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[OskaRus]

This economics of yours seems a bit communistic to me. Big company of skilled people is rich. Small companies of less informed and less skilled people are poor. I dont think anything would change this ever.

[Doctor Eex]

Sure, making 20 lv in a day ain't hard when you have some budies shoting centaurs for you, but it ain't free and automatic.

You can make 21lvl in a day without any help

[dskpnk]

Just vote no because i think it shows us what will happen in Fonline if there are no server Wipe every 6 mounth. It's a kind of back to the future, with server wipe we can't see how the game will develop with a very powerful gang. So everybody is criying for RP and it's maybe the only way to develop that.

It's a beta and this situation is interesting for futur game mechanics, becaue after 6 mounth of gathering and developing team are wiped or waste stuff waiting wipe, we never had this kind of situation seeing 2 city getting role played by big gangs ! Let's see what will happen, maybe it will be interesting.

Furthermore bank interest are good and don't have to be removed but they need to be fixed by any way (number of players visit/amout traded in city/room rents). This same points can maybe be use for fix the TC awards, trader caps respawn... but i think to get result the whole wastland need an economy because atm you can create an illimited numbers of caps.

To finsh Item wipe will only affect small gang...

[HertogJan]

I fail to see the need for an item wipe too.
It won't change anything.
Big gangs will be up and running quickly again while smaller gangs and loners will need a considerably longer amount of time.
If the gangs which don't profit from the bugs feel they're left out, perhaps the gang(s) they are allied with which do profit can help them out.

[vilaz]

Wipe? Sure but only full wipe with some tasty updates 

[JovankaB]

Unless devs change economy code, it doesn't make sense to make the wipe IMHO. It would only help a little bit small/medium gangs who want to participate in TC. Soon the big gangs will swim in caps again (and even loners have to many caps in my opinion, it's not a problem to make over 100k in a week by a loner without any help of other players or alts).

[kttdestroyer]

I still dont see a reasonable way to fix the economy, a wipe wont help without it. And, no full wipe please, if you want a full wipe then just delete all your chars, and there, you have it, but stay away from my chars, i dont have that problem  

There are some ideas about economy, but there are a lot of things that have to be worked up from the core. Money is still only to buy things, life doesint cost caps in Fonline. Caps in Fonline doesint have its full circle still. Caps just drop from trees, without any reason behind.

[jonny rust]

Keldorn: Ok, it's better when you use arguments than insults. So yeah, I understand what you say, it is mostly very true. Except that I'm not responsible for players telling you "WASTEMAND IS HARSH" (saying this is stupid).

I posted this suggestiong because I thought it was deeply unfair to have on one hand, small gangs that have to craft all day long etc; and on the other hand big gangs with unlimited caps. If you think it is not unfair, or it is no different than previous sessions, well, then I'm glad you posted your point of view, because this is interesting and it seems fair. However, we shouldn't forget that we are beta-testing this game and that it is more important to have a balanced economy than keeping our items for months. My two cents.

I completely agree with this. If there is one thing this game has taught me its to not get too attached to items to items anyway and the fact that this is a beta test is very important to remember, of course we are all having fun doing it but every now and then it requires a little sacrifice. However considering this is a test I think its a perfect time to test a money reform as previously suggested. I know this wont completely solve the item problem but the item problem will likely not get solved in many ways until the 'supply and demand' issue also gets solved, but I suppose that's another thread.

[Keldorn]

@Jjohnny Rust

The thing is Johnny this is a thinly veiled attempt to prety much screw over all the little folks for the benefit of a few (namely big gangs).  

There has never been and it doesn't look like it will happen soon, a REAL economy.  This game is about PVP for da lulz everyone knows.  So to me that argument goes down the toilet.  Like why is there a cooldown for crafting yet no cooldown for pk/robbing people?  Because the devs do not want us to hoard loot by making it ourselves.  They want us to go out robbing and killing other folks just like CS, Rogues, or the anti-pk folks like TTTLA and VSB to get loot.   I mean 3 hour cooldown for BA (this is after 2 hour cooldown for mining the mats)?  But you can get BA by just ambushing someone/cripple them/shoot for the eyes.

Izuals excuse of "too many caps", doesn't hold water when historically, the big gangs have ALWAYS had dang near endless caps.  

Lastly its no coincidence that this "suggestion" pops up after a nasty flame war in the gang discussions about how Rogues/CS happened to own a few towns when a bug happend that didn't allow other big gangs to re-take them.

So ok, when us little folks lose things due to a server rollback its tough luck.  If we die and lose all our stuff because of lag or a glitch in the system, its tough luck.  But all of a sudden big gangs get shafted by a bug and its OMGZ we need to get this situation fixed right away.

If we go as you say Johnny, then the big gangs shouldn't be the one getting attached to their money and items.  If Izual wants to bring back a balance between the big gangs ONLY, then wipe the big gangs of their money and items.  But you see that won't happen unless everyone gets wped.

Banks are not the problem.  Bank interest isn't the problem.  Screwing over all the little joes just for the sake of (equalizsing the situation between the big gangs) is the problem.  Eliminating the few peaceful ways to accumulate wealth in the game IS a problem.  Eliminating bank interest and the ability for small folks to earn lots of caps too because some big gangs or gms don't like it IS a problem.

[jonny rust]

@Keldorn

OK, I can accept all of that. I assumed this was a blanket leveler. obviously the economy needs work but I suppose to what end that work is put towards. Personally I don't see how the economy can make any sense until the supply/demand of the NPC vendors is established anyway, after all they are the base of the games economy (they certainly are for us little guys). Once each town has limited and logical economy however TC spoils can also make more sense assuming they are based on the controlled towns economy instead of that town simply generating fabricated money like a federal reserve. last time I checked there are no operational nukacola factories producing more caps.

[Wipe]

Not going to happen.

Thread closed.

[Swinglinered]

Quick Fix - freeze interest until next wipe.

Remove caps from TC loot.

Weaken militia and shorten TC holding time to half an hour (if it hasn't already) so TC gangs will have to accellerate PvP to retake towns. This will grind up their reserves of equipment fighting each other.

Towns still have to have some kind of decent valuable to make TC worthwhile (and keep them killing each other.)
Have townspeople grab loot from dead players and it goes into the TC box?

Perhaps some kind of gang rep/gang member rep system to keep score. (Beyond the pipboy TC display.)
They can fight over that.

The wipe/money reform is great for those who have little or nothing- a "clean slate".
For the big gangs it would be annoying, but their organization and manpower will help them bounce back rapidly.

Small gangs are the ones actually hurt in this scenerio. Trying so hard to build up to a position where they can compete only to have it yanked from them.
I got to a point where I was sort of "custodian of bases" (playing mostly alone, keeping the bases and tents from dissappearing), mining, crafting, leveling crafter alts (slowly- takes me a week to get one to lv10), searching for caps.
Throw in a bombing once or twice a day for spice.
Just getting things ready for "when people come back".
Plus all the arranging and decorating.

This wasn't simple stockpiling- it was careful, long term logistics planning.
A very slow, tedius RP project.

So item wipe and caps wipe?
99% of time and effort erased.