Author Topic: Armors and clothing  (Read 272936 times)

Offline Johnnybravo

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Re: Armors and clothing
« Reply #600 on: September 20, 2011, 01:38:49 pm »
Wow, that really looks good already. It took quite a moment to see the actual 3d model of the leather girl in the bar. Nice! Can't wait for that dither/pixelisation filter.  ;D
Well I think it's still quite obvious due to missing details. It seems like there is not much to do left, though painting on normal maps will be incredible feet. Converting height maps might be a little easier for artists, good thing there are tons of filters for commonly used software (like photoshop).

I don't really think sprite resolution is as big deal as you make it, since sprites are pretty much 1:1 (I don't really think there is any resizing going on), any higher resolution screens were already unaffected by "pixelization", so unless you have fullscreen window set on low resolution, or you like to zoom in, you will not really have chance to notice any differences in this regard.

On the other hand additional colors are much easier to notice. Unfortunately it is much harder to work around them, because dithering is not as simple as indexed color lookup (which would really just look like shit, so I guess it is out of question).

Also Luther, it is not possible to add additional layers to model texture? It looks kinda wrong when you model this kind of details?
If not such system should be designed and added :d. It'd just save everyone tons of work, and to be honest some of the MMORPG games build skins like that.

Anyway I think the biggest challenge would be to correct bad meshes and textures. For example the hobo rags looks much better than the previously mentioned coat, because it has much better painted texture. Where the coat is just blurred something.

Quote
Not sure whether such things are better done with normal / specular maps (letting the engine shadow / highlight deal with it) or whether they should be painted onto the texture.
Later will look good from one angle only.
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Offline Luther Blissett

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Re: Armors and clothing
« Reply #601 on: September 20, 2011, 02:09:06 pm »
Also Luther, it is not possible to add additional layers to model texture? It looks kinda wrong when you model this kind of details? If not such system should be designed and added :d. It'd just save everyone tons of work, and to be honest some of the MMORPG games build skins like that.

In what sense to do you mean? There's currently a "base skin" layer, and a layer for clothing, which can be assigned to as many subsets as needed. On top of those, there are the model layers (currently for armour, hair, helmet, backpack - though there are also layers for beard and moustache that we've not tried using yet). It seems that it'd be fairly easy to add extra layers if needed though. Can you clarify what you mean? If it's something that'll make things easier, then I'd definitely like to hear it :)

Anyway I think the biggest challenge would be to correct bad meshes and textures. For example the hobo rags looks much better than the previously mentioned coat, because it has much better painted texture. Where the coat is just blurred something.

Yes - a lot of the models and textures are going to need tweaking a few times - especially after we've changed things in the lighting and shadow effects. I did the ragged coat texture quite a bit later than the original duster, so it's slightly "better" in detail by nature of having more practice, and a little more discussion about what style we should do the texturing in. However in in-game shots, the duster still looks closer to original sprites, whilst the rags look too 'flat' (most likely because of the range of colours). Basically both of them need improving quite a lot - they're both quite heavily reliant on painted highlights rather than engine highlights - and as mentioned, the duster coat texture loses most of the detail and becomes quite blurry once it's reduced in resolution.

Later will look good from one angle only.

It depends. There's certainly a bit of extra definition which could be painted on the texture first. In the tribal example, I think it's just a matter of darkening a couple of areas. After that, we start working with the effects for the "fine tuning".
« Last Edit: September 20, 2011, 02:12:45 pm by Luther Blissett »

Offline Lexx

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Re: Armors and clothing
« Reply #602 on: September 20, 2011, 02:20:40 pm »
In what sense to do you mean? There's currently a "base skin" layer, and a layer for clothing, which can be assigned to as many subsets as needed. On top of those, there are the model layers (currently for armour, hair, helmet, backpack - though there are also layers for beard and moustache that we've not tried using yet). It seems that it'd be fairly easy to add extra layers if needed though. Can you clarify what you mean? If it's something that'll make things easier, then I'd definitely like to hear it :)

He means texture layers. Putting a texture over a texture, etc. Can be used for stuff like tattoos, scars, etc. For our normal models, I'll doubt we really need this, though, as we don't have to show lots of tiny details all the time.

Re: Armors and clothing
« Reply #603 on: September 20, 2011, 08:20:59 pm »
« Last Edit: September 20, 2011, 08:25:35 pm by Sunstroke[RUS] »

Offline Haraldx

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Re: Armors and clothing
« Reply #604 on: September 20, 2011, 09:08:53 pm »
очень хорошо!  :D

No, seriously, looks very good. Simple, but good!
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Offline Ganado

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Re: Armors and clothing
« Reply #605 on: September 20, 2011, 10:44:53 pm »

You can see how the 3D model has a longer face and a more prominent chin than the tribals, and I guess the tribals are supposed to look more primitive in that sense. But it looks really good! Maybe slightly more texture on the tribal's muscles.
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Offline Eternauta

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Re: Armors and clothing
« Reply #606 on: September 21, 2011, 03:14:00 am »
tribals are supposed to look more primitive in that sense.

What? tribals are humans as well, Abe! :P

Offline Lexx

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Re: Armors and clothing
« Reply #607 on: September 21, 2011, 10:05:13 am »
The long face could also be due to the hair. The tribals have a more mohawk-like hair, while the 3D model has flat, short normal hair with probably a high forehead(?).

Offline Luther Blissett

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Re: Armors and clothing
« Reply #608 on: September 21, 2011, 10:54:56 am »
He means texture layers. Putting a texture over a texture, etc. Can be used for stuff like tattoos, scars, etc [...]

That could actually be very useful in a couple of places - particularly if the 2nd layer could contain transparency to show the layer underneath. I'm thinking particularly of shirts with v-necks and such things - where currently we'd have a problem with the skin colour being different on the v-neck section than the head, arms and hands - for the tribal, this would also mean the tribal's "leather thing" could be done on a texture layer rather than modelled.

Additionally, though it's perhaps of lower importance, it'd be a very simple method of adding quick customisation - and though non-essential, perhaps even stuff like faction logos or blood / damage at some point in the future etc - if that's what people wanted.

Anyway, I'm not certain whether this is possible or not to be honest. I haven't found a way of doing so myself yet.

Lady in black dress

Very good! Is the model available somewhere? [edit] I have the model now. I will try to rig this and test it soon.

Regarding the tribal test model, I think the hair is definitely a factor, yes. Also the shading underneath the head is quite noticeable now it's been pointed out - the whole chin / neck area should perhaps be darker. Anyway, there's definitely quite a lot of further tweaking to be done with these, but I think it's good to show we're "getting nearer" - especially when you compare these two :


First image is from August, second from September. To me, that's quite a nice sign of progress.
« Last Edit: September 22, 2011, 11:40:22 am by Luther Blissett »

Offline Lexx

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Re: Armors and clothing
« Reply #609 on: September 21, 2011, 12:29:49 pm »
I was happy with the first version already. Didn't expected that it can be improved even more. Good to see I was wrong. :p

Re: Armors and clothing
« Reply #610 on: September 22, 2011, 02:44:15 pm »
     
« Last Edit: September 22, 2011, 02:49:22 pm by Sunstroke[RUS] »

Offline Gob

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Re: Armors and clothing
« Reply #611 on: September 22, 2011, 02:59:49 pm »
Can't wait to get her as a slave  ;D

Re: Armors and clothing
« Reply #612 on: September 22, 2011, 05:36:02 pm »
Slave you say? ;D

Offline Luther Blissett

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Re: Armors and clothing
« Reply #613 on: September 22, 2011, 05:43:04 pm »
Hahahaha ;D

Re: Armors and clothing
« Reply #614 on: September 22, 2011, 05:52:51 pm »
Sorry for my English.