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Other => FOnline:2238 Forum => Archives => Suggestions => Topic started by: Graf on June 22, 2011, 12:50:50 pm

Title: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Graf on June 22, 2011, 12:50:50 pm
Recently I've thought, that if we are able to buy a base (that obviously was built by someone) then why not to add an ability to build it? But since the engine doesn't support the dynamic maps, there could be another way out. So I suggest to add a recipe (which is in a fact a 6 recipes) that could be obtained by buying a scheme(s), for a very little amount of caps (let's say 500 or 1000 in most of the towns) or available to get via quest. This is how it works:

The player gets a scheme (no matter how he did it - bought, get as a reward or stole it) that adds to his Fix Boy a new recipe. But as it's not that easy to build something big, it would require a collecting following materials:

To build a cave:
Total weight = 50982 g

To build a trapper camp Part 1 +
Total weight = 60466 g

To build a gas station camp Part 1 + Part 2 +
Total weight = 70164 g

Every part could be crafted independently, so the player would be able to craft these parts one-by-one and there will no problem with the weight capacity. Also, after crafting of each part, it should become weightless of its weight have to be reduced by 10 or so, because otherwise it would lead to the creation of the alts, which isn't good for the gameplay.

Since it gives a chance to get a faction base for the lone players and the beginner factions, these factions (players) should be able to buy a faction name after they have built a base from the same guy, that has sold them a scheme. But if they don't want to have a name, they can use the base without of it (this way they wouldn't have a chance to participate in Town Control)

It shouldn't be a big deal to implement this, since adding a new recipe doesn't take much time normally.
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Surf on June 22, 2011, 12:58:08 pm
I too have thought about this idea already (I believe there are even some scribbles in the repo somewhere) and approve of the idea. Only difference from mine to your idea was that one has to do small quests additionally to the ressources.
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Perteks on June 22, 2011, 01:58:24 pm
Quote from: Graf on June 22, 2011, 12:50:50 pm
To build a cave:
Total weight = 50982 g
Dynamite should be better than grenades and atleast its idea to only non suisicde bombinb by dynamites :P

And about buying faction names is great idea.

Probably if that idea will be implemented (ofc after wipe when will be that second perks and probably there will be pack rat or strongback) weight limit will be not a problem :P
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Altairp on June 22, 2011, 02:06:30 pm
And for build a Vault? ;D
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Perteks on June 22, 2011, 02:11:45 pm
Quote from: Altairp on June 22, 2011, 02:06:30 pm
And for build a Vault? ;D
dumb question. G.E.C.K. :D
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Graf on June 22, 2011, 02:50:34 pm
Quote from: Perteks on June 22, 2011, 01:58:24 pm
Dynamite should be better than grenades and atleast its idea to only non suisicde bombinb by dynamites :P

Yep, I've thought about the dynamite/dynacord stick/plastic explosives, but after a little comparison I've considered them as a pretty rare and hard to get stuff, so I've decided to stay with grenades, which could be activated by pulling out of the linchpin with the rope. Same result, but cheaper and more reliable.
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: avv on June 22, 2011, 03:51:18 pm
Big gangs will reroll bases anyway until they are where they want them so why not just do this. Makes everything easier for everybody. No longer need to do spawn tents, tent next to every city etc.
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Jotisz on June 22, 2011, 04:39:22 pm
Could be a nice solution since weight is quite big to include a brahmin who carries all that needed to build the place.
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Johnnybravo on June 22, 2011, 05:14:27 pm
Instead of feeding with random requirements, players should use those items to do stuff (blow a cave, build tent, etc.) But I have absolutely no idea how possible is to change objects in maps to achieve that stuff)
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Chrupek on June 22, 2011, 05:18:41 pm
Quote from: Johnnybravo on June 22, 2011, 05:14:27 pm
Instead of feeding with random requirements, players should use those items to do stuff (blow a cave, build tent, etc.) But I have absolutely no idea how possible is to change objects in maps to achieve that stuff)

I think that will be too complicated. Everybody knows what for u need dynamite, so making it like: 'now you have to blow a cave' is usless i think.
But the whole idea of making own base is wonderful :)
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Graf on June 22, 2011, 05:50:00 pm
Quote from: Johnnybravo on June 22, 2011, 05:14:27 pm
players should use those items to do stuff

As I've said in the first post - it isn't possible due to fact that the dynamic maps isn't supported by the engine.
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Johnnybravo on June 22, 2011, 06:32:35 pm
Quote from: Graf on June 22, 2011, 05:50:00 pm
As I've said in the first post - it isn't possible due to fact that the dynamic maps isn't supported by the engine.
You can change map while having multiple maps available, making it look phased. Also why wouldn't it be possible to move all the items to new map? (adding illsionary option of upgrade)
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Surf on June 22, 2011, 06:36:06 pm
Quote from: Johnnybravo on June 22, 2011, 06:32:35 pm
You can change map while having multiple maps available, making it look phased. Also why wouldn't it be possible to move all the items to new map? (adding illsionary option of upgrade)

It would eat fuckloads of server memory.
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Johnnybravo on June 22, 2011, 06:44:59 pm
Quote from: Surf on June 22, 2011, 06:36:06 pm
It would eat fuckloads of server memory.
I do not expect server to load any bitmaps, just have the template. Explain how would those take more than several hundreds of kilobytes? You remove unused instances anyway, because there's no longer reason to have them since you made some upgrade.
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Lizard on June 22, 2011, 09:54:57 pm
How about the following idea: you bring the necessary contents to a NPC - a base builder/trapper first.

Then, you join his party with some other builders and he leads you to a possible "safe" area, like a trainman, where a base can be built. During that, you encounter critters as usual, and defend the NPCs at all costs. The direction is random - if you don't like the place, the Builder goes to the next random area.

If you want a quicker pace of things, you can help him to repair and refuel his truck, as a separate quest.

Arriving at the site, he will ask you to cover his and his workers back, as he saw some raiders following them. You start guarding the construction site, while the NPCs start working on the base. Some waves of raiders will  arrive, which you have to defeat, while protecting the workers. The map will change between the waves, until the base is erected. The more workers you lose, the more waves you have to defeat.

If you have a character with high skill in your team, you can send him to help the workers. There is a way to procedually change the map without loading a new one. Technically, the changes will work, like animated doors.
So: To open the locked door, you need a lockpick set and high enough skill to open it.
And: To blow up a pile of with crumbling stones animation, you will need a dynamite and traps skill.
Or: To erect a girder, you will need rope and strength requirement.

The animation will turn to static scenery anyway, after the new map loaded after defeated wave or raiders.

So, instead of just paying the man, you get a quest to build your base.
Tell me what you think.
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: CaptOmg on June 22, 2011, 09:58:40 pm
I LIKE this idea  :D
But I wish we could be a bit more creative about building bases :(
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Trias on June 22, 2011, 10:24:27 pm
Excellent idea. Me and a couple of guys bought one of the last Faction Names simply so we could have a cave. It really doesn't make sense for people who have no interest in PvP/TC to be named as a faction.

We didn't want a cave to be a faction we wanted a cave to get a nicer place to live! :D
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: naossano on June 23, 2011, 12:51:22 am
Awesome idea.
But the waves of ennemies should also be related with the number of players (1-3-5-10-20-50), the nature of the base (cheap hideout-Heavy Barraks- Modern and complex infrastructure)

Also, the challenge would be harder if you want a faction name. (if you want to create a well known faction, you better deserve it)

For the ressources, i think you need :
- A bigger number of ressources. (a few pieces seems a pity to build an entire base)
- Intermediate pieces (for instance, build the door with wood, then bring the door to the builder)
- A fee (the guy doesn't work for free)
- The ability to help the builders, between the waves, even with a low skill character. (which mean no character dedicated to help the builder, but a time investment on building, for everyone)
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: kraskish on June 23, 2011, 03:28:00 pm
+1 only if u get a cave without a name/or computer?. there needs to be some disadvantage from regular 30k caps
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Graf on June 23, 2011, 05:57:33 pm
kraskish, The main disadvantage is that the players that has built this base is unable to participate in TC, until they had bought a name, which can cost any sum (maybe even 30, 70 or 120k, depending on the type).

Lizard, naossano, guys, your ideas is good too, but they would require a lot more working time and a few "buildidng in progess" maps, which developers don't have at the moment, unless you want to help with it and contribute your work.
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Chrupek on June 23, 2011, 06:09:16 pm
So how about upgrading a base, without dynamic maps?

I wrote that somewhere, but can do that one more time:
 U build a base without any lockers. Then you go to shop and simply buy lockers (which are normal obljects, that you can lift using science/repair on them), then you go to base and simply put locker/box where you want. Using this objects you 'stealing' from it. Using skill on it, you can lift and move. So you can organise whole base as you want. There should apply not only for lockers/boxes, but also for stills, workshops, nukacolas machines, brahmins pens etc.

Its like cube from Diablo 2, which is moveable objects, and can store other objects. Of course there should be limit of objects can you store in. And also when you put something inside locker, you simply cannot move it (to prevent from abusing).
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Reiniat on June 23, 2011, 06:52:49 pm
Quote from: Graf on June 22, 2011, 02:50:34 pm
Yep, I've thought about the dynamite/dynacord stick/plastic explosives, but after a little comparison I've considered them as a pretty rare and hard to get stuff, so I've decided to stay with grenades, which could be activated by pulling out of the linchpin with the rope. Same result, but cheaper and more reliable.
you can make a cave using fragmentation grenades?
NO
a frag grenade is not a big boom devise, his deadly effect is due to the FRAGMENTS dealed by the explosion wich are like proyectiles. your idea is completely surrealistic.
Anyway the game is completely unrealistic, but the Dynamites must be used to make caves, that was his purpose in FO2.
Being sincerously everybody have a suicide bomber alt.

And what about the computer? you craft it or what?
or maybe you buy it among with the faction name, but it will need to make two maps.

Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: naossano on June 23, 2011, 08:13:03 pm
Quote from: kraskish on June 23, 2011, 03:28:00 pm
+1 only if u get a cave without a name/or computer?. there needs to be some disadvantage from regular 30k caps

Why not pay 30k caps AND do the quest ?
The TC name only cost more blood and money...
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Graf on June 23, 2011, 08:34:48 pm
Quote from: Reiniat on June 23, 2011, 06:52:49 pm
Dynamites must be used to make caves, that was his purpose in FO2.

You're right, though if you didn't mentioned - I suggest to use nades instead of dynamite because it's easier to craft and all. But your point is obviously more logical.

Quote from: Reiniat on June 23, 2011, 06:52:49 pm
And what about the computer? you craft it or what?

It's easier to let it work, but instead of regular greeting that says "*beep* welcome to the [faction name] members database", it may say something like "sorry, no connection to the database ... logging off" until the faction name is registered.
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: naossano on June 23, 2011, 09:41:03 pm
The computer should keep been used for registering new members. (or there is no need for a computer)
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: Trokanis on June 24, 2011, 02:57:06 am
+1, if I could vote more than once I would say +1000.  It's a great idea.  I also kinda like the idea of the quests being needed to help move you along for making the base. 

Since the current system is SO easy to abuse when it comes to taking things from other players, you might make it where you don't have to carry everything at once to make the base (like the 10 hides for a tent).  Not sure how, maybe make it so that the place where the base will finally be needs to have your main tent there first? (sort of an upgrade.)

Somewhere, not too long ago someone posted several possible new tent maps, I bet they could be partially used for small base style, and added to for bigger ones.  I can't find the thread though.
Title: Re: Building a base instead of buying it
Post by: jonny rust on June 24, 2011, 04:17:09 am
I get an error when I try to vote So i'll just post my opinion;

YES, so many time YES!