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Other => FOnline:2238 Forum => Archives => Suggestions => Topic started by: Cheezy on March 23, 2011, 12:06:21 am
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Sorry if bad any grammar in it i type one thing sometimes think another just ask if you have question or don't understand something. Please read whole post before putting your onion on it. Also like hear what devs think of it.
Well my suggestion to increase level cap to 30 but with also changes to balance it. Here some thing that would happen if you raise level cap without changes, It be possible at max level to have 388hp (because life giver 2times+ max endurance + max strength) that's a lot of life, 10 int you could have 725 skill points spent + skilled trait make it 870, other thing count is 3 extra perks possible making total of 10.
First I would change how life gain and base life works. Your starting life base is 35 + (Str x 1) + (End x 2) = starting life max can be 65, I know its higher then before but keep reading it will make sense. This also help people fighting out wasteland at start help and reduce noob killing slightly or make battles more interesting at low end. Now life gain per level base on endurance amount will be change. Every one point endurance counts as 0.5 life gain per level. If you have endurance amount that has half life gain per level it will count as full point on ever even number level. Then for odd levels you get nothing. This make ever point of endurance count towards your max life. With 10 endurance you gain 5 life per level and in the end that add 145 life from leveling to max. So with max Strength plus endurance your life will be at (base life 65 + life gain per level 145) 210 at level 30. Now last change would be life giver perk which as right now gives 4 hp per level and can be taken 2 times. I would make it just add 30 life per rank of the life giver (no life gain per level) and you be able take perk 3 times. This would add 90 life if you take perk 3 times which would be max. The max life can be obtain would be (max str + max end + life giver 3 times) 300 life. 300 life good number end on for max life ,its only 47 higher current max + we increase level cap 9 levels. With Life giver also help people builds with super low life that want to have some life. The extra perk that it takes to get max life giver helps take up more perks sense we got 10 perks now. This how I do new life system for level cap of 30.
Now need consider is the skill gain per level. The formula right now is first 1-5 int counts as 3 skill points per int per level. The last 6-10 count as 2 skill points per level. So current max skill gain per level is 25 and that ends up as 500 skill points max. If you take skilled trait with 10 int that make 30 skill points per level and ends up giving 600 skill points max. I would make it that all int only adds 2 skill points per level. So max 10 int adds 20 skill points per level. So 10 int max level 30 would add 580. 580 skill not much more then 500 + with current system I think need be able get little bit more skill in end but without getting to much more. As right now takes little under 500 max out a skill that is tag. Also another change i would do is to skilled trait. I have it only add 3 skill points per level and only gain perks every 3.5 levels. So perk gain would now look like this for skilled trait Lv3,7,10,14,17,21,25,28 so you lose 2 high end perks with skilled trait. Regular perk gain look like this Lv3,6,9,12,15,18,21,24,27,30. When max level this skilled trait would add 87 skill points. Then last thing would need changing is educated perk. I change it to add 25 skill points when you take it. This perk can be taken 3 times. So max skill gain with this perk is 75 skill points. This also makes educated even with skilled traited. This because educated may take 3 perk come close to equaling skilled trait but educated max take 3 low level perks and skilled trait takes away two high level perks (which has more value). So if you have 10 int + trait skill + 3 perks of educated you have 742. But trait skill takes away 2 high perks and 3 perks of educated will drain take a lot to do so balance out. I think this works out well because you get more skill points but not ton more. This with increase max level without overpowering it.
Just few other things to do you might rescale exp require to level with new level cap. I would remove the requirements on educated and life giver so anyone can take them. This way people with low skill or low life builds can get more by giving up some perks. If notice i had educated and life giver add all once instant per level this easy way balance it and people cant mess up by not taking it immediately. Now about last thing to do is you might rescale some perks. This means you might raise level require on some perks to make more balance. Because you can have 10 perks now so kind control and limit on how many high perks or good ones you can have. Then you might add more perks special sense cap now 30. I just have few examples of that right now but you could come up with bunch more. One would be adamantium skeleton this reduce the chance of being cripple by half when critical hit. Also have 24 perks tho that you probably need remove or change before add them.
This general idea might miss few things but cant think of it now.
Post what you think of it and if you like it or not.
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Increasing cap level has 2 consequences at least:
1) more time to level up char. it's no secret that most of players create char, equip him and lead to lvling grounds. Molerats or Centaurs.
So if exp is not scaled - instead of killing 700 molerats I need to kill 2000... :-X
2) Chars become lets say.... more universal.
3)So-named Uber Perks. Sniper, Terminator, Slayer. Are suitable only for singleplayer.
Anyway, as new perks will be introduced with nexts wipe, let's see what it will be.
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i didint read your topic and voted no because of one reason: solar said that level cap will be increased to level 24, so i think we need to first wait for that, see how things are, see how fights go etc. and only then make suggestions about level cap changes, or somekinda leveling changes.
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i didint read your topic and voted no
Fonliners, fonliners never change
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I'm Sorry, im sure you put alot of thought into this. but i just don't find it personaly appealing. I Vote No.
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I can agree, if level cap is lvl 24 and i have many reasons for this.
1. No so much difference against lvl 21 (SPs, HPs and perk)
2. New perks (like slayer)
3. It has enough challence to get lvl 21, so lvl 24 should be lvl cap.
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I hope, that the good-ol system with decreasing number of experience, after a few killed creatures of one type, will come back some day. Together with 24 or even 30th lvl cap it will lead to the more interesting game-play.
P.S. Voted yes, but it needs some more changes, e.g. no perks at all after level 21 or just no combat-related perks.
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I think Solar said that a raised level cap with changes is already planned.
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I hope, that the good-ol system with decreasing number of experience, after a few killed creatures of one type, will come back some day.
HELL NO !!!
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HELL NO !!!
Why not? ;D It was a... beautiful... time... yeah.
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Why not? ;D It was a... beautiful... time... yeah.
It was awful time. As much alts, but 2 times more painful, killing deathclaws for 100xp doesn't entertain me.
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HELL NO !!!
Don't worry, not only you will have this, everyone will!
Yes, if you want to try other build... well.. that's a problem.
But if they want to try other build, they will have the same problem!
Total: everyone will have problems in making other builds.
So you need to find a solution to this, may be something like reseting character without losing XP, but then everyone will make HtH/Melee, lvl cap him and only then create evil powerbuild. So there must be an account system with few characters and some achievements like killed X mobs with EW/SG/BG/Melee/HtH/Throwing, then every character with atleast one of those skills tagged will exp faster. Different achievements with quests, every other character in account completing the same quest will get XP boost, exping one character to max lvl will allow to have Swift Learner perk (+5% to xp) at 1st level for every new created character, having 2 max lvled characters on account will make next created character have x2 Swift Learner perks at creation.
But then again, XP diminishing should be reworked, because little scorpions who giving ~60 XP are counted the same in kills as big scorpions who giving 110 XP or even mutated scorpions who giving don't know how much XP, making players to ignore those little ones and kill only big/mutated, to get as much XP as possible and it looks really strange. I can remember those days where you had to kill 12 mutated molerats, 12 big scorpions, 12 mutated mantises etc. to get big XP boost at begin, and if you meet pig rats or small scorpions or simple mantises, you need to ignore them, and in scorpions encounter you need to kill only big one, and run away from small ones.
Edit:
Do you think that people whch sitting in front of computer whole day will have problem ?
Now everyone is on same level ....
Why you want make more pain in ass ? Its test, we want testing new build and etc, after wipe there will be many ways to have different builds. Its TESTING, you knew it ? If you ask me if i want test my patience when i must spend biliion of ammo to earn 200xp for floater then i say no
And of couse everything after line:
"Total: everyone will have problems in making other builds."
you forgot to read... I already answered on your post.
Edit#2:
Make Hinkley give you XP to max lvl (with all perks, so you'll get next level after pressing "OK" in character sheet, level by level).
But this character can't leave Hinkley! He'll have "Combatant tatoo" on his forehead, everyone outside Hinklet will burst him with words "Cheater! How did you left Hinkley?" and then he'll be respawned in Hinkley, if by some reason he was teleported to world map or something. Also he'll get random encounters with Hinkley slavers who will hunt down escaped combatants!
So you can test your builds there!
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Don't worry, not only you will have this, everyone will!
Yes, if you want to try other build... well.. that's a problem.
But if they want to try other build, they will have the same problem!
Total: everyone will have problems in making other builds.
Do you think that people whch sitting in front of computer whole day will have problem ?
Now everyone is on same level ....
Why you want make more pain in ass ? Its test, we want testing new build and etc, after wipe there will be many ways to have different builds. Its TESTING, you knew it ? If you ask me if i want test my patience when i must spend biliion of ammo to earn 200xp for floater then i say no
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It was awful time. As much alts, but 2 times more painful, killing deathclaws for 100xp doesn't entertain me.
Could you please at lest tell me the name of MMORPG, where you can finish exping of your character in a matter of a few hours? I bet you couldn't, because it shouldn't be so. To have a high-level character you should work some time on its development and exping (not a few hours!).
As Ravenous said, it should be reworked somehow, but I hope it'll be back someday. At least, when test will end and current system will not be actual any more.
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Could you please at lest tell me the name of MMORPG, where you can finish exping of your character in a matter of a few hours? I bet you couldn't, because it shouldn't be so. To have a high-level character you should work some time on its development and exping (not a few hours!).
As Ravenous said, it should be reworked somehow, but I hope it'll be back someday. At least, when test will end and current system will not be actual any more.
Its beta test, i dont know where else i can better use these words. Why on Closed Beta Tests are "leveling npcs" ? Yeah, this is not CBT but its still test so i dont know why must suffer when we want test more characters, more variety in combat
Make Hinkley give you XP to max lvl (with all perks, so you'll get next level after pressing "OK" in character sheet, level by level).
But this character can't leave Hinkley! He'll have "Combatant tatoo" on his forehead, everyone outside Hinklet will burst him with words "Cheater! How did you left Hinkley?" and then he'll be respawned in Hinkley, if by some reason he was teleported to world map or something. Also he'll get random encounters with Hinkley slavers who will hunt down escaped combatants!
So you can test your builds there!
This is very good idea ? But you know what ? Noone from devs will make it/like it. If you ask me then this is solution for players like me. But it will not happen. Then i must agree with my previous opinion
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Yeah, this is not CBT but its still test so i dont know why must suffer when we want test more characters, more variety in combat
And you think munching molerats is good for "purpose of test" ? Sure... ;)
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To nip this flame in the bud. Diminishing XP won't return, but XP values should be linked to critters stats.
Diminishing XP was an attempt to stop there being "magic" critters - like Mutated Molerats or Centaurs - which gave high XP and were easy to kill. If XP is derived from the difficulty then there should be no such thing as a "magic" critter and no need for diminishing return.
For the OP, the new system is designed already, only crossing the T's and dotting the I's to go with the scripters to go.
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Yeah, this is not CBT but its still test so i dont know why must suffer when we want test more characters, more variety in combat
Please read my post carefully. There is an another point.
UPD. Ok... since Solar made everything clear, we shouldn't make flame here anymore.
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And you think munching molerats is good for "purpose of test" ? Sure... ;)
For me is important final character on 21 which i can use(test) in combat
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On topic, your current skill gain formula is wrong, how can you then propose new formula ? We have some big changes ahead, concerning max lvl and perks, so lets see how it will work out and then we can suggest changes.
Off topic, I liked the idea of XP gainng in Hinkley. This will attract more players to Hinkley and gives variety to lvling. Sure it would be slower, but for most of us, it would be less boring. You would still have chance to lvl up by regular means, spending less time, but wasting ammo.
Also, I wish perks like slayer, sniper, terminator wont be introduced, ever. If yes, they should be definitely nerfed.
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Slayer, sniper and terminator will never come in
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Slayer, sniper and terminator will never come in
Why? Any reasons?
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Why? Any reasons?
One word to say it all.. overpowered.
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To nip this flame in the bud. Diminishing XP won't return, but XP values should be linked to critters stats.
Are we expected to see raised levelling time?
Just to make it clear:
Currently only thing levelling offers is waste of resources and time.
Encounters are either way too risky or way to trivial, there's no way you'd just kill robbers or other bandits to get experience, as this is said to be compensated with loot you recieve ( so in fact instead of xp you get almost always melee and small guns, useful only part of population, and usualy cannot even be traded for what you need ).
Molerats provided quite quick way to level, due to their critical hit tables and relative low damage - meaning you were guaranted quite fast way to level, albeit really unexciting and without just risk of being PKed.
On other hand if one would level up on aliens and perhaps some other FEV filth, they could get radiated, or just have to run away do to monsters being scaled quite up - getting radiated is definetly not fun at all, because of persistence of the affliction, you must cure it manually, while this status also makes it much more harder to get treatment.
While I could also debate about resources (as usual, only SG and melee tier 0 is obtainable without mining, and thus limiting yourself to specific areas ) there is also little clues about destination difficulty and benefits.
For level one guy with a masuer or something he might obtain easily, rats and scorpions will probably be small challenge in TB (but can be still quite dangerous in realtime) and will get fine experience (40 rats to level up is fine), however he must be well placed so he wouldn't run in anything else (like marauders for NCR spawns, or crazies for HUB/VC spawn). But sadly this is when fun ends, EW and BG can't just spend their ammo on critters of this size.
There's quite a bunch of stuff to suggest, while not being insane task ( like adding clues to quest giver locations ). And I'd definetly love to see 'shit shoveling' to be gone, or at least not recommended way to get a level - going from 1 to 2 requires 100 actions, which is completly ridiculous with current spawn rate and Brahmin AI ( they're not moving from their dungs, making players shove them, complication already tedious task ).
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Slayer, sniper and terminator will never come in
Thanks god ::) It's the worst perks EVER. They actually ruined the whole gameplay idea of Fonline.
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Slayer, sniper and terminator will never come in
Phew. I'm glad to hear it's being raised though!
Why? Any reasons?
100% chance to critically hit, not to mention finesse trait would be useless. That's not game breaking at all...
@OP: I guess this suggestion is not going to be implemented anyway, but why 30? Just because New Vegas had it at 30? It should be a multiple of 3 as first priority, for perks, and a multiple of 4 as secondary importance, for skilled trait. And your changes are too complicated. Higher level cap = less alts, if a proportional amount of skill points are giving, not decreasing the amount of skill points per level.
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Wait, what's Terminator?
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Wait, what's Terminator?
I second that.
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Wait, what's Terminator?
One of the best movies ever made.
Makes it so all critical effects are ignored for your character. With 10 Strength and 10 Endurance, it is impossible for a critical to land on you.
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Please read whole post before putting your onion on it.
I'll put my onion anyway !
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One of the best movies ever made.
So in this case of fonline, it would be the best perk ever made? Lets IMPLEMENT :D?
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So in this case of fonline, it would be the best perk ever made? Lets IMPLEMENT :D?
Oh god no
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Every one point endurance counts as 0.5 life gain per level.
Yes to that, yes to increasing the level cap, no to roughly everything else you've proposed.
All in all: NO.
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One of the best movies ever made.
Makes it so all critical effects are ignored for your character. With 10 Strength and 10 Endurance, it is impossible for a critical to land on you.
I think that its not 100%, but 95% with 10 STR and 10 EN. Same with sniper perk, if you have 10 luck its only 95%.
Yes i know, its not difference but you know. I just trying to be smart :P
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I think that its not 100%, but 95% with 10 STR and 10 EN. Same with sniper perk, if you have 10 luck its only 95%.
It is a 100% critical chance for sniper and a 100% anti-critical chance for terminator. This is a game breaking perks and there is nothing else to discuss.
Here's (http://translate.google.ru/translate?js=n&prev=_t&hl=ru&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&sl=ru&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.fonline.ru%2Fforum%2Fshowthread.php%3Ft%3D9441) a topic about of these perks on fonline.ru
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I think that its not 100%, but 95% with 10 STR and 10 EN. Same with sniper perk, if you have 10 luck its only 95%.
Yes i know, its not difference but you know. I just trying to be smart :P
100% AFAIK. Perks for Chosen One
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It is 100% critical chance for sniper and 100% anti-critical chance for terminator. This is a game breaking perks and there is nothing else to discuss.
Yeah these are stupid perks i know.
But if its 100% and not 95% how its possible that on requiem i rarely didnt make crit when i have sniper perk ? Of course 10 luck and everything. Or it works differently on TLA and Requiem ?
Btw, i didnt say that i like these perks. In fact i dont
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Nice thoughts.
I would change it a bit.
I would have diminishing XP starting at lv22.
(Maybe have it ramp up to full diminishing status at 20% of the old dimishment scheme per level, so 1/5 diminishing at 22, 2/5 at 23, 3/5 at 24, 4/5 at 25, full at 26 and beyond. This is not the amount diminished, but a proportion of the regular diminishment, to clarify.)
Also have xp requirement ramp up to regular amount plus 10%, cumulative. So 21-22 is +10%, 22-23 is +20%, 23-24 is +30%, 24-25 +40%, 25-26 +50%, 26-27 +60%, 27-28 +70%, 28-29 +80%, 29-30 +90%. Each of the +% is of the previous amount required to level, not the regular flat amount that it would have been.)
The bonus HP at start is kind of like the new D&D/DDO thing where you get the 20 point "hero bonus" at the start.
Not sure if I like it, but the logic is good for "Game Terms", not so much for simulation.
Perhaps perks gain at lower speed after 21.
Say for regular they would be at 25 and 30, for Skilled at 26.
Skilled would be able to pick Tag! at lv21, regular at lv 22 (squat it 1 level from 21 perk).
No Terminator, Sniper, Slayer unless at 1/2 or 1/3 strength.
HP gain beyond 21 could be at half amount (getting old...) including Lifegiver bonuses.
Also, skill point gain at half amount starting at lv22 or 24.
Make Educated available at lv4. (Squat 1 lvl if not Skilled). Requirements waived after lvl 9, so anyone can take it later.
I think this would be reasonable.
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--PS Bring back Scrounger and Flower Child.