Character Animations

[Lexx]

The animation should look like the original one. Remember that we try to hit the original style and not invent something new now.

[Lizard]

Updated: added arm constraints => you can move around the arms.

If someone wants to play around with posing or something like that, here's the rigged model with leg constraints.
Install Blender 2.49 and Python for opening it.
Switching views around: 1,3,7 on numpad
Switching between object mode and posing mode with Ctrl+Tab
rightclick+R for rotating appendage joints from your view, rightclick+R+X,Y or Z to rotate the joint on certain axis.
rightclick+G for grabbing joints and move them. Rightclick+G+X,Y or Z to move it on certain axis.
Alt+R for resetting rotation, Alt+G to reset the position.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=8FUJIX5C

[Luther Blissett]

Lizard - did you have a chance to look at the bits I'd posted here? May not be of any use - but if we can get the rigs to match closely enough, we can reuse a lot of the existing human animations and reshape them to the other body types according to the sprites. Notably, as well as the bodies themselves, parts of the skeleton are also attached to every single armour, clothing, hat etc - so if these can be made compatible, it will save a lot of time and work.

I'm not sure if the animations link to the rigs by name / position / linkage of bones or by some other means i.e. are the existing animation compatible with your new rig, or would they each need remaking? Basically, it's an area I have little to no experience in, so we'd pretty much need your knowledge, advice and ideas on this one.

[Lizard]

Thanks for the files, Luther! Most interesting...

So far, i failed to import .X skeleton to Blender, i'm just trying a different approach with another software to export...

If the port fails, there's a possible solution for importing animations on another rig - the original animation on Skeleton A is imported and appropriately scaled to the new rig (Skeleton B), then, the bones from NEW Skeleton B should copy the location and rotation of OLD Skeleton A in the same scene, then, both skeletons mustn't exactly copy each other, only joints must be in same positions.

So, one of skeletons will be probably just a provisional solution for easier posing/animating and another one will actually be the official skeleton which moves the models in-game.


For me, i'm no expert either and i'm waiting for Karpov to appear, too.

[Luther Blissett]

Sounds good

From what I can gather, if the bones have the same name and same hierarchy, it should work - and it will work much better if they're in the same place. You should be able to add additional "moving sticks" and constraints to make the animation process easier without it affecting the end result. I'm not 100% on this yet, but I'll study what I've got and see what I can get working on it. Graf's got a few extra files which you might want to look at as well.

I'm under the impression the skeleton bits I had exported previously have picked up a few "glitches" and extra bits on the way - there's a lot of "no_name_xx" bones, which I think were created from import / export rather than actually needing to be there - certainly, it appears that it's only the named bones that should be rigged to the model anyway.

I may be able to draw up a diagram - labelling each bone, its name and how it's linked together and how it's rigged to the model, get something of the correct shape into blender, then you might be able to build the new skeleton around this... which SHOULD be completely compatible... I think.

Anyway, theoretically : An infinite amount of non-experts, working on an infinite amount of 3d programs, will eventually produce the works of Karpov

[Lizard]

Nah, because 'non-experts' don't have time to learn everything just from trial-and-error, what also would frustrate them. We need a simplified tutorial without much going into detail, something that doesn't really explain HOW it works, but allow a satisfying, motivating result, e.g., you don't need to explain the electricity to explain how to turn on the heatplate.

I think, every user on this forums can arrange a good pose to start with, if instructed which buttons are to push.
THEN we have a army of non-experts able to produce a mass of results AND if the user starts to ask WHY "this thing works this way", then we have a good start for a new 'expert'

[Luther Blissett]

Thankfully I'm quite slow to get frustrated (even when this stuff isn't working right at all, it's less frustrating than my 'real work'), so I'm trying to learn what I can when I have time. Despite it all being trial and error, I successfully managed to get a fully working replacement animation in last night (I swapped the walk cycle for a 'silly walk') - and though my recent rigging model attempt wasn't 100% successful, I'm a lot closer to understanding how it works.

Anyway, I pretty much agree with what you're saying there, particularly regarding the 'simplified tutorial' and electricity example etc - I'd mentioned this in a message to Graf the other day :

"Ideally, we want an accurate and compatible skeleton and animations in as many 'open' or widely compatible formats as possible - so people with blender / maya / max / milkshape / gmax / mod tool / poser or whatever can all contribute something - ideally with a bit of guidance on files and formats, "best methods" and to set a few "good examples" first, so we don't end up with too many "the model is rigged, except for its left arm which sticks out" (as I had managed so far) "
If between a few of us we can set up working skeletons, and converted animations in a number of programs / formats, with basic instructions on what formats to export in etc, it's a lot closer to the state which you describe, where we can give some good instructions to any new volunteers.

Obviously, if I have any great successes with getting things working, I'll send you the files across. I'm also looking at trying to put together a few diagrams of the bone structure and rigging etc - so if we can't find a way to import into Blender properly, we can probably recreate an accurate enough skeleton which is 100% compatible.

[barter1113]

http://www.nma-fallout.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=55655&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=160
Maybe Rain man can do special death animations for Karpov models?

[Luther Blissett]

Well found. Certainly worth asking, though I expect he's busy with the Olympus stuff at the moment. I think they're rendered to sprites, then drawn on pixel by pixel, but I'm not sure. Would be very interested to know his process with those. Even if he can't help himself, if we know how it's been done, we can consider it as an option.

[Karpov]

Okay, good news. My research on death anims finally gave me something that works  . The previous test on these anims, was not good enough, so I had to change the whole Idea.
 Added as a new character type, this new model can be sliced in half, have a severed head, arm, forearm, a hole in his chest, and a big hole in right torso.
Standard animations still work for this one, so adding new animations over it would not be a problem. However, I had to use a different bone system for creating this one, which is not what I prefer, but it works.

Check the video. There is no animation yet in this one, but I had to test how it worked.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FI2WfsZbKAA

I hope I can add the inside of the body and some extra bloody parts blowing up. Along with the animation it could look good.


Another thing, the female animations not as easy to convert as I expected. There is one in the repository, for pistol shot. command is "run debug anim 1 8 29".
I had to blend the male shoot anim with the female idle pose, which was not easy , and that's how it will be for the rest 

[LagMaster]

awesome, so when you take lethal damage, you change the body skin with the "killed" one, and play the animation

[Luther Blissett]

Lag : That should be the plan, yes - switching the body model to play the killed animation... unless the "killed" model can be used throughout...

Karpov : Good work. When you say "Standard animations still work for this one", do you mean that the normal walk, run, idle etc works with it? If so, is it easier to use the "killed" model in place of the existing model - so instead of switching the model upon death, it stays as the "killed" one throughout?

Also, are there any thoughts or ideas on a way of running 2D effects on top of the 3D ones? (i.e. a 2D animation of blood splatter, with a transparent background could be placed on top). Thinking particularly about the flame and plasma deaths, which would be very difficult to do otherwise.

[Graf]

Oh, that's a great news, Karpov! I hope there will be more news soon.

I only have a single question at the moment - do you plan to recreate original animations only, or there also will be some additional animations? Maybe you've mentioned that before, but I can't remember for sure.

[Karpov]

"Killed" one is pretty decent, but with a closer look you can see the cuts on his body, so let's just use it when needed. The only problem is that it takes a second to load the model if it is the first time you do it, like if it needed to load into memory, but it is not a big problem I guess.

I'm not planning on adding extra animations yet, because I am replacing the ones that are implemented. However, there are some extra animations that are actually implemented right now, like limping, VB critter limps when he is crippled. One thing I always wanted to change is the use animation for opening doors, it looks like " oh, where is the keyhole? ...ah there!". It is not a problem to add animations if they are needed.

[Luther Blissett]

I remember there being a request for a failed steal animation - so successful steals wouldn't be noticeable - the character wouldn't move - but fails would be blatantly visible, and different from the other animations (to cut down on using the "milking a cow" animation for trolling). I'd love a crippled walk option, though obviously that's dependent on if the devs want to use this.