?

@a bit off-topic

And Solar is interested in this thread because he saw a great way to 'improve' economy - produce equipment - fight - destroy/lose completly equipment.
Don't forget that players are not robots and they can't spend whole day to produce equipment or try to buy it. You will limit number of equipment in game like this but you will also limit joy of game.

[Attero]

and what next guys ?
people will carry explosives so when they are in "shit" situation they can just kill themselves denying all loot ? (or even set the bomb so it explodes after they are dead so no res timer)

rockets , granades plasma destroy gear ok ... so snipers are not good for killing lowbies ?  nice eye crit from laser rifle is one hit dead on any low lv

and as for bursts - miniguns ...well there are LSW that arnt that much weaker but dont demolish body that often - you wanna them to destroy loot too ? so then SG should do that too ...

chances ? deterioration ? say ...do you think it will help the lowbies at all ? people will thake their chances to get whatever loot they can and a repairman and all deterioration is worthless ....

All in the end it will do is force people to craft more nothing else

[Nyan]

@RJ
crafting doesn't take all day, it's like 5-10 minutes to gather items + craft for a rookie character

also it's not a way of playing, you guys are trying to make this game a pvp arena so the only way to play is to join a gang, get eq and fight each other. Every idea like farming, housing, cooking, eating, having animals etc is considered stupid 'dont make sims out of my fonline derp' im tired of this seriously. Did you know that it's a rpg game guys? It's not your beloved counter strike you were raised on. Some time ago I met a tribal in VC, he was traveling with a spear only and some herbs and I bet he didn't stand a chance to any of you yet he was superior because he really acted. And this is how this game should look like, it's not a real life simulator but don't change this game into generic shooter. You won't get any loot? I'm glad to hear that. You will have to craft and gain ammo instead of just trading it for items you looted? That's even better, maybe this will force some player-player interaction other than killing each other. It's a wasteland, weapons are rare - so is ammo and armors. After the end of the world people wouldn't fight each other for fun and you are doing this guys, so stop whining, I'm sorry the only character you can roll is a fighting one and the only thing you can say in towns is 'lol', 'sell', 'buy' or 'kurwa' for those uber polacks. Maybe it's not a game for you hmm?

[Solar]

And Solar is interested in this thread because he saw a great way to 'improve' economy - produce equipment - fight - destroy/lose completly equipment.
Don't forget that players are not robots and they can't spend whole day to produce equipment or try to buy it. You will limit number of equipment in game like this but you will also limit joy of game.

Well, thats not strictly true. The game does need more resource drains, but my interest in this was mostly in giving some flavour to the high damage types of weapons (explosive, plasma, bursting) so that it could remain powerful, but give it some other disadvantage - so we don't end up with loads of weapons with roughly the same stats. (Though as I say, loot denial is probably taking it too far)

Creating balance is easy, creating balance with variation is tougher.

also it's not a way of playing, you guys are trying to make this game a pvp arena so the only way to play is to join a gang, get eq and fight each other.

This is another part of the problem, people play for very different reasons and most changes end up having to be somewhere in the middle of the two extremes of PvPers vs RPers. Hopefully there should be more for the more RP minded fellows in the not too distant future.