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[Keldorn]

Its Fonline.  The whole basis of this game is to play as a raider and kill everyone you meet.  As many others have said,this kind of mentality is the games selling point.

If devs cannot control fast relogs/duallogs/etc,then they should put less reliance on those factors when implementing new ideas.  TC was all about who can zerg better.  Mutie artillery has just exacerbated the situation.

[OskaRus]

the "pro" players do nothing but keep Devs busy fixing shit.

Actually thats the point of beta. We are here to try to exploit every feature or bug and report it for devs to fix it. And I for myself feel sometimes ashamed for every missed oportunity to test new possible exploit. And some exploits have macro potential which needs to be tested by mass and spam like muties, proxi-multi-fastrelog, stealing patrols and bank interrest is now.

[Doctor Eex]

Actually thats the point of beta. We are here to try to exploit every feature or bug and report it for devs to fix it. And I for myself feel sometimes ashamed for every missed oportunity to test new possible exploit. And some exploits have macro potential which needs to be tested by mass and spam like muties, proxi-multi-fastrelog, stealing patrols and bank interrest is now.

Exactly. I can add one more - remove namecolorize = mass PKing.

[JovankaB]

Actually thats the point of beta. We are here to try to exploit every feature or bug and report it for devs to fix it. And I for myself feel sometimes ashamed for every missed oportunity to test new possible exploit. And some exploits have macro potential which needs to be tested by mass and spam like muties, proxi-multi-fastrelog, stealing patrols and bank interrest is now.

There is a difference between testing exploits and using them for your own purpose. When I was a GM I met only A FEW people who were actually interested in TESTING and REPORTING exploits, definitely not behavior of average competitive PvP "pr0s" who are only interested in abusing bugs to gain advantage over other gangs and not reporting them (at least not until other gangs find it out).

[Sarakin]

There is a difference between testing exploits and using them for your own purpose. When I was a GM I met only A FEW people who were actually interested in TESTING and REPORTING exploits, definitely not behavior of average competitive PvP "pr0s" who are only interested in abusing bugs to gain advantage over other gangs and not reporting them (at least not until other gangs find it out).

So you´re telling that someone can´t be both PROPER TESTER and PvP Pr0 ?

[Crazy]

There is a difference between testing exploits and using them for your own purpose. When I was a GM I met only A FEW people who were actually interested in TESTING and REPORTING exploits, definitely not behavior of average competitive PvP "pr0s" who are only interested in abusing bugs to gain advantage over other gangs and not reporting them (at least not until other gangs find it out).

Ok, next time I found an exploit like the FN fal one (30 FN fal on one bootleger) I will exploit it as much as possible without reporting it. I am a "PvP pr0 10yo nolife" after all.

[JovankaB]

I'm telling that it's very uncommon. Of course PvP "pr0s" are interested in testing PvP aspects of the game and writing suggestions related to PvP and reporting bugs that make their life harder. But majority of them are not interested in reporting actual exploits - reporting bugs that make their life easier. Let's just say one honest player from a very big PvP gang had to report us exploits in a secret, because his friends told him they will throw him out from gang if he reports it.

I don't know what's your problem Crazy, I told that it's majority that isn't interested, not all.

[Sarakin]

But thats how it works now. Serious exploits are reported secretly not only due to reasons you have described but also because of the severity of the exploit. And thus, you cant know who is honest and a good tester and who is not.

[JovankaB]

But his gang knew the exploits, so there was no point of keeping it secret from his friends that he reports it. He had to report it in secret because his gang didn't want to reveal it.

GMs know who isn't honest, if they find out people exploiting. You can tell they aren't testing if they don't report it immediately. If someone reported exploit you can't tell unfortunately - he could use it for a month and finally report it. But I can tell how many people reported me something over six months of GMing, and let's just say the number isn't to big.

[avv]

Jovanka has a point. Just monitor the threads here: the public reports made of exploits such as various gridcamping, npc ai abuse, idolized status abuse and such were all made by the victims not the actual culprits.

[OskaRus]

Jovanka has a point. Just monitor the threads here: the public reports made of exploits such as various gridcamping, npc ai abuse, idolized status abuse and such were all made by the victims not the actual culprits.

And yet very little response from devs which solution have been chosen or if it will be resolved at all.

[Swinglinered]

I am terribly sorry that you have never been human, or that European Union removed feeling of being human from most of the people

They'll Send The Heart Police To Put You Under Cardiac Arrest!


But seriously people: gotta report the stuff.

I just disagree about doing it immediately- your reward for finding a sploit should be that you can get a little bit of griefing lulz out of it. Just for a day maybe.

Then you must stop.

On the one hand it is human to angle for advantage, but it is also human that which sets us apart from the general behavior of animals.

[OskaRus]

Without sufficient feedback from devs or GMs it is often wery hard to distinguish between exploit and intended feature. For example stealing from brotherhood patrols. Before update it was easy money. After update u just join brotherhood with your stealer alt and it is evean easier money. WTF? No response or acknowledgement if it is ok or exploit.

[Surf]

Yes, now it's our fault and you are forced to exploit.

On a more serious note - how about just asking things? Can't have the eye everywhere, you know.

[Nice_Boat]

There is a difference between testing exploits and using them for your own purpose. When I was a GM I met only A FEW people who were actually interested in TESTING and REPORTING exploits, definitely not behavior of average competitive PvP "pr0s" who are only interested in abusing bugs to gain advantage over other gangs and not reporting them (at least not until other gangs find it out).

But they end up being reported, no? It's definitely more productive than, say, standing in the NCR all day long and pretending you're sitting behind a table or spending your game time on crafting. I just don't get all the hate for "PvP pr0s" - they're basically the blood running through this game's veins, yet most GMs seem to hate them/do not understand them at all/declare they don't care. I've never, ever seen a game with so many people having the job of overseeing it without having the slightest idea of how it's being played. Yeah, other games have their equivalents of deskjockeys too, but they at least had to play it competitively at some point in time... here it's a magical world. It's a world where up is down, left is right and enjoying yourself while playing the game makes you a bad user. Oh, and cheaters are being banned, so I don't really understand what's your point, Elvis. Nothing's perfect, but people running this circus are trying in this respect, you know.