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[AfriXan]

Just to be clear, I am not raging about getting killed. I've read the forums, I've read the FAQs and the wiki and I realise that the game is meant to be a pvp, dog eat dog, survival of the nastiest etc. free for all. I also realise that this point has been made before with various levels of coherence and anger.

However, building my second char as a crafter, I realised that a new player by himself who isn't built as a combat monster has almost no chance of progressing. The powder crafting solution is an interesting one but for that to be lasting you have to be near an easily accesible bank where you can store your money between gathering trips. The only bank that meets this criteria is NCR. NCR is possibly the most dangerous place for new characters simply because its the griefing capital of FOnline.

If you spawn somewhere else, VC for example, it's no safer and you have a long trek ahead of you to get to NCR (BH is a deathtrap) assuming (as a non combat build) you will survive the first two map squares let alone enough of the trip to respawn nearer than you were when you started.

Looking on the boards I saw the "get a tent" solution. It seems like a valid one until you realise you would have to shovel at least 100 shits if not 150 to afford the tent, assuming you can find a trader with the skins and don't get killed or robbed (which is unlikely) in all that time.

I then thought: Missions! and then realised there are no missions beyond shit shoveling that are safe. I thought Mining! Then realised that mining is like sticking a big "Pks come get me" sign over your head.

Maybe I'm missing something but I picked this game because (I thought) it is relatively grind free compared to shit like WoW. I now see that without friends most new characters will basically have to grind shit shovelling for days just to have a chance.

I am just a newb and probably the more experienced guys have techniques that allow them to play with no help from friends and become lvl 21 and fully kitted out in no time. That is all good for them but really alienates new players. The guides seem to ignore the fact that no progression is possible if you are getting torn to pieces before you can get a tent which in turn means you can never build a tent.

Anyway, this isn't good bye. I love FOnline and will keep playing and will keep quitting every few minutes to let the respawn time count down while I read emails or webcomics. It just seems like a shame that the community has gone this way to encourage a system that massively penalises solo or beginner players.

[Michaelh139]

We are just REALLY paranoid that the game will turn into what you just tried to get away from (WoW) so the only way we see to keep that from happening is keeping it as BRUTAL and HARSH as possible without making levelling in itself hard.  It's all about knowing how to work in the world, find your place, build on it, and move on.

And shoveling shit...   You are doing it wrong!  just saying.  You're supposed to grab a gun, go out, and pew pew some brahmins for the hides, or beg in ncr for handouts of spare brahmin hides.  NCR may be the biggest grief capital but it's also the biggest beggar/handout location.

And yes...  To even live in this game at all you need a tent.  That's first and foremost.

[JustGreat]

I've read the forums

If you are shoveling shit, then you are playing this game completely wrong and there are many discussions on this forum how to make money easy money without killing anything, one of them being collecting junk. If you decide to go killing brahmins for your hides, there are strategies for that too (also on the forums), it involves killing brahmins in remote locations, and hiding hides in safe locations (might not be necessary if you are good in combat). Think of getting hides as an introductory quest to the game. 

Personally, I never did quests, but you can get a decent level (I remember a guy reaching 21 just mostly from quests) just by doing them, and just because NCR is guarded with a near by mine, doesn't mean it is the best place to start (though most people naively believe that). There are locations (Ghost Farm, Klamath, VC, etc.) you can start that are more susceptible to PKers, but if you can learn to avoid them, it becomes a much more comfortable location for crafting/exping.

[Vaimortal]

This game is hardcore , that's why i didn't leave it even when i had to die like a million times to learn everything i need to survive the hard way.
Well this is a MMO so interaction with other players is good , even better if you find somebody who can help you get on your feet.
When i started to play , some guy on the forum said he would give me like 100 k to help me , but i rejected that money wanted to do shit myself.

I leveled 2 my charecters without any help to level 21 , constantly gathering information how to progress and get better and i succeeded , you should do the same.

For the brahmin hides , get 1 k somehow and try to buy 10 brahmin hides , most likely you will get it for free.
I shoveled shit for my first 1 k so...why not shoveling shit ?

Oh and answering to your topics question , yes there is point playing this game without bunch of RL friends.

[Lexx]

I shoveled shit for my first 1 k so...why not shoveling shit ?

Other jobs like caravan box lifting is easier and less annoying. You get less xp from it, but more money for less clicking.

[JovankaB]

Box lifting? Boooring...

Want quick money? Wait for some big TC battle, grab a brotherhood armor from ground and RUN LIKE HELL
You could probably sell it for 100 brahmin hides, so get 9 other newbies with you - you will have 10x more chance of success!

[DocAN.]

gather 30 roots or flowers -> craft 30 weak powders -> sell it for 1200 caps

I think it is the easiest way.

You can also make some quest i.e. Wastland_Band quest.

[avv]

Best way at the moment is to hunt encounters and sell their items. Requirements for crafter are very high and the skill needed for profesions limit your combat effectiveness.
Here's a list of traders which explains important things like what each trader sells and how much charisma you need.

You can trade with some merchants even with charisma 1 and others if you take drugs. Cha3 isn't even that bad solution if you want mercs or slaves.

When you start killing encounters, you best start from geckos and brahmins for example. And while you do this, combine it with gathering weak healingpowder like DocAn suggested. You can also try to encounter npcs that fight each other and have a chance to pick up some loot. However don't loot until the combatants have looted or they start attacking you.

[Haterade]

" It's all about knowing how to work in the world, find your place, build on it, and move on."

now thats some heavy lethal raping words!

[avv]

" It's all about knowing how to work in the world, find your place, build on it, and move on."

now thats some heavy lethal raping words!

It's just fonline is highly abusable and vulnerable to loophole methods. It's just matter of principle whether or not to abuse them.

[Ulrek]

Grab a SMG, walk up to modoc, set it on turn based and find some brahmin. you'll have enough hides in about 2-5 minutes if you're lucky.

Second, gather first, craft second, make a combat/crafter to start with, something like a SG/armor maker if you can. use it to farm loot. outfit a real combat character after you've stockpiled stuff. and than go farm bigger stuff, than look for a bigger faction that is friendly to newbies once you have enough fire power to be respected (Metal armor Mk2 and an assault rifle along with 170-200 HP is usually enough to look useful) and either join them, or at least get in to a trade relationship with them. loners just play by themselves, there is nothing that says they cant make friends and trade. than once you've found a faction of trust worthy people (APK gangs aren't always nice but they're not base rapists so they're a safe bet), than ask two of their members to help you buy a personal base once you have the money.

And poof, you're sitting on your own private base, have some friends that aren't RL buddies, and a fairly good stockpile of SG's at least, if not loot from unity/RotMA encounters to.

-Ulrek-

[brad smalls]

i say most of my buddies i ment in NCR but joining a faction is good

[Who Killed Bambi]

u can play fonline just like fo2, with bad build, and nearby same skills(without speach - u need rl skills to speak/gambling-dont work/ and few other), u just die like often save in fo2 before steal (when steal gauss ammo) or shoot in eyes when u have 5hp and huge enemy. and dont worry about stuff and caps, i meet low lvl thief in hub, he just steal from me and all npc around (any idea about how he succes), i tell him about Shiv in reno (npc to rob) he say *ok*, and go to reno, never meet him again...

[headshot]

The main difference between FOnline and Fallout  as someone wrote on forum is that FOnline is Massive (yeah, in our case it sounnds funny) Multiplayer Online computer Role Playing Game. I saw very much loners (I mean non-factioned) who doing quite well. But yes, having some mates in the game (not only rl ones) is ... uselful and quite helpful.
Imho, VC is the hardest spawn for newcomers, but it's possible to get out of there. There's no point to compare FOnline: 2238 to World of Warcraft.  Why?
WoW is pay to play MMO game developed by professional studio and it's about fantasy world. Our FOnline is free to play, developed by group of programmers and Fallout fans who updating game when they have some free time and above all it's about post-apocalyptic world. So who said the life after the nuclear holocaust will be easy and everybody will help each other with smile? This is mainly grim anarchistic universe where you're doing what you want, you're not forced to choose your patch of knight in shining armor or bad warlock. You're just trying to survive another day. Life in post-nuclear California is not so bad, but... quite dangrous.

However there's still groups of more experienced players who are ready to help the newcomers.  Jus try ask 'round or read this forum.

[Who Killed Bambi]

and u can change game abit, buy make suggestion about smthn (read 67 boards of suggestion before, it takes only half hour, or more).
lot of suggestion come to life in game, and like u see video before fallout (by gamers for gamers) this game is same.
pk, pvp - small part of fonline. (afaik).