Other > Suggestions
I am awkward with Sniper r., but want to play SG
vedaras:
--- Quote from: Midnight on May 16, 2010, 10:59:01 pm ---Yeah and it's exaclty the topic SMGs are useless, thanks to approve Verdaras. I wonder what happn if they change plasma grenades, make them cost 1cap and do 20 domm only, the domm/cost ratio would be great, but i'm pretty sure you'll be here to say this suck and is useless.
So what's the point to make useless features, again?
--- End quote ---
well if frags would cost 1 ap, they would be the most powerful weapon in whole game ^^
Midnight:
That's just what i was poiting.
You have assault rifle, bad weapons, worst than 10mm smg for much more cost, maybe there should be a fix here.
Second if you check FN Fal ok it a little better than Assault rifle, but for a silly cost and greatly inferior to P90c (more AP to shoot, same dom in single but less in burst)
And you have finally the FN Fal HFPA supposed to be the best SG possible to craft in the game, and it's a little better than P90 in single and a bit weaker in burst, for a cost really high.
I know nobody use FN Fal HFPA but this weapon should be a Light LSW or something like this regarding all required to use, and it's not the case so it's useless.
Seriously Small Gun interresting can be listed fast.
BB gun for militia kill
Deagle and 10mm SMG cause they are cheap and average weapons
Needler was interresting cause of low ammo cost and fair doms (no more the case)
P90c cause it cost few AP and ammos are cheap
All .223 guns for sniping
All shootguns are useless, all burst rifles (tommy gun, XL70E3, Assault rifle, FN Fal, FN Fal HFPA), grease gun, magnum, 14mm, mauser. And i don't take pipe rifle and so in count.
Must admit it's a few useless guns :D
Lordus:
--- Quote from: vedaras on May 16, 2010, 10:36:02 pm ---you forgot one thing. Demo expert (using plasma nades) fires 300 caps with each hit. Big gunner with rocket launcher fires like 350-500 with each hit. Big gunner with minigun is a thing only rich people can afford ( im not talking about only using it in pvp, about lvling up etc). Energy expert fires bullets that are hard to craft, and about double as valuable as sg bullets (and in same times their ammo are resisted by armors very will, while sg bullets are not). And so SG fires like 9-16 caps with each shot, and something like 50-100 caps with each burst. So common, dont be so selfish and dont expect others to overpower sg more then it is now.
--- End quote ---
I dont want to be offensive, but it looks that you dont get the point. Your equation is right, but because you were not continuously PvP, you have forget to put it into bigger equation.
You put a question: How expensive is to fire one shot or burst in each combat class?
BG (avenger) burst cost = 40 * 15 = 600 caps
SG (As.rifle) burst cost = 8 * 15 = 120 caps
Better question is: How expensive is to fire one shot or burst in each combat class, if you want to make same damage?
BG vs SG (as. rifle) full ap bursts costs
BG needs 3*40 ammo * price = 120 * 15 = 1500 caps,
SG needs = 3 x 8 * price = 360 caps.
BUT:
One Avenger burst =cca 105 DMG (agaisnt classic power build with metal MK2)
One AS.R. burst = cca 29 DMG (-II-).
So if SG burster wants to do same damage like Avenger guy, he needs to fire 3,5 x more than avenger.
So price for 105 damage is 600 caps / BG avenger
and 420/SG as.r.. So prices are very similar. So your argument is wrong. (EDITED, i mate math mistake)
BUT: You dont have only ammo for one burst, you have more ammo, that you can lost. You have also gun, armor, drugs. You invest your real time to find and craft it.
So the right question is: How much effort have i to make, if i want to be succesful in PvP (or PvE)?
Every PvP player needs equipment. Armor, weapon, ammo, stimps and drugs. Everybody knows, that if you want to play BG avenger in PvP, your costs are greater than SG AS burst. But each class needs armor, so this price is same for everyone. Other equipment is more expensive for BG. Ok, how much? 3x? 4x? 5x? Lets say 5x /price not only in caps, but in time you need to spend = real costs.
So if BG stuff is 5x expensive in PvP than SGs A.R. stuff ( 5:1), do bigguners have 5x bigger chance to win the combat against SG AS.Rifles? NO, they dont. Chance of SG assault riffle win against biggunner is equal to ZERO. (1:50). Just look at their bursts damage and their weapons range. Only very experienced SG burster can kill average BG burster. But if their players skills are equal, BG has bigger chances.
vedaras:
--- Quote from: Midnight on May 17, 2010, 12:18:26 am ---That's just what i was poiting.
You have assault rifle, bad weapons, worst than 10mm smg for much more cost, maybe there should be a fix here.
Second if you check FN Fal ok it a little better than Assault rifle, but for a silly cost and greatly inferior to P90c (more AP to shoot, same dom in single but less in burst)
And you have finally the FN Fal HFPA supposed to be the best SG possible to craft in the game, and it's a little better than P90 in single and a bit weaker in burst, for a cost really high.
I know nobody use FN Fal HFPA but this weapon should be a Light LSW or something like this regarding all required to use, and it's not the case so it's useless.
Seriously Small Gun interresting can be listed fast.
BB gun for militia kill
Deagle and 10mm SMG cause they are cheap and average weapons
Needler was interresting cause of low ammo cost and fair doms (no more the case)
P90c cause it cost few AP and ammos are cheap
All .223 guns for sniping
All shootguns are useless, all burst rifles (tommy gun, XL70E3, Assault rifle, FN Fal, FN Fal HFPA), grease gun, magnum, 14mm, mauser. And i don't take pipe rifle and so in count.
Must admit it's a few useless guns :D
--- End quote ---
you forget one thing, and the main thing is that you cant make all small guns good in fights. Flamer is shitty weapon in real time versus player fight too, but i dont see anyone whining to make it range 50 or anything. Avenger cost a little over 10k caps, p90 cost 6300, 10mm smg is worthless at all, pretty much same as assault rifles and fn fals compared to expensive big guns. So i still dont get it, why you want cheap shitty guns to be as effective as expensive themselves big guns and which are also much more expensive in using (by ammo consuming)?
Tyler:
It would be alot of fun for the classes to all be somewhat equal in the end stages and i dont really see a problem with it.Cost is only an issue if prices were set in stone and its not.Nothing is set in stone during a beta so raising sm gun prices to match the effectiveness in combat seems like a fair trade to me.If it brings more diversity to game then im all for it.
Maybe you should try to be a little more open minded vederas because afterall you seem to find alot of little things you want implemented.I see your suggestions all over this forum but almost never see anything positive come from you on anyone elses.
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
[*] Previous page
Go to full version