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[RavenousRat]

Removing level cap could be the answer but we'd get ubermensch. Players aren't meant to be all-universal or spend most of their time in levelling.

We can have all skills on max righ now, but for this you need to fast relog, everything they suggest is to make it possible without relogging, so you can stay on the same character.
And of couse, making universal player must be much more difficult than make combat alt+crafter of X alt+crafter of Y alt+doc+bomber+...
Just make only tagged skills possible to up higher than on 150%, others skills shouldn't get higher.
Returning XP diminishing will remove grinding on the same mobs whole life from 1st to max level, also implementing the same system for crafting (crafting the same item gives less and less XP) will make it more difficult too.
It's now so easy to get billion XP mostly 'cause if kills, critters' death shouldn't be the only way to get XP, because after XP diminishing was disabled it's the only way to obtain XP, yes, of couse you can use crafting to lvl, but... may be only on first levels and if you're 1 CH and don't have mentats to make quests at begin to get like 4th or 5th level without crafting or shooting/punching anyone, anything else is grinding on one type of mobs whole time to get 21st level. Don't need implement other source of XP, simply nerf XP for killing and give every character all ways avaible to get XP. Powerbuild can't do anything except for killing, if your character can be, as you want to call, ubermensch, it'll change only one - you don't need to fast relog on your other character, because you can do that yourself. And please, don't say "It'll kill communication, everyone become selfish", hahaha, even now, look at gang, almost every member has his own armor crafter, there're alot SGBGEW crafters, some docs, people still have thier own crafters, even if I myself don't have any crafting alt except for doc (whom I don't use), I still don't see any problems. And it's really easy to get your own crafter, just make 10 IN + skilled + SPECIAL stats required for your prof, few levels on quests/grinding on mobs and you can craft whatever you need. Making players specialized on something here is useless, they still being universal, but they need to relog for this, not much will be changed if we'll be universal, but more interest to play and always have an aim for something.

[avv]

Lol, just like we weren't all-universal now  . All attempts to limit players by setting impassable barriers have turned out to be pointless. Removing levelcap is like accepting something that is inevitable anyway.

You're right, we're omnipotent right now too. But the other ways to get players to play one char only are for example making it more profitable. Removing level cap makes it more profitable but brings other worries along with it. However if the crafting outcome would be dependent how succesfully you play your char in  quests and npc relations, pvp and pve players would be forced to make more well rounded - but still focused chars. Reputation has potential for this. You gain rep from various sources like fighting, questing and selling but you can't farm only one area for rep. If you lack fighting skills or charisma you don't get that much rep. Reputation unlocks crafting schematics so basically a player who manages to net his character most rep from all of those sources gets to craft best equipment.
If you make many chars, they won't have any rep and can only craft low tier stuff.
In addition players could achieve additional perks by experiencing all sorts of activities with one char. This way an experienced balanced char could be equal in combat as freshly out of oven powerbuild fighter. Rep could be harnessed to serve this purpose too.

Lastly, combat has to be less dependent on build and more dependent on player's skills. For example aiming has to do more with clever use of enviroment rather than character's weapon skill%.  

It's now so easy to get billion XP mostly 'cause if kills, critters' death shouldn't be the only way to get XP, because after XP diminishing was disabled it's the only way to obtain XP, yes, of couse you can use crafting to lvl, but... may be only on first levels and if you're 1 CH and don't have mentats to make quests at begin to get like 4th or 5th level without crafting or shooting/punching anyone, anything else is grinding on one type of mobs whole time to get 21st level. Don't need implement other source of XP, simply nerf XP for killing and give every character all ways avaible to get XP. Powerbuild can't do anything except for killing,

However powerbuilds could just level their chars to the level of efficiency that's needed. Once you've maxed the fighting abilities, there's no longer need to improve that character. Same goes with crafters.

[RavenousRat]

However powerbuilds could just level their chars to the level of efficiency that's needed. Once you've maxed the fighting abilities, there's no longer need to improve that character. Same goes with crafters.

What are you talking about? Pure crafters need to be like 5-8 lvl, don't know exactly, with 10 IN and skilled and good natured traits you need like 5th or 6th lvl to get 3rd doc prof, and you don't need to touch this character again. 6+ lvl will just go into outdoorsman or FA/doc to heal someone at base with fastrelog.
Powerbuild must be 21st level, or else it's not a power build... if you'll max your abilites on like 18th level (), then you can have 3 levels of something else, and it's not a powerbuild already.

[avv]

What are you talking about? Pure crafters need to be like 5-8 lvl, don't know exactly, with 10 IN and skilled and good natured traits you need like 5th or 6th lvl to get 3rd doc prof, and you don't need to touch this character again. 6+ lvl will just go into outdoorsman or FA/doc to heal someone at base with fastrelog.
Powerbuild must be 21st level, or else it's not a power build... if you'll max your abilites on like 18th level (), then you can have 3 levels of something else, and it's not a powerbuild already.

There are limited ammount of perks that are useful in pvp for snipers and big gunners. If you make a sniper powerbuild, you don't necessarily need all the perks in the world, just maxed out certain stats, skills and best sniping related perks.

But level cap + exp diminishing isn't all awful idea. It actually has something in it but it also has downsides. If players could get all skills to near max, stats must have to bear greater weight on character development to prevent too universal chars from being created. Roles and tradeoffs are the whole point of faction-based games, if a way to kill alts but keep focused roles exists it should be top priority goal.

[RavenousRat]

Roles and tradeoffs are the whole point of faction-based games, if a way to kill alts but keep focused roles exists it should be top priority goal.

Yes, but is it possible to find something that will force players to not use all the roles at the same time, if this is multiplayer internet game, where you can create other character, then again and again, and you alone can take all the roles.

[avv]

Yes, but is it possible to find something that will force players to not use all the roles at the same time, if this is multiplayer internet game, where you can create other character, then again and again, and you alone can take all the roles.

Alt problem is mostly crafting and fighting efficiency related. This can be fixed by making requirements for fighting powerbuild less steep so that you don't need so big investments to become best combat build. Rest is up to your skills ingame. And to become best crafter you need to do other things (fighting, questing) than just have the crafting profesion and mats. New chars wouldn't help because maybe you can spend some time with your inexperienced armorer and get some low tier stuff, but if you used that time playing your experienced gunsmith-fighter you'd get hight tier stuff which could be traded for high tier armors.

[RavenousRat]

Alt problem is mostly crafting and fighting efficiency related. This can be fixed by making requirements for fighting powerbuild less steep so that you don't need so big investments to become best combat build. Rest is up to your skills ingame. And to become best crafter you need to do other things (fighting, questing) than just have the crafting profesion and mats. New chars wouldn't help because maybe you can spend some time with your inexperienced armorer and get some low tier stuff, but if you used that time playing your experienced gunsmith-fighter you'd get hight tier stuff which could be traded for high tier armors.

Well if your character is a crafter, it doesn't mean you'll get all mats/resources/whatever else by this character. All you need from this character is give him resources, then go to workbrench/machine/whatever else, press some buttons and then give item to main character/someone else. You don't need to do with pure crafter alt anything else.

[avv]

Well if your character is a crafter, it doesn't mean you'll get all mats/resources/whatever else by this character. All you need from this character is give him resources, then go to workbrench/machine/whatever else, press some buttons and then give item to main character/someone else. You don't need to do with pure crafter alt anything else.

Let's say you need some special mats that are in the posession of san fransisco npc faction. To get these mats you need good rep with san fran. You get a good sf rep by selling items to them, questing for them and killing the enemies of sf and defending sf members and its allies. You need to do all of this to get the best mats and crafting schematics, you can't just farm one section. To get these mats your character has to be pretty damn well rounded to achieve all these goals. But still focused on some profesion because you want to craft the highest tier stuff.

That's just for crafting.

To discourage players from giving their craftables away they would - first of all - be always busy getting more reputation and secondly you could also unlock perks and buffs with the reputation. These perks and buffs would be helpful in pvp so that your balanced char would be equal to freshly created powerbuilds in combat. Because combat powerbuilds couldn't properly get rep due to lacking questing abilities, nobody would want to make "pure anything" chars.

But combat in general should be less dependent on builds and more dependent on player's skills. Then combat powerbuilds wouldn't be so absolute must for serious pvp and players would stick to one chars out of sheer leisure.

[Elmehdi]

To discourage players from giving their craftables away they would - first of all - be always busy getting more reputation and secondly you could also unlock perks and buffs with the reputation. These perks and buffs would be helpful in pvp so that your balanced char would be equal to freshly created powerbuilds in combat. Because combat powerbuilds couldn't properly get rep due to lacking questing abilities, nobody would want to make "pure anything" chars.

These must be quite powerful combat boosts to make people play PvP with crafter . Somehow it reminds me this topic, where we were discussing about buyable character adjustments. Here are some examples of what I had in mind back then:

·   VC medics could be able to buy combat implants, giving them 10% bonus to all resistances – it would make it worth for PvPer to be one.

·   Having good reputation with raiders could enable an option to buy a special weapon training, giving you a little chance to cripple a target, no matter if a critical hit was scored or not.

·   Trappers could teach you how to track your target better, slightly reducing its FoV towards you and giving you extra chance of detecting a sneaking character.

Of course such extra boosts must require working for some particular faction (not necessary belonging to it), and what’s related – not being a hideous powerbuild. These are just examples, but the rule is simple: in order to make a well-rounded characters take part in PvP, there must be some important combat boosts available only for them. It's also important for these adjustments not to interfere with a character build, so they can't be just simple f.e. +10 to your gun skill or + 1 to agility and so on. It's wider explained in the topic.

Unfortunately it means A LOT of time and effort to implement such features and balance them properly. As for now it’s much easier to achieve a similar goal by just letting players advance further traditional way. Even a primary fully combat oriented powerbuild will become a crafter/fighter hybrid on some high enough level, which means less alts, and more comfortable gaming, without having to switch characters every 5 min.