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Other => FOnline:2238 Forum => Archives => General Game Discussion => Topic started by: Stampedo on August 14, 2011, 07:54:25 am
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OK
Started playing today. Died like 50 times before understanding how to play this game.
Finally after a big bunch of hours, I was able to gather good equipment and caps.
I was hunting brahmins out of the hub.
I had like 6 hides, almost enough for a tent. (god it's hard to get those)
New encounter, lots of geckos, dogs and brahmins. Nice. Starting the fight, almost done.
Then suddenly, coming from nowhere, a motherfucker shoot me in the back and loots EVERYTHING I had gathered for hours.
Where did this asshole come from? How???
I'm so fuckin frustrated, I can't even take my revenge.
If you meet him, just smack his face hard on the ground for me.
His name: "Oni Akuma"
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People can find you in encounters. I think theres a certain time limit until nobody can enter, but im unsure when that is.
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Welcome in Fonline ;D
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And that is why we need anti PK patrols.
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What you should have done is not walk around with 6 skins in your inventory. Stash them somewhere safe in hub, somewhere where nobody for sure will look. That way you don't always lose your whole property if you die, until you get the tent.
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Stampedo advice 4 u:
Never walk through wasteland carrying ur mos valuable stuff!
At the very start of ur gaming (when u still dont have a tent) u have 2 options:
- stash ur items in ur friends base/tent
- rent a room in hub/junktown (its location accesable only for u so u can safely sash ur items)
- hide ur items smart in some open accesible location like city, behind some spirite of some scenery inside
u gona be always killed on desert when u gona meet another wastelander (he can find u on desert if he is crossing the same "hex" on worldmap) take it to ur heart as a grand rule
And that is why we need anti PK patrols.
please do it! Then I woudl have something new to shoot at :D
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Friends.. they will help you through everything.
Mostly PKs are near city encounters.. go little out of town and search for good place for level up.
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And that is why we need anti PK patrols.
Well, i'm ok with this, but my fear is that the cure becomes worse then the disease... "No please dear policeman dont rape me..."
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Ok guys, what if I don't have any friend?
I wasn't aware about PKers being able to get into my random encounter and shoot me in the back until it happened to me.
I lost important things I've struggled in order to gather them and got looted by 12 years old kid playing like a bitch.
I know this is what the game is intended to, I just find the mechanics pitiless:
- the LOS is so reduced that I couldnt even see he was there before seeing my character gettin torn apart.
- no warning message like "A stranger is in the area" or something. It's not gamebreaking, it will just give less the sensation of an asshole popping out of nowhere in your back.
I've not able to create a tent so far, and when I see comments on this board saying that "it's easy", I'm feeling a bit discouraged.
For example, I had to create numerous different characters before having something solid.
I tried a character based on barter/speech, but this game doesn't allow that, you will never be able to level him up.
So I went for a gunman/first aid/outdoorskill, was doing ok until I came across this PK mofo.
Whatever, is there a way to find "nice people" in this game?
Or maybe find players that could gimme me some items?
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Mostly i start to hunt with random players and sometimes result is good and we become friends or then he was random PK who only wanted my loot.
It's very hard to say in beginning is person good or evil.
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There are a lot of nice people about, if you're lucky enough to find them. Vault City or Hub generally seem most likely to find helpful people. NCR's probably best avoided. I was helped out by one or two people when I first started, and have done so myself since (though I was shot in the back as you describe many times whilst looking for my 10th Brahmin skin).
Once you've got a tent, and therefore a safe place to keep things, that frustration becomes less severe. Yes, you die and lose what you're carrying, but over time you'll start to have "replacement sets" of all your stuff back at your tent. A lot of people will have 20 or more sets of complete armour / weapon / ammo / stims etc, ready to go straight back out again after death, as though nothing happened. These people often say "wasteland is harsh", though for them it obviously isn't.
If I'm in a helpful mood, and I spot someone with ~35HP shovelling shit, I'll normally volunteer to help them get started. Weapon, armour, a handful of brahmin skins, then take them hunting for the rest, get them a tent, then take them for a bit of gathering, hunting and crafting. I happened to be up and about when I saw your original post, so I went looking for you in Hub, but it was deserted, so I stashed a few weapons and armours and bits around the shit shovelling and box carrying areas. Hopefully someone that actually needed them found them.
If you're still in the same situation now, and nobody else is already helping you, send me a PM, and I'll try and find you and see if I can help you get started.
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Thanks for your answers.
I want to say I came across this "Oni Akuma" again, he is wandering a lot near the hub.
He told me "do you want to die again?", then proceeded to punch me, and guards nearby didn't even attacked him.
Another guy nearby killed me and nobody moved. WHAT THE HELL?
About finding "allies", how do I find trusty players? I'm in east canada, how to find people there?
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If im correct there are a lot of Canadians playing in TTLA faction
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If im correct there are a lot of Canadians playing in TTLA faction
Well, that's true, but only French Canadians from Quebec, because we are a french speaking faction.
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I want to say I came across this "Oni Akuma" again, he is wandering a lot near the hub.
He told me "do you want to die again?", then proceeded to punch me, and guards nearby didn't even attacked him.
Another guy nearby killed me and nobody moved. WHAT THE HELL?
Was it inside Hub or in random encounter?
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Thanks for your answers.
I want to say I came across this "Oni Akuma" again, he is wandering a lot near the hub.
He told me "do you want to die again?", then proceeded to punch me, and guards nearby didn't even attacked him.
Another guy nearby killed me and nobody moved. WHAT THE HELL?
About finding "allies", how do I find trusty players? I'm in east canada, how to find people there?
2 possibilities...you are unprotected for doing,maybe even for mistake,something wrong.Or the guys had extremely high reputation there so they could do whatever fuck they wanted...but this is very,very unlikely.
So i assume you were unpro..got some ''YOU CAUSED PROBLEM IN THIS TOWN AND GUARDS WILL NOT PROTECT YOU'' stuff in your message window..?Don t worry,after dying you return protected once again.
Just behave!
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Well, that's true, but only French Canadians from Quebec, because we are a french speaking faction.
Comment rejoindre votre faction? C'est frustrant de roamer tout seul et de se faire descendre par des opportunistes...
2 possibilities...you are unprotected for doing,maybe even for mistake,something wrong.Or the guys had extremely high reputation there so they could do whatever fuck they wanted...but this is very,very unlikely.
So i assume you were unpro..got some ''YOU CAUSED PROBLEM IN THIS TOWN AND GUARDS WILL NOT PROTECT YOU'' stuff in your message window..?Don t worry,after dying you return protected once again.
Just behave!
I did "nothing". I don't understand. I was in "the hub" near the bank.
This guy is visiting towns without his equipment. When he backstabbed me he had high end gear...
Seriously, if you have a list of PKer, add "Oni Akuma" and "The second" (they are friends because he killed me too).
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yeah yeah yeah
APK patrols with m72 and 9999 hp in APAMK2
red nicknames if someone killed you
put guards in all locations
no full drop
APK guards on all random encounters
something else? ;D
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Comment rejoindre votre faction? C'est frustrant de roamer tout seul et de se faire descendre par des opportunistes...
I did "nothing". I don't understand. I was in "the hub" near the bank.
This guy is visiting towns without his equipment. When he backstabbed me he had high end gear...
Seriously, if you have a list of PKer, add "Oni Akuma" and "The second" (they are friends because he killed me too).
LOL the second is one of my men,we are apk,i seriously doubt he killed you.Seriously.Maybe you trolled-stole-blocked path before,that would explain.
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Getting the Brahmin hides when you first start out is the hardest part, after that things get ALOT easier.
There are alot of PKs out that will kill you without a second thought, including me.
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LOL the second is one of my men,we are apk,i seriously doubt he killed you.Seriously.Maybe you trolled-stole-blocked path before,that would explain.
Have seen something non-APK-looking from The second. Can`t call him APK.
Don`t remember what though.
yeah yeah yeah
APK patrols with m72 and 9999 hp in APAMK2
red nicknames if someone killed you
put guards in all locations
no full drop
APK guards on all random encounters
something else? ;D
you forgot of our favorite "Win this game" button... How dare you?
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Quite honestly, in regards to this question I have the opposite happen to me.
I spent ages turning 27 Xander Root into 68 (or something) Healing Bags, only to randomly enter some guys encounter, where he kills me.
Annoyingly enough, this sort of shit only seems to happen shortly after I make my first weapon. Which is a fucking irritating process to have to continually repeat every 5 minutes.
I don't think anti-PK parties would solve anything, in my honest opinion I think there should be 2 different servers, 1 server for peaceful Trading, Partying, etc. and the other one for PvP. Because I'm sick of being killed by people I haven't even met before, and the only reason they kill me is because they're a fucking douchebag who can't be fucked getting the resources themselves.
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OK
Started playing today. Died like 50 times before understanding how to play this game.
Finally after a big bunch of hours, I was able to gather good equipment and caps.
I was hunting brahmins out of the hub.
I had like 6 hides, almost enough for a tent. (god it's hard to get those)
New encounter, lots of geckos, dogs and brahmins. Nice. Starting the fight, almost done.
Then suddenly, coming from nowhere, a motherfucker shoot me in the back and loots EVERYTHING I had gathered for hours.
Where did this asshole come from? How???
I'm so fuckin frustrated, I can't even take my revenge.
Hello :)
Don't be frustrated, learn to play.
If u have hard time getting 10 bramin hides, thats probably cause your build is not adapted to survive in wastland.
why dont you try to think about a good build with this planner: http://www.nitue.net/fcp/
If u having hard time getting gear, why dont u create a hand to hand character? its not the most effective in high level pvp, but at least, u'll understand how the game works.
Don't call people "mutherfuckers" just because they killed u. This is a wastland, and sometimes u need to kill in order to survive and prospere. That what makes the game fun - constant risk.
I was very frustraded in the beginning, but now i can easily create a small gunner from a scratch and have a tent full of ammo in a day.
Courage. Si tu arrivera de passer le cap de la frustration, tu poura bien profiter de ce jeu et avoir ta vengence sur les pk.
P.s. jen suis un ;)
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He can call him whatever he wants if he killed him. The PK has a choice, he can grind/collect items in the more gentle way. If he chooses to kill other players instead, he deserves to be insulted.
But I agree, that this game has nothing to offer, other than this PvP and atmosphere of constant danger. Removing them from Fonline would make the game completely boring and pointless.
The beggining is always hard. Build the tent, get a weapon, find some isolated place and grind up there. Don't hunt near cities, especially Hub/NCR. And San Francisco. Near the last one you're almost guaranteed to encounter some pk-faggot. Try to kill anyone who isn't answering to your questions. If he doesn't answer, he's most probably a PK.
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LOL the second is one of my men,we are apk,i seriously doubt he killed you.Seriously.Maybe you trolled-stole-blocked path before,that would explain.
Nah. "Oni Akuma" just said I was a stealer (which is false), then "the second" attacked me without further reason and killed me. I even thought they were both friends.
Tell your pal to stop being so naive.
Don't call people "mutherfuckers" just because they killed u. This is a wastland, and sometimes u need to kill in order to survive and prospere. That what makes the game fun - constant risk.
I was very frustraded in the beginning, but now i can easily create a small gunner from a scratch and have a tent full of ammo in a day.
Courage. Si tu arrivera de passer le cap de la frustration, tu poura bien profiter de ce jeu et avoir ta vengence sur les pk.
P.s. jen suis un ;)
Actually, this whole game is a succession of frustrating experiences, and you learn it the hard way.
PS: Tu es un quoi? Un PK?
He can call him whatever he wants if he killed him. The PK has a choice, he can grind/collect items in the more gentle way. If he chooses to kill other players instead, he deserves to be insulted.
But I agree, that this game has nothing to offer, other than this PvP and atmosphere of constant danger. Removing them from Fonline would make the game completely boring and pointless.
The beggining is always hard. Build the tent, get a weapon, find some isolated place and grind up there. Don't hunt near cities, especially Hub/NCR. And San Francisco. Near the last one you're almost guaranteed to encounter some pk-faggot. Try to kill anyone who isn't answering to your questions. If he doesn't answer, he's most probably a PK.
I agree with your analyzis. Fonline has a strong atmosphere, but some gameplay mechanics are poorly balanced/thought out and results into a pointless experience, unless you decide to spend a huge amount of time into it.
This is clearly not user-friendly and I'm often wondering "why the fuck am I playing this shit?".
You can keep the hardcore aspect with smarter mechanics. Anyway, this is not the point here.
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I just find the mechanics pitiless:
- the LOS is so reduced that I couldnt even see he was there before seeing my character gettin torn apart.
- no warning message like "A stranger is in the area" or something. It's not gamebreaking, it will just give less the sensation of an asshole popping out of nowhere in your back.
LOS:
Based on direction you are facing and Perception.
What is your PE score?
"Stranger in the area":
The warning would imply magic, or telepathy.
Yes, PKs are very annoying.
Also:
Guards in encounters don't have same AI as guards in towns.
If attacked in a town and guards do nothing, they may have Idolized status or you blocked a door or failed a steal.
Maybe there is some other bug/sploit involved.
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my only advice to you is this:
Since the waste is fairly unpredictable (especially when hunting near southern towns) it's best not to keep anything you don't want to lose on your person unless absolutely necessary.
Since you don't yet have a tent (or maybe you do by this stage) you will need to find hiding spots.
Yes, it sounds risky but it doesn't need to be. Hiding can be an art.
The bet way to hide things is to find an object, such as a table, which can NOT BE SEEN THROUGH. Drop your things behind it. There will be no way to see or click on these things now and the only way to retrieve them will be to stand on the same spot and hit the G key (the hot key for picking things up). The only way someone will be able to find your things is to know they are there which means you told them or they saw you hide them (be careful of that) or they are randomly checking behind objects for things they can not see which is unlikely. I have hidden things in shops for as long as a week and have had them waiting for me at the end. Think of it as hiding in plain sight... or not.
So when you start to accumulate hides store them in secret stash spots, perhaps even across a few spots (eggs in different baskets) until you get all 10.
My other suggestion would be to sell sell sell and bank the caps instead except that last time I played the economy was shit and your probably better off stashing your caps as well.
hope that helps and good luck
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This thread has been getting an awfully high amount of attention
Anyhow, Pkers make the game more interesting, but reading the thread of the game and seeing how you called someone a PK in spite you being new makes me think youre not as new as you show yourself to be
Back to the thread. Pkers do make the game more interesting, however Assholes that randomly kill on low level areas are one of the more frustrating game mechanics I have ever seen on my life. IT sucks this game is a troll game for trolls, and you are on the exact part of the learning curve to get owned mercilessly by it.
I only wish you luck getting farther into the game, but I wont blame you if you decide to quit.
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Pkers do make the game more interesting, however Assholes that randomly kill on low level areas are one of the more frustrating game mechanics I have ever seen on my life. IT sucks this game is a troll game for trolls, and you are on the exact part of the learning curve to get owned mercilessly by it.
I only wish you luck getting farther into the game, but I wont blame you if you decide to quit.
(https://i.imgur.com/FJAzs.jpg)
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The EVE line in the graph made me laugh thanks ;D
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That line depends on your goals. If one plans to go and do organized pvp versus others, it stays quite high. If he decides to stay in small group or alone and gather items or whatever such people do, it's going to look like that there.
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That line depends on your goals. If one plans to go and do organized pvp versus others, it stays quite high. If he decides to stay in small group or alone and gather items or whatever such people do, it's going to look like that there.
If we were to adhere to that line, Avv, then where would the low level pker gangbanger assholes would end up being?
Honestly, its damn damn easy to grab a MAMK2, a LSW and prey for hours on low level towns... ALONE, on the contrary it does require a shitload of patience, awareness and overall good old intuition to stay alive early on the game... Like a Cat and Mouse thing, except mouses dont build turrets or make an army...
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What's up with that EVE line? I don't get it.
This game requires one safe zone where beginners will learn the basics/get gear/buy material.
Having this somewhere would help starters, instead of giving them multiple high kicks in the face while laughing its ass off.
The community is very low compared to other MMO's, I wonder if there would be ways to bring more player while keeping the essence of this game.
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The community is very low compared to other MMO's, I wonder if there would be ways to bring more player while keeping the essence of this game.
Ever heard the saying, filth builds on dark places? Well this place is filled to the brim with bullshit scenarios, thus it draws bullshit in. However there also cant be light without darkness, and so theres also a part of the community which is quite bright and friendly.... Then theres the gray area which is mostly crafters in their caves, no one likes them and they offer little to the game but they're essencial for they keep the economy going.
Anyhow, its up to you wether you feel like becoming more of the filth that floods the game, or standing up to it. If you can get past the troll game for trolls part then you might enjoy the fun this game brings
Oh and yes THE GAME TROLLS YOU, ALOT, so begging for a newcomers area is only going to fall on deaf ears because, as my previous posts have proven so far, THIS GAME IS DESIGNED FOR TROLLS, but trolls can be fun, and trolling is also fun so theres fun in it, just some special kind of fun
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Community is low at the moment.
It's all because of waiting for wipe :(
When wipe happened+updates off then there is muuuch more players than now. Believe me or not.
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The community is very low compared to other MMO's, I wonder if there would be ways to bring more player while keeping the essence of this game.
beginning training/tutorial area's WERE part of the game essence of Fo1 and Fo2.
You weren't thrown at 21's with CA and LSW's your first day on the job either.
I like to think the only reason we don't have this is because of limited man power versus the amount of time it would take to build and script it.
The ONLY people you see arguing against this idea are the griefers themselves.
I don't mind PKers one bit BUT there is an extreme short sightedness to the griefing where they don't realize that their behavior is caping our population and perhaps even diminishing it. There is a very likely possibility that they are 'over hunting' and they don't seem to mind or perhaps fail to understand this.
Community is low at the moment.
It's all because of waiting for wipe :(
community is always low and there is a high drop out rate. Let's not pretend the problem doesn't exist.
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I have absolutely nothing against PK. It's the right opposite actually.
Anyway, to balance that, this game needs to be a more beginner-friendly. In particular for the huge amount of people that didn't play Fallout 1 & 2, that are already repulsed by those old school-ish graphics and outdated gameplay.
And I hate to hear those pseudo-elitist players arguing that this game is not made for noobs and they have to go through this awful learning phase and a high dose of frustration to worth playing this game. That's a dumb statement because every single players has been a noob once, they just had enough determination (masochism?) to keep playing. Each begginer can become an experienced player, as long as the game is not telling him constantly "get the fuck out asshole, nobody wants you here".
This game is total anarchy, that's his charm, but at the same time it should be slightly more compartimentalized so every kind of players can find what he's looking for and on the top of all: having fun.
If I were to create a new mod for Fonline, I'd have concerns to find the right balance between "keeping hardcore gamers pool" and "seducing new players and make them stay", in order to have the biggest player base possible.
What would you do?
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Some time ago someone suggested to make a sort of "noob town" where players could make their first level, have a few quests to help them get started, and so on.
Probably those players would have ragequitted at the first encounter with a Section 8 member.
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This subject has been done to death, what is a low lvl town going to offer? A place to get easy hunting rifles? Safe molerat farming?
The best way to get through the earlier part of the game is to have some friends, party up with some people anybody who isnt a complete nubcakes wont be needing all the crap gear like hunting rifles and deagles from a midbie encounter.
Dying doesnt get any less annoying until you stop caring about your stuff so much, losing a top tier combat loadout to a merc trap happens, wherever you move the safe point to in the lvl/gear progression will still cause grief.
If anything i think increasing the starting outdoorsman would probably be the best way to make it easier on nublets with the minimum amount of change.
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Ok so you're involuntarily pointing out something interesting.
Having a safe zone is rather stupid, it's true, and it goes against the games philosophy. What I think is that there should be improved mechanics for allowing people to help newbies.
Currently, it's kinda hard to find trustful people to party with or people that are actually willing to help and not shooting you in the back after you've dug some ore for them.
There should be in-game forums (by forum, I mean a place like a bar or something) where people gather and share stuffs (material, gear, tips, sell stuffs) in a safe way (a place where weapons are not allowed for example).
It could happen at any level.
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Ill tell you why this isnt gonna happen
THIS IS A TROLL GAME FOR TROLLS, any mechanic you consider designing has to be worked around the fact the game IS FULL OF TROLLS, people will abuse it in any possible way and render it void. Distrust will move back and things will be the way they were
This doesn't mean such mechanics cant exist, just that they would require an awful lot of work and constant supervision, both things devs on this game are not willing to really do, they got works, lifes etc and they shield themselves with that despite how wrong they're little pet project goes... Which to say, what they do isn't wrong at all, or at any level, its just a pet project and see it as such.
Ill repeat since you didn't get it on my first post, this community is FULL OF ASSHOLES, TROLLS, and whatnot, I dare say half of the people that plays this are twats, tossers, idiots and 12yr old kids, The fact you dont see just how many there are is because they're dormant, waiting for wipe. IT will be HELL when that happens and you'll realize the magnitude of the trolls on this game. IF you can enjoy the constant frustration from playing with, against and alongside trolls then go ahead, if not then shut the fuck up, and if you're very so inclined to add something, then be very thoughtful instead of throwing random ideas that can bring to random abuse. Scrutinize every idea you can come up with, ALOT, because everyone else is doing so since we dont want abusive mechanics, just abusive players
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beginning training/tutorial area's WERE part of the game essence of Fo1 and Fo2.
You weren't thrown at 21's with CA and LSW's your first day on the job either.
I like to think the only reason we don't have this is because of limited man power versus the amount of time it would take to build and script it.
The ONLY people you see arguing against this idea are the griefers themselves.
I don't mind PKers one bit BUT there is an extreme short sightedness to the griefing where they don't realize that their behavior is caping our population and perhaps even diminishing it. There is a very likely possibility that they are 'over hunting' and they don't seem to mind or perhaps fail to understand this.
community is always low and there is a high drop out rate. Let's not pretend the problem doesn't exist.
If you went the right way you didn't run into horrible end game enemies. If you whimsically wandered towards the coast you got slaughtered by said end game enemies if you couldn't avoid them. (Actually, if you went the right direction half cocked you still got slaughtered, but not as badly.)
Speaking personally, it's not a matter of griefing weak players I see. It's a matter of "a person I don't know".
"I should shoot him, because he might not be friendly/I want his stuff"
I guess it involves some malice, but it's not really about ruining someones day, so much as getting more stuff for me, and friendly players who need equipment. (And yes, at some point, one will have the need for shitty newb equipment, for newbs and stuff. Even if you don't, it can still be sold.)
Even when I don't even have the carry weight left to carry loot, I still shoot unknowns on sight on general principal, you just can't trust them.
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If you went the right way you didn't run into horrible end game enemies. If you whimsically wandered towards the coast you got slaughtered by said end game enemies if you couldn't avoid them. (Actually, if you went the right direction half cocked you still got slaughtered, but not as badly.)
Speaking personally, it's not a matter of griefing weak players I see. It's a matter of "a person I don't know".
"I should shoot him, because he might not be friendly/I want his stuff"
I guess it involves some malice, but it's not really about ruining someones day, so much as getting more stuff for me, and friendly players who need equipment. (And yes, at some point, one will have the need for shitty newb equipment, for newbs and stuff. Even if you don't, it can still be sold.)
Even when I don't even have the carry weight left to carry loot, I still shoot unknowns on sight on general principal, you just can't trust them.
All I'm saying is that If you are hunting players and see a blue suite with no weapon and 40 HP in the middle of a fight with some brahmin there are two ways you can go.
You can blow pieces of him all over the wasteland for a few weak healing powders and maybe some hides and junk and risk him rage quiting as a result, meaning no repeat business..
Or you can leave him to his own devices. Let him have his powders and kill the brahmin. let him make a tent and earn some real loot. Then next time you meet him he might have something actually worth killing him for. By this point he would have a much better understanding of the game and less likely to walk away from it meaning he will be back with more loot and you're attack would have been less of a slap in the face and more of a lesson.
IMO #2's the way to go.
But I also wasn't trying to single out player killing (which imo isn't synonymous with griefing). I really meant griefing in all of it's forms
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All I'm saying is that If you are hunting players and see a blue suite with no weapon and 40 HP in the middle of a fight with some brahmin there are two ways you can go.
You can blow pieces of him all over the wasteland for a few weak healing powders and maybe some hides and junk and risk him rage quiting as a result, meaning no repeat business..
Or you can leave him to his own devices. Let him have his powders and kill the brahmin. let him make a tent and earn some real loot. Then next time you meet him he might have something actually worth killing him for. By this point he would have a much better understanding of the game and less likely to walk away from it meaning he will be back with more loot and you're attack would have been less of a slap in the face and more of a lesson.
IMO #2's the way to go.
But I also wasn't trying to single out player killing (which imo isn't synonymous with griefing). I really meant griefing in all of it's forms
Ideally, yes.
I don't always waste bullets on someone like that. If they do anything threatening though, it won't go well. Just because someone doesn't have armor doesn't mean they aren't dangerous.
And like I said, it kind of levels out. I promote the experience of new players in my group, who don't feel like quitting because they have support. That's just kind of how my group of fellow players works. Everything is about our group, not random people. Sometimes we recruit people, a lot of times we shoot them in the face. It ends up being not fun for us if we are just naive.
It does vary of course. It's a safe bet that some poor schmuck wandering around a less PVP intensive wilderness area isn't that dangerous. Your bigger hunting areas, for players and NPC's, well, you have to learn sometime that it's not safe to hunt there, because people hunt YOU too.