fodev.net
Other => FOnline:2238 Forum => Archives => Suggestions => Topic started by: borse on October 10, 2010, 02:02:36 am
-
Introduce robots as mercs. Craftable and available to purchase. Your intelligence and science levels determine how many robots you can manage. 60 science is required to program low tier robots and 120 to program high tier robots. As for intelligence, it determines how many robots you can have following you; the formula would be similar to that of charisma and mercs: int/2(round down) -1. To craft robots you need energy expert. level 2 for low tier robots (protectotron, brain robot) and level 3 for the higher tier robots (sentry bot, mr gutsy, turret).
Robots could be bought from the lady in NCR inner city at the top right corner. She already chills with robots, why not make and sell them? Robots can also be sold at Navarro, BoS base, and basically anywhere else that has a technology center.
High science skill would be required to program your robots and repair skill to keep them in tip top shape. Yes, robots have deterioration instead of HP and can be broken in combat. Broken robots can be repaired but suffer the same consequences as repaired weapons and armor (increased rate of deterioration). Broken robots can also have Science used on them to get some parts back.
Programming robots will allow you to link them to your faction database for more effective base guarding. It will also allow you to set their combat options, following options, that kind of thing. You could program your robots to shoot faction friends if they wield weapons and to not kill faction members if wielding weapons. You could give your robots a command to find and kill thieves. The options are extensive!
let me know what y'all think :)
-
i like the idea. here are some further suggestions from me:
*the robots may be have to fed with energy cells or MFCs regularly to keep them going like in the cars.
*a player must be fallowed by only one robot at a time, otherwise it would be overpowered.
*there must be a loooong cooling time in order to prevent people from filling the entire wastes with robots.
*if someone kills you and breaks your robot, he may be able to re-program it and use it as his own robot if he has the required skills (science 120% at least to re-program it and some repair skills to make it work again) but again it suffers the same consequences as repaired weapons and armor.
*player (the new owner who killed you and broke your robot) may have to re-program it and then repair it. if he succesfully repairs it before re-programming or if he succeeds in repairing the robot but fails to re-program it, it will attack him again as soon as it is repaired. so the message should be something like "You attempted to re-program the sentry bot" instead of "you succesfully re-programmed the sentry bot" or "you failed to re-program the sentry bot and broken it for good" (this may make the player think twice before deciding whether to repair a death machine or just take the energy cells and leave it there to rust.)
-
http://fodev.net/forum/index.php?topic=6420.0
http://fodev.net/forum/index.php?topic=6925.0
http://fodev.net/forum/index.php?topic=4515.0
;)
It has been suggested before, you may read in these threads I linked you to.
-
thanks for the links Surf, I'm still reading them. I noticed you were quite adamant versus the first suggestion and closed it. I'd like to know why you/the devs aren't keen on craftable and purchasable robot mercs.
-
Cause the wasteland is supposed to be more like Fallout not so much Fallout 2 or the rest.
I never liked the idea of a GECK or working helicopters, cars and trains
There was simply too much tech in Fallout 2.
-
I dont get it... helicopters came before plasma and laser weapons and so did cars. so should we get rid of energy weapons because they are too far advanced for us?
-
Cause the wasteland is supposed to be more like Fallout not so much Fallout 2 or the rest.
I never liked the idea of a GECK or working helicopters, cars and trains
There was simply too much tech in Fallout 2.
this
I dont get it... helicopters came before plasma and laser weapons and so did cars. so should we get rid of energy weapons because they are too far advanced for us?
Well if you want everything from F1, then I want invisibility device from F1. Oh shi- is that advanced? God no, Id rather play F2... shi- Fallout tact...shi- F3... damnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn I believe F1 demo had all you ever wanted...
Its not that its too advanced, why should it be? Have you ever read the fallout bible? Guess not. If you want something technologically less advanced, play settlers its postapocaliptic world after nuke war, not medieval
-
Well if you want everything from F1, then I want invisibility device from F1. Oh shi- is that advanced? God no, Id rather play F2... shi- Fallout tact...shi- F3... damnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn I believe F1 demo had all you ever wanted...
Its not that its too advanced, why should it be? Have you ever read the fallout bible? Guess not. If you want something technologically less advanced, play settlers its postapocaliptic world after nuke war, not medieval
Yea, you tell him!!! lol edited post
-
I bet Kraskish didn't direct that post to you, borse.
This thread will be the same like the 3 I linked above, endless discussions with the same arguments over and over again. :)
Here is the fallout bible btw. http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_Bible
-
Sorry borse, I was replying to Keldorn I forgot to add "and"
Well, I can say to the topic is to repeat my thoughts:
robots:yes
types: robodog, mr handy, eyebot (unarmed robots)
craftable: no
purchasable like mercs: yes
req: high INT 8-10 (1-3 total robot followers)
-
Sorry borse, I was replying to Keldorn I forgot to add "and"
Well, I can say to the topic is to repeat my thoughts:
robots:yes
types: robodog, mr handy, eyebot (unarmed robots)
craftable: no
purchasable like mercs: yes
req: high INT 8-10 (1-3 total robot followers)
Daaamnn I feel stupid. Sorry bro!
I bet Kraskish didn't direct that post to you, borse.
This thread will be the same like the 3 I linked above, endless discussions with the same arguments over and over again. :)
Here is the fallout bible btw. http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_Bible
yea seems like a lost cause now :S. Could care less really. Thanks for the Bible!
-
Everybody except Devs want robots.
Guess who wins?
-
Um lets see
Did I mentioned I had problems with energy weapons?? Nope
Did I mention I had problems with Stealth Boys?? Nope
Did I mention I hated ideas like lost technology AKA super mutants and FEV?? Nope
Great way to read my post. I will re-iterate because you apparently don't understand.
In F1 the only people with advanced technology were the BoS and the Master. Thats it. You didn't have regular run of the mill thugs with shit like rocket launchers, plasma rifles and laser rifles or gatling lasers. Were there working cars in Fallout?? Oh yeah, NO.
Every other faction had to make do with basic weaponry. Thats why i liked it so much. Kind of an hoamge to the Planet Of The Apes movie. The one where human bunker survivors were the only one with tech.
The whole idea of nation states didn't exist in Fallout. In Fallout 2 all of a sudden you have the huge NCR beast capable of outfittin an entire army. They were even able to stand toe to toe with the BoS (although with severe casualties).
I don't mind robot followers but in regards to the devs I understand. Robots is more than just a manual. You need knowledge about ceramics and other composite material. You need to understand what the stress endurance of alloys. You need knowledge about robotics and AI. Things that takes years of research and equipment and tests. You need the faciilities and resources that allow for those tests.
Imagine asking the devs for the ability for players to make verti-birds.
-
I don't mind robot followers but in regards to the devs I understand. Robots is more than just a manual. You need knowledge about ceramics and other composite material. You need to understand what the stress endurance of alloys. You need knowledge about robotics and AI. Things that takes years of research and equipment and tests. You need the faciilities and resources that allow for those tests.
Imagine asking the devs for the ability for players to make verti-birds.
You could steal the schematics for a vertibird in Fo2 btw... altho you couldn't MAKE one they were in your hands.
bout robots, dude, were making Advanced armor, lazor weapons and plasma etc. It doesn't matter what you say about technological knowledge and shit because making that in the middle of the desert is aready so god damn far-fetched I almost pissed myself laughing when I first found out you could make Avengers, Plasma rifle and all other 3-tier shit at level 4 if at all.
You dont need facilities and machines and testing to make a plasma rifle or laser btw....?
-
bout robots, dude, were making Advanced armor, lazor weapons and plasma etc.
This might change in the future. :)
-
You could steal the schematics for a vertibird in Fo2 btw... altho you couldn't MAKE one they were in your hands.
bout robots, dude, were making Advanced armor, lazor weapons and plasma etc. It doesn't matter what you say about technological knowledge and shit because making that in the middle of the desert is aready so god damn far-fetched I almost pissed myself laughing when I first found out you could make Avengers, Plasma rifle and all other 3-tier shit at level 4 if at all.
You dont need facilities and machines and testing to make a plasma rifle or laser btw....?
From what I hear the devs are planning to remove Tier 3 or something like that.
Like I said, I, don't personally have a problem with robotic followers. Take it up with the devs on that one. However, robots are still different than living talking people. And the OP was requesting robots as NPC mercs/slaves.
But yeah. the idea that regular folks can craft advanced weapons is kinda crazy. I would prefer that people be required to join BoS or Enclave to gain access to those kind of weapons.
-
I kinda like the idea of removing tier 3 crafting. It makes things a little more true to what Surf Solar said about how the game was meant to be. Early fallout 1 (I'm not entirely sure) with not much access to any of da good shit
-
Without tier 3 pvp would just be rl and smgs, make for longer fights though.
-
From what I hear the devs are planning to remove Tier 3 or something like that.
then we would all make new chars or alts because we might have wasted our skill points on science for nothing (especially energy experts) i mean my science is 120% now, i wouldnt spend a single sp on science if it wasn't for the sake of crafting lvl 3 stuff. i wouldn't care much, if it was 120% repair or maybe outdoors... but 120% science? and you wont be able to craft any good stuff? then that would be a real waste of skill points...
-
then we would all make new chars or alts because we might have wasted our skill points on science for nothing (especially energy experts) i mean my science is 120% now, i wouldnt spend a single sp on science if it wasn't for the sake of crafting lvl 3 stuff. i wouldn't care much, if it was 120% repair or maybe outdoors... but 120% science? and you wont be able to craft any good stuff? then that would be a real waste of skill points...
Crafting a minigun or rocketlauncher and .223's and 5mms jhp and ap and Laser rifles and so on is not worth the skillpoints?
the only weapon I see being neglected in crafting is smallguns since they're all pretty easily farmable besides tier 3.
Plus only tier 3 is good for serious pvp unless your a crippler, then all you need is a damn BB gun and your set.
-
Everybody except Devs want robots.
Guess who wins?
Devs ::)
In F1 the only people with advanced technology were the BoS and the Master. Thats it. You didn't have regular run of the mill thugs with shit like rocket launchers, plasma rifles and laser rifles or gatling lasers.
Lol wut. Have you ever played "Fallout 1" full retail game?
There were rocket launchers, turbo plasma rifles, gatling laser, super sledge and power armors. As a matter of fact, in case you read fallout bible... PA's AND BRAINBOTS were used in USA vs China war, why shouldnt they be present at 2161 or 2238 or 3333 if they were kept in armories? You think its the 79 years were a wastelands golden age that lead to robots and APA? well maybe APA but other than that it all remained from the Great War
Were there working cars in Fallout?? Oh yeah, NO.
The thing that there were no car you could go around wasteland and there was in F2 doesnt mean anything improved. There were millions of cars in US before the war. There was junktown made of car fence. I dont think it was just the engines that vaporated :P
Every other faction had to make do with basic weaponry. Thats why i liked it so much. Kind of an hoamge to the Planet Of The Apes movie. The one where human bunker survivors were the only one with tech.
Except dominant Masters Army? Well, youre right, but if you encountered them you could get sliced with their plasma or miniguns. Vaults also had technology but just few of them were completed. Anyway you were looking for water chip not a rain dancer or whatever. Fallout was not completely tribal as you say, never.
The whole idea of nation states didn't exist in Fallout. In Fallout 2 all of a sudden you have the huge NCR beast capable of outfittin an entire army. They were even able to stand toe to toe with the BoS (although with severe casualties).
Well, there was some mutant nation, most developed one. Also Shady Sands, Necropolis and Cathedral were quite a communities. Yep, no nation, does it exist in Fallout 2? Not really
-
1st section
What are you ranting about?? Do I have to repeat myself again? I never said I had a problem with any of those things. Advanced weapons and Powered Armor iepresents lost technology which is fine. Double so since Fallout was meant to be a harsh wasteland where weapons and armor ruled the day. I guess I will elaborate further. I do not have a problem with advanced weapons and armor as long as they are in the hands of thosewho would logically have them. What I do have a problem is with working trains, helicopters, cars (specifically car or cars that are just given to people for money). I have a problem with the idea of nation-states rising. I have a problem with run of the mill thugs with electricity and energy weapons. I have problems with Fatmans and B.O.M.B 1, when the whole point of Fallout was to show the folly of nuclear weapons. Again these, unlike limited weapons and working power armor, are signs of civilzed and advanced nations.
2nd Section
There may have been FEW salvageable cars. Even then they would be in the hands of those who had the knowledge of repairing them. Its not like in 2238 where any chucklehead could just produce advanced tech in their ramshackle base jeez. I highly doubt the chosen one would conveniently find a fuel cell controller and some hick mechanic just magically has a working car without a motor (er whatever the hall ya wanna call it).
3rd Section
Again I must repeat myself. I NEVER SAID THE WASTELAND SHOULD BE DEVOID OF TECHNOLOGY. I did say that only specific folks should have access to it. Those specific folks include super mutants and vault/bunker survivors. Nobody else would be trusted with it.
4rth Section
As you said there were communities/cities yes
BUT.........
What do you think the New California Republic is?? By the end of Fallout it had claimed multiple citiies (the entire southern region of California if I remember correctly). Its multiple cities and many different peoples rallying under one cause, one national identity.
-
1st section
What are you ranting about?? Do I have to repeat myself again? I never said I had a problem with any of those things. Advanced weapons and Powered Armor iepresents lost technology which is fine. Double so since Fallout was meant to be a harsh wasteland where weapons and armor ruled the day. I guess I will elaborate further. I do not have a problem with advanced weapons and armor as long as they are in the hands of thosewho would logically have them. What I do have a problem is with working trains, helicopters, cars (specifically car or cars that are just given to people for money). I have a problem with the idea of nation-states rising. I have a problem with run of the mill thugs with electricity and energy weapons. I have problems with Fatmans and B.O.M.B 1, when the whole point of Fallout was to show the folly of nuclear weapons. Again these, unlike limited weapons and working power armor, are signs of civilzed and advanced nations.
So robots could represent it as well :) Finally we got a common point. Brainbots fought in the Great War, there were lots of them. Also masters army in fallout 1 were logical wastelanders?
2nd Section
There may have been FEW salvageable cars. Even then they would be in the hands of those who had the knowledge of repairing them. Its not like in 2238 where any chucklehead could just produce advanced tech in their ramshackle base jeez. I highly doubt the chosen one would conveniently find a fuel cell controller and some hick mechanic just magically has a working car without a motor (er whatever the hall ya wanna call it).
Out of millions of cars before Great War, far more common than PA and brainbots or any other type of a weapon, there wouldnt be any left? In F2 there was mechanic in Den, but you also had to take a part from Klamaths car and buy fuel cell controller in Gecko, but still it just proves the engines and parts are all over the place. Reno, Junktown, Gecko? have cars on the streets.
3rd Section
Again I must repeat myself. I NEVER SAID THE WASTELAND SHOULD BE DEVOID OF TECHNOLOGY. I did say that only specific folks should have access to it. Those specific folks include super mutants and vault/bunker survivors. Nobody else would be trusted with it.
We are specific folks 8)
4rth Section
As you said there were communities/cities yes
BUT.........
What do you think the New California Republic is?? By the end of Fallout it had claimed multiple citiies (the entire southern region of California if I remember correctly). Its multiple cities and many different peoples rallying under one cause, one national identity.
Yes, they had a president, there were rangers, some army, but there were also slavers which were hated by people in the same city. We had bazaar and inside city, lots of divisions. Yeah call it some city-state. So I proved my point
I don't mind robot followers but in regards to the devs I understand. Robots is more than just a manual. You need knowledge about ceramics and other composite material. You need to understand what the stress endurance of alloys. You need knowledge about robotics and AI. Things that takes years of research and equipment and tests. You need the faciilities and resources that allow for those tests.
All in all you need science, some robo parts and a machine, like it was possible in F2. You probably didnt like that part :p Maybe you dont need so much knowledge, the robots are still in Sierra Army Depot and other armories forgotten by the world after the conflict. In F1 you had robots, you had to turn on the generator. In F2 they were in SAD. How much more locations would you need to officially make them obtainable in the wasteland?
Imagine asking the devs for the ability for players to make verti-birds.
No its not the same, vertibirds would spoil the climate where a charming companion like you could have in F2 (2xrobodog + brainbot) where just different... also it would use some of the game content. As for me, the robots obtainable should have unique qualities like normal resistance and only unarmed robots should be available.
[/quote]
-
I honestly see where kraskish is coming from. He raises many good points and so does keldorn.
I honestly think that given the current status of the game, it would make sense to add some of these things... Enough talk about Cars. They are in the game and it MAKES SENSE that they are. That's great if you have an opinion, Keldorn, but it doesn't make it fact. I would have to say the same thing to myself but there is one difference, I side with the Devs on this one. Cars fucking rule.
-
We would not be entitled to lost technology unless we decided to either join BoS, enclave, or raided lost bunkers like SAD or Mariposa. Thing is those things are not easy and shouldn't be easy to do.
Again with the robots I don't have a problem with. Especially as long as they cannot be made but repaired while inside places like SAD or Mariposa or The Glow.
Millions of cars troughout the nation? yes. Inside one state of California? No, especially not working ones. The places with the most cars also happened to be the places where nukes fell. Ever heard of EMPs? That was in the normal Fallout games. Nuclear weapons generate a strong EMP that would destroy everything electronic within range, cars includied. Especially so since the resource wars forced folks to depend on fusion and energy technology. Something that would require complex electronic parts to regulate.
Cars may be fun and all but its something I personally against. They could have easily implented another type of fast travel like Fallout 1 originally had like travelling with caravans for example. Or if there were to be cars in the game, one shouldn't just randomly find a part and pay some money and get a car. They should be in a faction that is technologically advanced with the know how to repair or modify sophisticated electronics like the BoS. And only for a specific mision not just ownership.
The nation state existed and clearly as I said I didn't like the idea. Iis it realistic? Possibly. But does it add to the forlorn wasteland feeling where technology is rare, precious and worshipped as a god by some folks? No.
-
Again with the robots I don't have a problem with.
Finally :D
Especially as long as they cannot be made but repaired while inside places like SAD or Mariposa or The Glow.
Thats a nice suggestion. I didnt say anything about crafting. Crafting is silly, Id prefer to buy it from "a person who knows how to get things" =D. So I guess like mercs but would be repaired (HP or maybe deterioration like guns?) at those places...
Millions of cars troughout the nation? yes. Inside one state of California? No, especially not working ones.
Population of California 2010 - 36 mln, 32mln cars. (wiki)
Population of NCR state in 2238 - 700 000 (fallout bible)
A lot of cars, not working ones, but wastelanders are scavengers so eventually they would fix some car. In F2 you had car thieves (Reno), the guys were working on a workshop at the gas station. There was a car shop in Den... A lot of cars in Klamath.
The places with the most cars also happened to be the places where nukes fell. Ever heard of EMPs?
Yep. Still engine wouldnt be entirely affected. There are lots of cables and electronics (vaults, there was even electronics trade in Den (Metzger gang trading electronics for jet? something like that) + Military base)
That was in the normal Fallout games. Nuclear weapons generate a strong EMP that would destroy everything electronic within range, cars includied. Especially so since the resource wars forced folks to depend on fusion and energy technology. Something that would require complex electronic parts to regulate.
Ever heard of a word fallout? I doubt reno was hit with a nuke :-\, on the other hand I believe Glow did. Fallout is radioactive ash, it doesnt break cars down.
Cars may be fun and all but its something I personally against. They could have easily implented another type of fast travel like Fallout 1 originally had like travelling with caravans for example. Or if there were to be cars in the game, one shouldn't just randomly find a part and pay some money and get a car. They should be in a faction that is technologically advanced with the know how to repair or modify sophisticated electronics like the BoS. And only for a specific mision not just ownership.
Other MMOs got portals, mounts all sorts of things. The caravan travelling would be nice but its bugged and still it would be very safe to travel and unreal. Walking speed AFAIK is like IRL so you got the feeling of wastelander. Cars again provide transportation slower than originally in caravans but really fast on fonline level. And it doesnt guarantee any safety, thats the point. You can meet a faction and loose your car. In caravan option youd never loose because NPCs were helping you and its just easy.
The nation state existed and clearly as I said I didn't like the idea. Iis it realistic? Possibly. But does it add to the forlorn wasteland feeling where technology is rare, precious and worshipped as a god by some folks? No.
Dude, 700 000 people dont make it a nation 170 years after the war? (NCR). Im not making anything up. Maybe you dont like it but thats how it is.
-
In regards to cars. We are talking about getting parts that are compatible. I don't believe your typical run of the mill scavengers are going to know what cars are nevermind what makes them work and what parts are exactly missing. Even then we are hoping connections and wiring haven't been fried by the emp.
Yes there would be scavengers like BoS and Vault Dwellers that could make cars work. But the thing is vault dwellers such as Vault City and BoS folks arn't exactly keen about sharing lost tech with outsiders. I will concede that maybe the ghouls might have the ability but even then you need morethan just know how. You need equipment and tools like T-Rays.
Everything about Fallout 2:
I am going to try and keep this short and lets get back to the orignal topic here. I didn't like Falout 2 because time had moved onwards too much. Civilization started coming back with places like New Reno, Gecko, NCR etc. People had power again, cars were coming back, energy weapons, powered armor and other things were being abundant. If you go play F2 you willnotice the damned Shi merchants sell PA to just anybody. Nuclear reactors were working. The list goes on. Thats what irritated me.
-
Thats a nice suggestion. I didnt say anything about crafting. Crafting is silly, Id prefer to buy it from "a person who knows how to get things" =D. So I guess like mercs but would be repaired (HP or maybe deterioration like guns?) at those places...
Yay! Let's make it even more easy and immersion breaking! You can never find robots by yourself, but there is a NPC who just sells you them as much as you want because "he knows where to get things"!
Population of California 2010 - 36 mln, 32mln cars. (wiki)
Population of NCR state in 2238 - 700 000 (fallout bible)
A lot of cars, not working ones, but wastelanders are scavengers so eventually they would fix some car. In F2 you had car thieves (Reno), the guys were working on a workshop at the gas station. There was a car shop in Den... A lot of cars in Klamath.
A lot of cars in Klamath... A lot of wrecks you mean. It is clearly stated that the particular Highwayman one was the only car being able to repair at all in Klamath. Ofcourse there might be other cars, but you can't compare a real life "non apocalypse" world with an actual apocalypse world (comparing number of people - car numbers). ::)
Yep. Still engine wouldnt be entirely affected. There are lots of cables and electronics (vaults, there was even electronics trade in Den (Metzger gang trading electronics for jet? something like that) + Military base)
Yeah, almost 200 years of harsh weather doesn't damage a car and it's metallical components, cogs etc. Ofcourse, there is no sand slowly destroying the inner parts, there is no oxidation at all. ::)
+ A military base is only prown to be scavenged by good armed factions, not some "guy who knows where to get stuff".
Did you ever encounter a faction in Fallout 1/2 offering you "Hey, you know man, I found some robot, man I give it to you, I know where to find the stuff." ?
Ever heard of a word fallout? I doubt reno was hit with a nuke :-\, on the other hand I believe Glow did. Fallout is radioactive ash, it doesnt break cars down.
Time breaks cars down. Other things mentionend above breaks cars down. And they sure do break robots down too. Did you ever encounter robots out in the open wasteland in FO1/2? Hm. I did not! And why? Because they could only "survive" in some isolated bases. And who probably raided/was being able to raid these bases? Hm! Huge ass factions! Are players in 2238 supposed to be on the same level when it comes to influence etc. compared to BoS etc? They are not. :)
Other MMOs got
FOnline:2238 is FOnline:2238, not some "other MMO.
Walking speed AFAIK is like IRL so you got the feeling of wastelander.
Still too fast.
I am going to try and keep this short and lets get back to the orignal topic here. I didn't like Falout 2 because time had moved onwards too much. Civilization started coming back with places like New Reno, Gecko, NCR etc. People had power again, cars were coming back, energy weapons, powered armor and other things were being abundant. If you go play F2 you willnotice the damned Shi merchants sell PA to just anybody. Nuclear reactors were working. The list goes on. Thats what irritated me.
Agreed. Much there has been just put in because it is "cool". And the thing with implementing robots is nothing else. Without noticing things getting ridicolous, immersion breaking or with a little look at keeping it to the verisimilitude they've thrown stuff in because "hey man, this's cool!!11".
-
Im really too tired of this. We should make some punchline subforum or have some troll points.
Ill just say, cars or car wrecks made it possible to drive a car by the chosen one and we are chosen ones to test this beta 8) Chosen one also had robot companions...
I didnt say we should do it because its cool!11 ROFTL LOL I said it still the game content some people disagree the nature of but still was present in the game, and now is in Glow... Geez how those robots work after being hit with a nuke and oxidating and shit for over 200 years? You criticise all story behind I just made up while the implemented one makes even less sense...Heres the reasoning you mentioned. You failed
Scraping the game of its content is not wise
EDIT: I could counter all your arguments surf_solar, but really whats the point of this? *sigh*
-
Ok as for the cars all being totally wrecked after 200 years he has a point, but if we were going realistically after 200 years society would be pretty close to where it left off. The radiation would be long gone, nature would have taken over and everywhere would be green and society would have been rebuilt about 150 years ago. Hell there would be new cars.
But fallout isn't realistic. The wasteland exists because of mad max movies being set in australia, not because nukes can turn seattle into a dustbowl.
-
The radiation would be long gone, nature would have taken over and everywhere would be green and society would have been rebuilt about 150 years ago.
agreed, after 200 years, there would be more forests than wastelands. take Chernobyl disaster for example. it released as much as 400 times the radioactive contamination of the atomic bombings of hiroshima and nagasaki. after 24 years, the trees and some animal spices are reported to have taken over the area, even where the explosion occured.
as for the cars, there would probably be hundreds of highly trained mechanics and engineers living in vaults. according to fallout bible, during the great war, there were 122 vaults and 1000 residents in each. even if only 1% of these people were mechanics or engineers (they would have a fatal importance for keeping the things go) and even if half of these vaults were destroyed in war, that still makes 610 well trained engineers in the wastelands. they wouldn't have to try to understand how to make vehicles because they would probably have schematics for every engine that would be necessary after leaving the vaults. even today repairmen can convert simple diesel engines (the ones used in irrigation) into basic transportation vehicles.
since people wouldn't have any difficulties in finding engine parts, they would start repairing cars from the day they finished making walls around the cities. because transportation would be urgently needed in search for other people or more fertile areas. and if they had advanced in energy and fusion technology before the great war like in the game, then it would be even easier, for building electric powered motors are much easier than building diesel powered ones.
due to the already existing knowledge on engines and electronics, in 200 years, people would have a more advenced technology than we have today. they would have better cars, better aircrafts, better tanks... they would be building new vaults for The Great War II.
-
Keep inmind the US government was pretty fucked up with the vault experiments. Some of them might not have had schematics at all. Remember only a few control vaults were meant to be opened and the people to actually re-work the wastelands. I supposed there would be some mechanics but would these folks actually share their knowledge with the world at large? The only reason vault dwellers even co-mingled with the outsiders was because of desperation like Shady Sands and the ghouls.
Again as Surf mentioned its more than just parts. Even mechanics today have to comb through a car to find out what the hell is wrong with it and thats after hooking it up to a sophisticated machine. Who says the vault car comps (indeed if there were any) would be able to maintain a connection? Would these folks even know about cars that were 50 some odd years old? Look at how much cars have changed from 1900s to 1950s. Would the vault overseer or leadership want folks spending time trying to find salvageable cars throughout the entire state?
Most of the cars in the wastes look like they are totally FUBARed. I mean those things look wrecked and many a description on the cars if you bother to mouse over them state no amount of repair will g et them moving again.
-
I agree with you Keldorn. Cars/Robots/Train/Traintrack are impossible to exist in Fonline thats why we have them implemented
We could move on with idiotic things and have robot mercs, whats wrong with that? Would it spoil the overwhelming sticking to reality policy? I doubt it
-
Hey I wasn't the one who brought up logic into this. As we all know realism is a pick and choose affair in Fallout.
I merely stated that althought I don't have a problem with robot mercs, I can understand where Surf is coming from.
Then you Krakish, decided to post some sarcastic ass comments about how irrelevant me and surfs arguments were.
-
Then you Krakish, decided to post some sarcastic ass comments about how irrelevant me and surfs arguments were.
Sarcasm or not it's an arguement against your arguements. And I have to agree. How real is it to be able to Hire Supermutants? Sure it has nothing to do with technology but having arguements based on realism vs mythical crap is kinda useless in the Fallout World.
-
I don't mind Krakish giving his input, everyones entitled to one. However, if someones gonna go out of their way to give input in a douchebag manner directed at me, then how the hell do you expect me to respond?
With your post Michael I can respond in a few ways.
I can either talk like a rational being and say "I undersand that realism in the Fallout world is a pick and choose affair. Somethings are in the game just to make it funner".
Or I can be a sarcastic ass and tell you how stupid your post was. I could tell you your an un-educated idiot fanboy to simply accept whatever the devs throw at you without question. I could remind you,, n the rudest way possble, how this game is in beta stage and devs welcome a diversity of opinions.
Which one would you prefer?
-
I agree with you Keldorn. Cars/Robots/Train/Traintrack are impossible to exist in Fonline thats why we have them implemented
We could move on with idiotic things and have robot mercs, whats wrong with that? Would it spoil the overwhelming sticking to reality policy? I doubt it
You might want to remember at what technological level people were at when they made the railroads. Cars themselves are fairly simple machines and can be made by novice mechanics. If you're going to bitch about realism how about the fact you can craft fusion batteries or shoot plasma (firing gas -like projectiles over distance, lol).
-
Look at how much cars have changed from 1900s to 1950s.
thats what i mean. cars have changed remarkably in 50 years, and people had no idea where they were heading to. they were trying to find their ways out mostly with trials and errors. but those who leaves the vaults wouldn't have to repeat same trials and errors. even if they didnt have any schmatics on cars, they would have advenced knowledge on engines and electronics. as i stated in my previous comment, even today people can convert basic diesel irrigation motors into simple transportation vehicles.
mechanics today have to comb through a car to find out what the problem is because cars today have so many unnecassary features; automatic windows, sterios, rear-seat dvd players, electronic central locks, backdoor locks, seat heaters, intermittent windshield wipers, ambient lightings, air conditioners, electronically adjustable sunblinds, integrated trailer brake controllers... and lots of more stuff which are cool but not vital. some cars today have some sophisticated features even Apollo 11 didn't have. do you remember from the movies the cars that would be started by turning a crank? well that was also a car, and those didnt need to be hooked up to a sophisticated machine to be repaired.
there are lots of wrecked cars in the wasteland, i don't think that it is not possible to gain one good part from each car. at least a good tire maybe. and there also has to be some in much better conditions.
-
I don't mind Krakish giving his input, everyones entitled to one. However, if someones gonna go out of their way to give input in a douchebag manner directed at me, then how the hell do you expect me to respond?
With your post Michael I can respond in a few ways.
I can either talk like a rational being and say "I undersand that realism in the Fallout world is a pick and choose affair. Somethings are in the game just to make it funner".
Or I can be a sarcastic ass and tell you how stupid your post was. I could tell you your an un-educated idiot fanboy to simply accept whatever the devs throw at you without question. I could remind you,, n the rudest way possble, how this game is in beta stage and devs welcome a diversity of opinions.
Which one would you prefer?
Either, actualy the second one would be funnier, in this game I've learned not to care what people say about me since half the population is douche central. (No matter how much sarcasm is in there I'm being serious)
Besides,like you said,everyone is entitled to their opinion.
-
@Nyrla
And how would our mechanics figure out how to build or repair a Model T if they had no clue what it was. If every single vault was an encyclopedia of information then, I can concede to your point on cars. However, keep in mind the vault project had some serious bad case scenarios already planned for the folks inside. Some vaults were based on gambling only (hillarious). Some vaults planned to release psychotropic drugs into its population. Some had the overseers room sealed. Some never to open at all. And then some only children in them. Why would they contain anything more but basic knowledge on how to maintain the vaults. I think a bit too much credit is given to the idea of "reverse engineering" Engineering and repair is a highly specialized field. Same with doctors. Just because a guy can fix the air conditioner or the plumbing doesn't mean hes going to be an auto mechanic. Also the same applies to salvaging one part of each car to salvage another completely broken car? Even in the real world certain car parts are incompatible with other cars simply due to the differences of said cars. Are they foreign or domestic? Even if these were all "made in america", you would still have different manufacturers, designs, etc.
Again, I will repeat if you move your mouse cursor over the wrecks, all of them state NO AMOUNT OF REPAIR is going to get these things moving again. Somethings are just too fucked up to be repaired or modified. You know, same with weapons that happen to be "beyond repair". In your scenario we could simply fix everything as long as we had BoS, Vault City, or Enclave membership. If the control vaults did have information on cars it would make more sense to build or cobble up a new one. Not saying you cannot find A SINGLE car but even then it wouldn't just be "given" to someone. Most likely it ouwld be in the hands of techno factions.
I don't think anyone in Klamath would seriously have the knowledge and ability to find a highwayman nevertheless have the knowledge to maintain it. I mean how old can this mechanic be anyways if you go the route he was an original survivor of the nuclear holocaust.
@Michael
Sure I suppose I could have ignored Krakish. I guess we can both agree on that.
-
building a car like a model t wouldnt be very difficult for those who operated complicated engines in vaults. i know about the real purposes of vaults, but some experiments werent deadly and people managed to exit them safely after a while. but even if nobody could make it out alive from the vaults, then ordinary people with some knowledge on engines and motors (it doesnt even have to be on cars) would be able to make some basic vehicles with all those engines around.
http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/1176/woodencar.jpg
not all the people in the wastes are cannibals or holly people. there are lots of regular folks who havent lost their knowledge about technology. people would start repairing cars or making basic vehicles as soon as it is safe to go outside. people would want to move to some warmer or cooler regions. or they would want to search for more fertile lands, valleys, or they would want to get away from raiders or supermutants and would try the far north in hopes that virus wasn't effective in colder climates... you can find thousands of more reasons why people would need transportation. then the mechanics who lived before the war could pass their knowledge to the others.
about the guns which are beyond repair: in reality, it whould be easier to gain metal parts or junk from a mauser than raw iron ores. and gaining gunpowder from bullets and shells would also be easier than gaining some from raw minerals. but i like the game as it is now (not pvp very much) i just wanted to state out that seeing cars in the game is realistic for me.
-
Wooden car, I like that. I guess if the vehicles were more along those lines instead of "hummers and highwaymans", I could understand. But even then they woudn't be mass produced or cheap like they are in reality (wellnot cheap but theres such things as financing). The ways of mass production are long gone with even the BoS incapable of building cars or verti-birds (although future planning sounds nice).
That wooden car looks like its being pwoered by a some kind of generator? Probably not efficient like a real car but certainly could cruise to certain "travelable" areas.
-
i agree with what you say about mass production and hummers. and yes, it would be hard to see a fully functioning cars let alone the modern ones. but that wooden car would be a beginning, people would seek for the ways to improve means of transportation.
-
And hence my other post. I just didn't like how they moved the 2nd one so far ahead. They could have easily did a few decades later with more interesting problems (you know the ones stupid humans always make like war and greed n shit).
You had big cities with their own personal armies. Reminded more of shit like mega corporations and a dystopia than post apocalytpic. You were asked to perform diplomatic sabotage, corporate sabotage and theft. You had NCR who had the numbers to actually stand toe to toe with the BoS?? Apparently the NCR has gotten so big that it could send human waves in to be chewed up by BoS soldiers and keep them coming. Now I know the NCR isn't as big as China was during the Korean War.
-
Either, actualy the second one would be funnier, in this game I've learned not to care what people say about me since half the population is douche central. (No matter how much sarcasm is in there I'm being serious)
Besides,like you said,everyone is entitled to their opinion.
They are entitled to an opinion not be talk like an asshat.
-
This suggestion is about Robots, not cars.
-
This suggestion is about Robots, not cars.
Kinda late but yesh, discussion has been derailed a long time now.
-
Either way, the world before the bombs fell was futuristic 1950's sci fi cities with robot butlers, robot soldiers etc. You can't use real world logic. How do you explain the buildings with gargoyles of punks on the corner? This game was a mix of a bunch of different sci fi movies thrown together. You have deckards gun from bladerunner, the pulse pistol is the gun from the 1936 flash gordon. The wasteland is the australian desert from mad max dumped in the middle of the western US. Problem is people only want the post apocalypse wasteland part without anything cool or interesting. Just a simulator of a desert filled with psychotic killers and slaves clicking away in a cave. This doesn't take place soon after the bombs, its been a long time. People recover quickly but players want the anarchy of recent collapse. If the enclave is making power armour then I'm pretty sure they can make a robot. Hell that scientist even made a robot dog with advanced AI just for the hell of it.
So yeah, dog robots man. You know you want one.
-
If the armor was good and they could actually survive something.
Problem with dogs were always fragility and no armor. Atleast mutants have some form of defense. If it was down to robo dog or robo rocket mini gunner id know what id choose
-
This is funny Keldorn, your now blaming me for responding for your non-related post to the main thread? You brought cars, civilization and w/e and the topic is robots. Maybe I was douchebag but you started derailing this thread.
If you dont have anything against robot mercs then please post some suggestion related to implementation of it.
-
Good to know that we're back on track :).
I was thinking that a limit would have to be set on NPC followers in general. Having it set to 5 (max) would prevent players from creating robot human armies.
-
Good to know that we're back on track :).
I was thinking that a limit would have to be set on NPC followers in general. Having it set to 5 (max) would prevent players from creating robot human armies.
In my thread long ago I suggested that robots shared CH like mercs/slaves and/or have a INT requirement 7 - 1 robot, 8-2 robots, 9/10-3 robots
I also think robots to be bought could be eyebot, robodog and mr handy (all unarmed). Mr handy could have some repair skills! I guess robots could have resistance to normal, dunno 4/40? it would be like a little tank hehe
-
In my thread long ago I suggested that robots shared CH like mercs/slaves and/or have a INT requirement 7 - 1 robot, 8-2 robots, 9/10-3 robots
I also think robots to be bought could be eyebot, robodog and mr handy (all unarmed). Mr handy could have some repair skills! I guess robots could have resistance to normal, dunno 4/40? it would be like a little tank hehe
I read your suggestion and I thought it was pretty interesting. Perhaps since robots wouldn't be very useful in combat, you could use them to craft? Programming a robot to be an SG crafter level 3, for example, requires that you too be an SG crafter level 3 as well. The use of robots will probably reduce the complaining about crafting cool downs and will probably industrialize the world of FOnline a bit. Not sure if that is a good thing, but I'm positive that's how things would turn out.
-
This is an interesting idea. But to be honest, it doesnt seem so probable that robots were crafters... well they could... but I dont know, there are more things way more probable than that, for example
repair robots - Mr Handy, the skill could improve with the level
mining robot (in F2 - Klamath) - Mr Handy I guess, carry weight could improve with level
Eyebot could give bonus to sneak detection and/or show characters behind walls within some field of view (or even all?)! (Yep, even that, this is not too much - you need charisma and high INT for such a build) - unarmed skill/dmg improves every level