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[Nyarla]

The radiation would be long gone, nature would have taken over and everywhere would be green and society would have been rebuilt about 150 years ago.

agreed, after 200 years, there would be more forests than wastelands. take Chernobyl disaster for example. it released as much as 400 times the radioactive contamination of the atomic bombings of hiroshima and nagasaki. after 24 years, the trees and some animal spices are reported to have taken over the area, even where the explosion occured.

as for the cars, there would probably be hundreds of highly trained mechanics and engineers living in vaults. according to fallout bible, during the great war, there were 122 vaults and 1000 residents in each. even if only 1% of these people were mechanics or engineers (they would have a fatal importance for keeping the things go) and even if half of these vaults were destroyed in war, that still makes 610 well trained engineers in the wastelands. they wouldn't have to try to understand how to make vehicles because they would probably have schematics for every engine that would be necessary after leaving the vaults. even today repairmen can convert simple diesel engines (the ones used in irrigation) into basic transportation  vehicles.

since people wouldn't have any difficulties in finding engine parts, they would start repairing cars from the day they finished making walls around the cities. because transportation would be urgently needed in search for other people or more fertile areas. and if they had advanced in energy and fusion technology before the great war like in the game, then it would be even easier, for building electric powered motors are much easier than building diesel powered ones.

due to the already existing knowledge on engines and electronics, in 200 years, people would have a more advenced technology than we have today. they would have better cars, better aircrafts, better tanks... they would be building new vaults for The Great War II.

[Keldorn]

Keep inmind the US government was pretty fucked up with the vault experiments.  Some of them might not have had schematics at all.  Remember only a few control vaults were meant to be opened and the people to actually re-work the wastelands.  I supposed there would be some mechanics but would these folks actually share their knowledge with the world at large?  The only reason vault dwellers even co-mingled with the outsiders was because of desperation like Shady Sands and the ghouls.

Again as Surf mentioned its more than just parts.  Even mechanics today have to comb through a car to find out what the hell is wrong with it and thats after hooking it up to a sophisticated machine.  Who says the vault car comps (indeed if there were any) would be able to maintain a connection?  Would these folks even know about cars that were 50 some odd years old?  Look at how much cars have changed from 1900s to 1950s.  Would the vault overseer or leadership want folks spending time trying to find salvageable cars throughout the entire state?

Most of the cars in the wastes look like they are totally FUBARed.  I mean those things look wrecked and many a description on the cars if you bother to mouse over them state no amount of repair will g et them moving again.

[kraskish]

I agree with you Keldorn. Cars/Robots/Train/Traintrack are impossible to exist in Fonline thats why we have them implemented

We could move on with idiotic things and have robot mercs, whats wrong with that? Would it spoil the overwhelming sticking to reality policy? I doubt it

[Keldorn]

Hey I wasn't the one who brought up logic into this.  As we all know realism is a pick and choose affair in Fallout.

I merely stated that althought I don't have a problem with robot mercs, I can understand where Surf is coming from.

Then you Krakish, decided to post some sarcastic ass comments about how irrelevant me and surfs arguments were.

[Michaelh139]

Then you Krakish, decided to post some sarcastic ass comments about how irrelevant me and surfs arguments were.

Sarcasm or not it's an arguement against your arguements.  And I have to agree.  How real is it to be able to Hire Supermutants?  Sure it has nothing to do with technology but having arguements based on realism vs mythical crap is kinda useless in the Fallout World.

[Keldorn]

I don't mind Krakish giving his input, everyones entitled to one.  However, if someones gonna go out of their way to give input in a douchebag manner directed at me, then how the hell do you expect me to respond?

With your post Michael I can respond in a few ways.

I can either talk like a rational being and say "I undersand that realism in the Fallout world is a pick and choose affair.  Somethings are in the game just to make it funner".

Or I can be a sarcastic ass and tell you how stupid your post was.  I could tell you your an un-educated idiot fanboy to simply accept whatever the devs throw at you without question.  I could remind you,, n the rudest way possble, how this game is in beta stage and devs welcome a diversity of opinions.

Which one would you prefer?

[theyseemetrollin]

I agree with you Keldorn. Cars/Robots/Train/Traintrack are impossible to exist in Fonline thats why we have them implemented

We could move on with idiotic things and have robot mercs, whats wrong with that? Would it spoil the overwhelming sticking to reality policy? I doubt it

You might want to remember at what technological level people were at when they made the railroads. Cars themselves are fairly simple machines and can be made by novice mechanics. If you're going to bitch about realism how about the fact you can craft fusion batteries or shoot plasma (firing gas -like projectiles over distance, lol).

[Nyarla]

Look at how much cars have changed from 1900s to 1950s.

thats what i mean. cars have changed remarkably in 50 years, and people had no idea where they were heading to. they were trying to find their ways out mostly with trials and errors. but those who leaves the vaults wouldn't have to repeat same trials and errors. even if they didnt have any schmatics on cars, they would have advenced knowledge on engines and electronics. as i stated in my previous comment, even today people can convert basic diesel irrigation motors into simple transportation vehicles.

mechanics today have to comb through a car to find out what the problem is because cars today have so many unnecassary features; automatic windows, sterios, rear-seat dvd players, electronic central locks, backdoor locks, seat heaters, intermittent windshield wipers, ambient lightings, air conditioners, electronically adjustable sunblinds, integrated trailer brake controllers... and lots of more stuff which are cool but not vital. some cars today have some sophisticated features even Apollo 11 didn't have. do you remember from the movies the cars that would be started by turning a crank? well that was also a car, and those didnt need to be hooked up to a sophisticated machine to be repaired.

there are lots of wrecked cars in the wasteland, i don't think that it is not possible to gain one good part from each car. at least a good tire maybe. and there also has to be some in much better conditions.

[Michaelh139]

I don't mind Krakish giving his input, everyones entitled to one.  However, if someones gonna go out of their way to give input in a douchebag manner directed at me, then how the hell do you expect me to respond?

With your post Michael I can respond in a few ways.

I can either talk like a rational being and say "I undersand that realism in the Fallout world is a pick and choose affair.  Somethings are in the game just to make it funner".

Or I can be a sarcastic ass and tell you how stupid your post was.  I could tell you your an un-educated idiot fanboy to simply accept whatever the devs throw at you without question.  I could remind you,, n the rudest way possble, how this game is in beta stage and devs welcome a diversity of opinions.

Which one would you prefer?

Either, actualy the second one would be funnier, in this game I've learned not to care what people say about me since half the population is douche central.  (No matter how much sarcasm is in there I'm being serious)

Besides,like you said,everyone is entitled to their opinion.

[Keldorn]

@Nyrla

And how would our mechanics figure out how to build or repair a Model T if they had no clue what it was.  If every single vault was an encyclopedia of information then, I can concede to your point on cars.  However, keep in mind the vault project had some serious bad case scenarios already planned for the folks inside.  Some vaults were based on gambling only (hillarious).  Some vaults planned to release psychotropic drugs into its population.  Some had the overseers room sealed.  Some never to open at all.  And then some only children in them.  Why would they contain  anything more but basic knowledge on how to maintain the vaults.  I think a bit too much credit is given to the idea of "reverse engineering"  Engineering and repair is a highly specialized field.  Same with doctors. Just because a guy can fix the air conditioner or the plumbing doesn't mean hes going to be an auto mechanic.  Also the same applies to salvaging one part of each car to salvage another completely broken car?  Even in the real world certain car parts are incompatible with other cars simply due to the differences of said cars.  Are they foreign or domestic?  Even if these were all "made in america",  you would still have different manufacturers, designs, etc.

Again, I will repeat if you move your mouse cursor over the wrecks, all of them state NO AMOUNT OF REPAIR is going to get these things moving again.  Somethings are just too fucked up to be repaired or modified.  You know, same with weapons that happen to be "beyond repair".  In your scenario we could simply fix everything as long as we had BoS, Vault City, or Enclave membership.  If the control vaults did have information on cars it would make more sense to build  or cobble up a new one.  Not saying you cannot find A SINGLE car but even then it wouldn't just be "given" to someone.  Most likely it ouwld be in the hands of techno factions.  

I don't think anyone in Klamath would seriously have the knowledge and ability to find a highwayman nevertheless have the knowledge to maintain it.  I mean how old can this mechanic be anyways if you go the route he was an original survivor of the nuclear holocaust.

@Michael

Sure I suppose I could have ignored Krakish.  I guess we can both agree on that.

[Nyarla]

building a car like a model t wouldnt be very difficult for those who operated complicated engines in vaults. i know about the real purposes of vaults, but some experiments werent deadly and people managed to exit them safely after a while. but even if nobody could make it out alive from the vaults, then ordinary people with some knowledge on engines and motors (it doesnt even have to be on cars) would be able to make some basic vehicles with all those engines around.
http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/1176/woodencar.jpg

not all the people in the wastes are cannibals or holly people. there are lots of regular folks who havent lost their knowledge about technology. people would start repairing cars or making basic vehicles as soon as it is safe to go outside. people would want to move to some warmer or cooler regions. or they would want to search for more fertile lands, valleys, or they would want to get away from raiders or supermutants and would try the far north in hopes that virus wasn't effective in colder climates... you can find thousands of more reasons why people would need transportation. then the mechanics who lived before the war could pass their knowledge to the others.

about the guns which are beyond repair: in reality, it whould be easier to gain metal parts or junk from a mauser than raw iron ores. and gaining gunpowder from bullets and shells would also be easier than gaining some from raw minerals. but i like the game as it is now (not pvp very much) i just wanted to state out that seeing cars in the game is realistic for me.

[Keldorn]

Wooden car, I like that.  I guess if the vehicles were more along those lines instead of "hummers and highwaymans", I could understand.  But even then they woudn't  be mass produced or cheap like they are in reality (wellnot cheap but theres such things as financing).  The ways of mass production are long gone with even the BoS incapable of building cars or verti-birds (although future planning sounds nice).

That wooden car looks like its being pwoered by a some kind of generator?  Probably not efficient like a real car but certainly could cruise to certain "travelable" areas.

[Nyarla]

i agree with what you say about mass production and hummers. and yes, it would be hard to see a fully functioning cars let alone the modern ones. but that wooden car would be a beginning, people would seek for the ways to improve means of transportation.

[Keldorn]

And hence my other post.  I just didn't like how they moved the 2nd one so far ahead.  They could have easily did a few decades later with more interesting problems (you know the ones stupid humans always make like war and greed n shit).

You had big cities with their own personal armies.  Reminded more of shit like mega corporations and a dystopia than post apocalytpic.  You were asked to perform diplomatic sabotage, corporate sabotage and theft.  You had NCR who had the numbers to actually stand toe to toe with the BoS??  Apparently the NCR has gotten so big that it could send human waves in to be chewed up by BoS soldiers and keep them coming.  Now I know the NCR isn't as big as China was during the Korean War.

[Keldorn]

Either, actualy the second one would be funnier, in this game I've learned not to care what people say about me since half the population is douche central.  (No matter how much sarcasm is in there I'm being serious)

Besides,like you said,everyone is entitled to their opinion.

They are entitled to an opinion not be talk like an asshat.