Other > Suggestions
Pickpocketing/Tagging
Johnnybravo:
--- Quote ---Stay away from NCR and you avoid at least 80% of all thieves.
--- End quote ---
This made me to create a forum account.
You sir suggest to avoid players to play a MMO game?
I've got feeling that this is just broken and advocating it won't make this game any better.
HertogJan:
--- Quote from: avv on December 21, 2010, 01:08:00 PM ---I meant catching, not preventing getting stolen from. Right now there's no way to catch a thief and make him pay for his crime attempts. Surely he might randomly fail but that's not up to the victim.
--- End quote ---
I know what you meant, it's just makes no sense.
Or are you working for the local sherrif?
--- Quote from: avv on December 21, 2010, 01:08:00 PM ---Not if done well. It takes some modifications to line of sight so that it's not a quadrangle where the char is placed near one corner but a slice of sector laid in front of him. That would make figuring out lines of sight easier because no matter the perception, nobody would actually see further to his side and rear. It'd be like a puzzle to figure out which char has least eyes on him but most distraction around. You want to beat players? Then you need to outsmart them. Find the victim who has positioned himself badly. Smart players wouldn't usually be possible to be stolen from, that's okay.
--- End quote ---
It doesn't change my point.
It makes stealing in areas like NCR bazar impossible.
--- Quote from: avv on December 21, 2010, 01:08:00 PM ---You know what's very bad feature in games? When you plan things precisely perfectly but it fails because there's 0,01% chance to fail due to the fact the game is based on dice rolls. I see no reason why you couldn't work youself 100% success rate if you did everything right and your victim didn't do anything to counter you. Your victim doesn't deserve even that 0,01% chance if he didn't work for it. Only npcs deserve a small defensive success chance because they are slaves to their script.
--- End quote ---
Stop playing RPGs.
Removing dice rolls makes outcomes predictable and boring.
It's not just stealing, it's also crit chance, encounters, etc.
The victim can walk away, it's his counter measure.
--- Quote from: avv on December 21, 2010, 01:08:00 PM ---That's how thieves work in reality, and in fonline it'd be called teamwork which deserves some credit. There wouldn't be anything wrong with it because it's activity faithful to the game world unlike shoot'n'loot or blocking doorways. So if something like that is implemented, counter measures usable by victims must follow ofcourse. It's not i'd like some undefeatble pickpocket mob to roam every town.
--- End quote ---
So you're saying locking people in locations is okay if you're stealing but not if you plan to loot and shoot?
Where's the logic in that? There's no difference, you lose your stuff.
Thieving teams work like this:
1 creates a diversion by talking to the victim or whatever.
The 2nd steals and passes the loot to the 3rd who walks away with it or even gives it to a 4th.
--- Quote from: Johnnybravo on December 21, 2010, 02:20:40 PM ---This made me to create a forum account.
You sir suggest to avoid players to play a MMO game?
I've got feeling that this is just broken and advocating it won't make this game any better.
--- End quote ---
I'm not suggesting you avoid players, I'm suggestion you avoid players in NCR.
NCR is filled with thieves, looters & shooters, tent followers, people try to con you, try to trick you in such a way it leads to your death, shoot you just for the fun of it, ...
The other option is not to complain about thieves if you choose to go to a location that's filled with them.
avv:
--- Quote from: HertogJan on December 21, 2010, 04:22:53 PM ---I know what you meant, it's just makes no sense.
Or are you working for the local sherrif?
--- End quote ---
Dealing wasteland justice is everyman's right. In addition everyone should be allowed to protect their items with force and alertness. You can shoot a robber in the wasteland, how come you can't fight against a thief if the losses are the same: material. I've tried to explain that player's only chance to avoid robberty is running makes stealing very annoying feature. That's what this discussion is mainly about. If players received a way to use their alertness to spot thieves and shoot them, thieves would also deserve a way to skillfully avoid being spotted.
--- Quote ---It makes stealing in areas like NCR bazar impossible.
--- End quote ---
Only less obvious. What's wrong with not being able to harass everyone everwhere and being forced to use finesse to achieve your goals?
--- Quote ---Stop playing RPGs.
Removing dice rolls makes outcomes predictable and boring.
--- End quote ---
I'm not talking about removing but having occasions when dice roll is simply ignored because there are so many factors supporting success.
--- Quote ---The victim can walk away, it's his counter measure.
--- End quote ---
No that's just avoiding, and some thieves might actually just want to harass people. Counter measure means hitting back and getting rid of the thief, not running away. Players have right to defend their personal space and property.
Johnnybravo:
By suggesting me to move away from NCR you're basicly suggesting me to play solo - there's simply not enough people in other cities in my playtime.
In fact if one town is filled with filth and thieves just because of it's population you might be safe to assume that game is designed for that high crime rate.
HertogJan:
--- Quote from: avv on December 21, 2010, 05:29:06 PM ---Dealing wasteland justice is everyman's right. In addition everyone should be allowed to protect their items with force and alertness. You can shoot a robber in the wasteland, how come you can't fight against a thief if the losses are the same: material. I've tried to explain that player's only chance to avoid robberty is running makes stealing very annoying feature. That's what this discussion is mainly about. If players received a way to use their alertness to spot thieves and shoot them, thieves would also deserve a way to skillfully avoid being spotted.
--- End quote ---
Protecting your items by avoiding problems is a better solution, especially in the wasteland. Who knows who the thief's friends are and what they can do.
In the wasteland you might be able to walk away from a robber too.
The whole discussion is about people harassing others at traders by using or pretending to use the thief skill.
Sometimes it's the thief skill, sometimes it's pure harassment.
--- Quote from: avv on December 21, 2010, 05:29:06 PM ---Only less obvious. What's wrong with not being able to harass everyone everwhere and being forced to use finesse to achieve your goals?
--- End quote ---
What's wrong with fixing the things that cause the harassment in the first place instead of "fixing" a problem by nerving a skill useless?
Main problems are the steal animation being equal to other animations and traders only being able to speak to 1 person at a time. That means more people around the trader, meaning more thieves and more impatient people scaring off others by pretending to steal.
--- Quote from: avv on December 21, 2010, 05:29:06 PM ---I'm not talking about removing but having occasions when dice roll is simply ignored because there are so many factors supporting success.
--- End quote ---
Removing it or ignoring it, the result is the same.
--- Quote from: avv on December 21, 2010, 05:29:06 PM ---No that's just avoiding, and some thieves might actually just want to harass people. Counter measure means hitting back and getting rid of the thief, not running away. Players have right to defend their personal space and property.
--- End quote ---
The people harassing others and following them around aren't thieves, they're just a bunch of low life grievers. No matter what you'll do, you'll have them around. Remove the steal skill and they'll start bursting people.
Preventing is better than being a victim. Players playing a "good guy" have to accept the fact they're a bit limited in guarded areas as everyone is protected by default and guns are not always allowed.
It's so damn easy to prevent being stolen from. Simply walk away. How hard can it be?
--- Quote from: Johnnybravo on December 21, 2010, 11:41:13 PM ---By suggesting me to move away from NCR you're basicly suggesting me to play solo - there's simply not enough people in other cities in my playtime.
In fact if one town is filled with filth and thieves just because of it's population you might be safe to assume that game is designed for that high crime rate.
--- End quote ---
I have no idea where you're from and when you're on.
If you're going to a town filled with scum and you know that, don't complain about things like stealing. Accept it happens and be careful. High crime rates are part of NCR.
Pre-wipe I was in NCR a lot. This time I'm not. I have met a lot more interesting and nice people this time around.
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