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Author Topic: Kind of disappointing (Shop shooting)  (Read 8854 times)

Re: Kind of disappointing (Shop shooting)
« Reply #45 on: October 27, 2010, 12:19:56 pm »

Maybe fighting should be made impossible by game mechanics, when you are in certain areas (Shops etc.)?
For example: When you are at shop, your AP drops to one and it will not regenerate until you go out from the shop? Or somethink like that...

Maybe thieves should also have some annoying cooldowns, like crafters (or even worse) ;P
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Re: Kind of disappointing (Shop shooting)
« Reply #46 on: October 28, 2010, 01:43:07 am »

I agree with most of these points, especially the marking of gear.  Personally if you're shot in a guarded town I think your gear should be marked for a period of time to be only yours, and only npcs can pick it up, you can then return and talk to the guards or sheriff and get it back.  This was already suggested in this thread but a repost wouldn't hurt.  Also if you are a thief or shooter in town, there should be serious consequences in guarded towns.  Not just the slap on the hand and possibility of being shot by someone who managed to notice.  More like you are instantly vilified by the town, until such time as your karma drops back to neutral, (via shop selling, npc rep kills, waiting ect.) The 5 second memory of guards is insane, especially in "The most powerful city in the Wastes." Or guards in the Hub, where they're damn near trained killers.  The shooting system in merchant areas is tough, but post guards in those buildings that might help.  "World" RP reason because of the reports of poor wastelanders being blown away right under guards noses.  "Game" RP reason, because people will actually consider coming to towns talking, and experiencing them.
« Last Edit: October 28, 2010, 06:09:26 am by Trokanis »
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Re: Kind of disappointing (Shop shooting)
« Reply #47 on: October 28, 2010, 03:34:14 am »

Just a FYI:
This is currently going on in VC where 2 PK with 249 HP kill low level blue suits in stores and at the workbench.
1 blocks the door for guards, the other does the kills and picks up the loot.
2nd guy picks up the loot from the corpse of his friend.
Happend to me as well.. I like how this game is very heavy pvp but there NEEDS to be some safe towns. The current guard system is not working and people that abuse the system are ruining the game for many.
Re: Kind of disappointing (Shop shooting)
« Reply #48 on: October 29, 2010, 03:52:06 pm »

Happend to me as well.. I like how this game is very heavy pvp but there NEEDS to be some safe towns. The current guard system is not working and people that abuse the system are ruining the game for many.

Any automatic NPC system is and will be abused. Only player driven system could be really safe and fair.
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Re: Kind of disappointing (Shop shooting)
« Reply #49 on: October 29, 2010, 03:59:03 pm »

Happend to me as well.. I like how this game is very heavy pvp but there NEEDS to be some safe towns. The current guard system is not working and people that abuse the system are ruining the game for many.

Nowhere is safe. Nothing will prevent a person from raising a gun and launching a bullet through your skull. What can be done is to discourage that. Biggest reason why guarded town shooting happens is that players don't care about their lives but they do care about their items.
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Re: Kind of disappointing (Shop shooting)
« Reply #50 on: October 29, 2010, 10:43:24 pm »

Any automatic NPC system is and will be abused. Only player driven system could be really safe and fair.

So in your words we might as well not have guarded towns since the devs don't have the know-how to handle this problem right.  Lets just keep making this game into a total wasteland where fuckos just shoot eachother all day everyday everywhere.  All good shit is hidden in bases and everwhere we go we see lamk2 or cljs only.
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Re: Kind of disappointing (Shop shooting)
« Reply #51 on: October 30, 2010, 02:09:56 am »

how about marking the items??



Now about thieves & stealing.

 Thief, when spotted at stealing, have turn on battle time (like now), can be shot without consq. and  have marked ALL items  he's got as 'stealed'[as long as battle time runs].

 If he manage to run away, prize is stayin with him.

 If shooted, items are market second time  [stealed & hot now],then stuff can be picked only by NPC[/u]

Items are magically unpickupable? How about guards shoot them if they try to take it?
If they survive, so be it.
(plus a reputaion adjustment and RT hour cooldown on guards targeting them)
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Re: Kind of disappointing (Shop shooting)
« Reply #52 on: October 30, 2010, 10:15:02 am »

I think the idea of if you break the rules in a guarded town, you get vilified, not til you die, but till it goes away over time.  That would be a discouragement.  Cause then they don't get their precious items either.
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Re: Kind of disappointing (Shop shooting)
« Reply #53 on: November 09, 2010, 12:02:12 am »

And again this is currently going on in VC.
1 thief: Yoshimo
1 shooter: 12OzZzMous
1 looter: Anreki (although he is actually too stupid and too slow as he failed to loot before an npc did, although he could)
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Re: Kind of disappointing (Shop shooting)
« Reply #54 on: November 09, 2010, 12:25:09 am »

Maybe fighting should be made impossible by game mechanics, when you are in certain areas (Shops etc.)?
For example: When you are at shop, your AP drops to one and it will not regenerate until you go out from the shop? Or somethink like that...

Maybe thieves should also have some annoying cooldowns, like crafters (or even worse) ;P

As soon as i read this i thought of being trapped in a shop unable to open the door to leave :'( Shop shooting is pretty sad but i can't comment on it that much since i play when most players are off it seems (mid US player) but i was also thinking couldnt a player simply run into a shop after raping someone and not be able to be killed?
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Re: Kind of disappointing (Shop shooting)
« Reply #55 on: November 09, 2010, 09:38:38 am »

i was also thinking couldnt a player simply run into a shop after raping someone and not be able to be killed?

You're always able to be killed, that's part of the problem discussed in this thread.
If you kill an unprotected player without hitting a protected player, you stay protected.
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Re: Kind of disappointing (Shop shooting)
« Reply #56 on: November 09, 2010, 08:47:26 pm »

the issue with town killing has always, and will continue to be, penalties that are not severe enough.

if you want to hang out in any of the towns, you should be FORCED to play safe. i am a huge pk and i thoroughly enjoy killing noobs in towns, around towns, etc. this would negatively affect my character, so i am not just some carebear hoping to make my life easier.

this thread is basically one giant suggestion that would only serve to improve the immersion and feel of the game. although, i will have to disagree with keldorn... if it starts becoming like wow where people hang out in front of towns with their buddies in their leet gear, there won't be much of a population for long! if anything the top end gear needs to be even more rare because most players who care to have a nearly endless supply of t3 gear that could only be depleted through non-normal means of dying... eg, chain deaths before the end of the wipe just for shits and giggles.

IMO, the protection of towns should extend to the immediate area they surround. If you kill someone in an encounter with marauders and NCR patrol, you should still take an NCR rep hit. Likewise, in the boneyard, I can't tell you how many times i've killed people in plain sight of the regulators, only for them to basically congratulate me on the kill and then try to steal the loot themselves. am i wrong in thinking the regulators by FO lore should be shooting me and helping my victims, not waiting to steal my loot?

if there was a 'localized' justice system, not wasteland-wide, i think the game would drastically improve. Also, being killed by someone should auto-red-name them for you... you can set them green yourself at a later time if they prove to be non-hostile.

like others have said, there is no all seeing eye that judges the actions of all in the wasteland so a blue/red PK/APK system like UO would not work. however, i do believe a local justice system is exactly what is needed. if i am PK in the boneyard, i should not be allowed into adytum. likewise if i am a friend of the regulators, i should not be permitted into the gun runners. (wait, i might be wrong. i think the gun runners are hostile to adytum, right?)

noob gankers with their 5-6man TB-encounter traps outside NCR should suffer the penalties of their actions. there is no cohesive feel to the areas around the towns, they feel as though the NPCs in those areas are completely disconnected from the main areas.

TC towns should probably be exempt from this rule, but with enough balancing of both NPC strength and penalties, you could apply a blanket, localized rule to all towns that affects the immediate squares surrounding such a town.

on that note... the squares between hub and JT are the most dangerous in the entire game. the hub patrols there should be FEARED, not looked to for an infinite supply of 5mm and assault rifles.
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Re: Kind of disappointing (Shop shooting)
« Reply #57 on: November 10, 2010, 12:07:25 am »

@zato

My suggestion in regards to loot was for the bluesuit comment.  As long as people fear losing their gear because of stupid cooldowns and shoppshooters/suicide bombers who assist in this problem, they will be naked.  If people truly want to make a huge difference in bluesuits in the cities then reduce the risk, reduce the fear.  AGAIN, guarded cities are supposed to be safe for everyone.  It is truly stupid that guards only protect NPCs even though without the players NPCs would be pointless.

My answer was also a reply to endless suggestions on how to get rid of bluesuits when the suggestion itself sounds more like more opportunities for exploiters to get more loot.  Even worse when a far easier remedy is available but continues to be ignored.

How would people showing off shit in town cause the server pop to go down?  If anything its the new games offering the same thing Fonline does (cept they do it better AKA New Vegas) is whats causign the servers to be more quiet than normal.

Fonline is a one trick pony with a killz for the lulz mentality as its main selling point.  Past that it offers nothing that other games cannot provide.

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Re: Kind of disappointing (Shop shooting)
« Reply #58 on: November 10, 2010, 02:15:45 am »

Well I know I suggested earlier that people breaking the rules in towns should be brought to Vilified til it naturally wears off.  I think that might only partially help, because people still have alts and those truly devoted to causing issues to people in towns, would just create more.  So I think that a PvP enable system may be an idea.  (I am writing a full suggestion for that section) Essentially players can disable being a pvp target, with certain actions causing the player to become pvp instantly.  For example breaking rules in guarded towns, attacking a pvp player anywhere, stealing and so forth.  This would help prevent people from hiding behind not being flagged because they can only attack other pvp people or guards and doing so would cause them to be enabled.  I would go so far as to let it be enabled (by choice) in the wasteland, except in unguarded towns, and areas.  You go into an unguarded mine you should expect to have to earn it.  

I just think it would cut down on a ton of grief to low lvl players, and those not completely interested in pvp all the time everywhere, and would increase the pvp population, because if you get to actually survive with your gear at lvl 1-5 you may level up to 21 eventually and want to try your hand at the other aspects of the game.  

I know that people are already foaming at the mouth reading this, but this wouldn't take pvp entirely out of the game, it would just add a buffer for people.  And there will always be ways to cause lowbies grief, for example you drop into an encounter with a low lvl not enabled, you kill everything they're trying to, and then 'lulz' and leave.  Yay you, you get your jollies.  

*note no more Shop shootings and bombings. Peace in guarded towns.*
« Last Edit: November 10, 2010, 02:19:48 am by Trokanis »
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Re: Kind of disappointing (Shop shooting)
« Reply #59 on: November 10, 2010, 09:25:10 am »

i dont like all of the ideas i heard here. The truly great thing about fonline is that it is so harsh, so mean and so "exploitable". I played a endless horde of generic human paladins, gay elves and stuff. But i never had a game where i could rip people off everything they possess. But still i think death is most of the time avoidable. When ur totally new its really really hard i know.

So here maybe a little idea how you could change this in guarded town murderer thing. Maybe it would be cool if really near standing guards could fire before you fire when u try to kill somebody. Like professional Guards that fire as soon as somebody draws a weapon.

But i would really hate it if it was like in the guarded part of NCR where u just get shot for carrying a weapon.
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