Other > Suggestions
Stealing out of control ! Tighten the leash...
HertogJan:
--- Quote from: avv on December 12, 2010, 04:32:57 PM ---The npc might not be occupied after one hour later, or tomorrow.
--- End quote ---
By than the thief isn't around anymore.
--- Quote from: avv on December 12, 2010, 04:32:57 PM ---Even if you change the animation, abusers could use it but not steal anything, just look in the victim's inventory. That would work exactly as harassing others with some other than steal skill animation which happens right now. Only if looking in someone's pocket would count as steal attempt, it would work better.
--- End quote ---
Of course it can still be abused. But if it's a unique animation, you can't pretend which means the one using it has a 30 seconds cooldown. Which means less griefing/abuse. It's still not perfect, but it will be a lot better than it is now.
--- Quote from: avv on December 12, 2010, 04:32:57 PM ---"That's how it works" isn't good enough reasoning.
It doesn't matter what you do outside the town as long as it citizens, members or allies aren't involved. Doesn't make you a criminal in ncr's eyes if you rob someone in Modoc. If a player chooses to play thief inside ncr, it means that he doesn't care about the local law so shouldn't that make him an unprotected outlaw?
--- End quote ---
So rep can only be changed by doing certain actions in towns?
So if I'm a mass murderer killing everyone just 1 square from NCR I'm fine?
--- Quote from: avv on December 12, 2010, 04:32:57 PM ---If you want to get back the law's protection you should repay your wrongdoings to the victim and him only. If players are ready to make alts to get away from that, then they do. It's pretty good slap on someone's face to force him to delete his character and level up a new one.
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No it's not. It's not hard to level a thief, especially not if you can do it on mutated molerats.
At most it's boring.
The whole repay for wrong doings makes no sense. You're never fully save anywhere. It doesn't matter if you're carrying anything or not.
Someone shooting a thief, accidentely killing someone else who was low on hp but carrying stuff. Guards loot the victim, shooter has to repay the victim.
We'll end up with half the player base having to repay the other half.
avv:
--- Quote from: HertogJan on December 12, 2010, 11:33:18 PM ---By than the thief isn't around anymore.
--- End quote ---
Doesn't matter, he'd still get the -rep when his name was given to the police.
--- Quote ---Of course it can still be abused. But if it's a unique animation, you can't pretend which means the one using it has a 30 seconds cooldown. Which means less griefing/abuse. It's still not perfect, but it will be a lot better than it is now.
--- End quote ---
Does the 30 sec cooldown apply when only looking at someone's inventory? Because if it doesn't the new animation would be useless against fake-stealing abuse. Someone could just look at your inventory without taking anything, thus causing harassment without penalty.
--- Quote ---So rep can only be changed by doing certain actions in towns?
So if I'm a mass murderer killing everyone just 1 square from NCR I'm fine?
--- End quote ---
Better keep it at stealing, not mass murdering here. But if you shoot some people who aren't related to ncr in any way one square away from it, there's no need for rep loss because you didn't harm ncr.
--- Quote ---No it's not. It's not hard to level a thief, especially not if you can do it on mutated molerats.
At most it's boring.
--- End quote ---
It's still something. Then again it'd be better if players didn't want to make alts so easily.
--- Quote ---The whole repay for wrong doings makes no sense. You're never fully save anywhere. It doesn't matter if you're carrying anything or not.Someone shooting a thief, accidentely killing someone else who was low on hp but carrying stuff. Guards loot the victim, shooter has to repay the victim.
--- End quote ---
Wouldn't apply the payback rule to shooting because in that situation the shooter also dies and nobody actually profits, unless some shoot'n'loot abuse was involved. It would work only when it comes to stealing.
HertogJan:
--- Quote from: avv on December 13, 2010, 12:07:04 PM ---Doesn't matter, he'd still get the -rep when his name was given to the police.
--- End quote ---
You weren't caught, you didn't fail, no reason to receive a penalty.
--- Quote from: avv on December 13, 2010, 12:07:04 PM ---Does the 30 sec cooldown apply when only looking at someone's inventory? Because if it doesn't the new animation would be useless against fake-stealing abuse. Someone could just look at your inventory without taking anything, thus causing harassment without penalty.
--- End quote ---
Using steal on a player or npc starts the cooldown. Still it won't stop people using it for shop shooting purposes.
--- Quote from: avv on December 13, 2010, 12:07:04 PM ---Better keep it at stealing, not mass murdering here. But if you shoot some people who aren't related to ncr in any way one square away from it, there's no need for rep loss because you didn't harm ncr.
--- End quote ---
Funny, the same goes on for people who are stealing than.
You didn't harm NCR if you don't steal from them.
The vendor potentially losing business applies here as well.
Not to mention the bad rep NCR would get for not being able to keep their surroundings secure.
--- Quote from: avv on December 13, 2010, 12:07:04 PM ---It's still something. Then again it'd be better if players didn't want to make alts so easily.
--- End quote ---
Which is why they shouldn't be given yet an extra reason.
--- Quote from: avv on December 13, 2010, 12:07:04 PM ---Wouldn't apply the payback rule to shooting because in that situation the shooter also dies and nobody actually profits, unless some shoot'n'loot abuse was involved. It would work only when it comes to stealing.
--- End quote ---
Which will lead to more shoot and loot abuse.
You're not solving anything there.
LagMaster:
finaly a F***ing good ideea and you start trooling, MAKE THE STEAL SKILL LIKE THE COMBAT TIMEOUT FOR ! GOD DAMED F***ING MINUTE!!!!!
Stop Theivery suport!!!this game suports the ideea of a theif!!!!!
STOP THEIFS!!!
avv:
--- Quote from: HertogJan on December 13, 2010, 04:45:19 PM ---You weren't caught, you didn't fail, no reason to receive a penalty.
--- End quote ---
If the victim knows who stole from him, it counts as being caught. Not maybe from the game's point of view but that's where the retardness and annoyance comes from: knowing who is the criminal but not being able to retaliate in any way than running away.
--- Quote ---Which is why they shouldn't be given yet an extra reason.
--- End quote ---
The real reason to alting in this case is that the game doesn't encourage dedicating time to invidual char enough, it's a global problem related to all chars. Basically every class or skill related suggestions could be rejected by reasoning that it will be ruined by alts or some exploit that hasn't been fixed yet. If we're going to discuss steal, then there has to be an agreement that some issues we're having now will be fixed in advance. This means that stealing should work so that a player could play a thief character without feeling the need to delete it and make a new one or resort to the help of additional characters. If you disagree in this case an think that it's okay to simply waste characters like they were disposable tools, we're not going to reach any agreement due to differend stands
--- Quote ---Which will lead to more shoot and loot abuse.
You're not solving anything there.
--- End quote ---
Shoot&loot abuse is an exploit, stealing is not. It's not far-sighted point of view to see shoot'n'loot exploit as part of gameplay. But it's not this thread's role to solve shooting and looting in safe towns.
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