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[Pandemon]

2. It allows a new class of people to be created. (Well, its not new, its just rare/non existant in PvP).
Bursters/Single Shotters/Snipers

New class of people to be created? Burster? It exist, and with removing fast shot they will dissapear at all.
Single Shotters? What's good in it? Nothing if shots aren't aimed and you want them no aimed. Snipers? They exist and prospere very well atm. and removing fast shot wont help in increasing their count.

[Nexxos]

I mean in TB you can use 14mm pistol as 14mm SMG with fast shot and BRoF, shooting 2 AP per shot, making it single-shot-like burst so every bullet hits target not fly in cone, so its the same if you burst in point blank from 14mm SMG.

What the hell man?

[RavenousRat]

What the hell man?

It's 14mm Pistol in TB with fast shot and BRoF.
In TB you can shoot entire clip from 14mm pistol with fast shot and BRoF, shooting bullets one by one means all will hit target (exclude misses with 95%...), because it's not burst.
In RT it'll consume alot time till animation after each shot, so you'll be able to shoot only once may be twice, till "target will be blocked" or you're dead already.
So it's TB-only build.

[Floodnik]

Fast Shot won't work for any burst mode, doesn't matter if it's SG or BG. Bursts will cost 1 AP more from now :< And I made a clean BG sneaker who does 2 bursts in a row, now it will be not possible(well, if i took 2 action boys... but waste of perks) :<
And these SG bursters who did 3 bursts in a row with 9 AP now could make only 2, they would have to get 12 AP to make 3.

[Solar]

Add LA for +5 damage to each shot, applied after armour is worked out. For a pistol its a certain 25 extra damage over 10 AP, even a mauser shooting BA.

With decreasing the "Alpha strike" of things like Avengers (capable of opening up with 2 shots instead of 3) the consistent damage of this type of build is given more of a chance. Especially when it gets boosted.

New class of people to be created? Burster? It exist, and with removing fast shot they will dissapear at all.
Single Shotters? What's good in it? Nothing if shots aren't aimed and you want them no aimed. Snipers? They exist and prospere very well atm. and removing fast shot wont help in increasing their count.

 

Fast Shot won't work for any burst mode, doesn't matter if it's SG or BG. Bursts will cost 1 AP more from now :< And I made a clean BG sneaker who does 2 bursts in a row, now it will be not possible(well, if i took 2 action boys... but waste of perks) :<
And these SG bursters who did 3 bursts in a row with 9 AP now could make only 2, they would have to get 12 AP to make 3.

Ah yes, this is not a coincidence

[Badger]

I approve of our sexy new gunslinger overlords.

[borse]

You mean point blank burst will be impossible? Are you serious? Burst weapon created for low range, and you want weapon which created for low range be useless at low range?

Lol exactly. So what OP is saying that if a minigun were to be pressed against your stomach, the chance of you dying after the trigger is pulled would be 0%... WORST IDEA EVER.

[TwistedIndoctrine]

Lol exactly. So what OP is saying that if a minigun were to be pressed against your stomach, the chance of you dying after the trigger is pulled would be 0%... WORST IDEA EVER.

Actually I think he's implying you could rush the gunner and start stabbing him in the face without kindly standing a meter away from his body infront of those mean smoking barrels he has attached to a chainfed electric engine.

In fact I liked the idea so much I drew a picture of what it could mean for the game.

[TuX]

 Nice way to picture it. Hope it'll happen

[Parowooz]

Yeah "Fonline now" is how it should be. Just leave it as it is.

[borse]

guns dont have a minimum range. In fact, in real life, you have more chance to hit a target point blank than from far away. This suggestion MAKES NO SENSE. So we should make it so that the closer a player is the EASIER it is to hit the dude with your gun.

Scenario:
Joe sticks his minigun in bobs mouth
bob gives joe the go-ahead with a thumbs up
Joe fires off a 40 round burst but, due to the minimum range restriction, the bullets seem to seep out the side of bobs mouth and miss him completely...


That is what would happen if this were to come to fruition.

Actually I think he's implying you could rush the gunner and start stabbing him in the face without kindly standing a meter away from his body infront of those mean smoking barrels he has attached to a chainfed electric engine.

In fact I liked the idea so much I drew a picture of what it could mean for the game.

Id like to see you try this realistic combat scenario in real life. Oh and be sure to include in your will: send pictures of my bullet filled body to borse.
You can't stand on the same hex as someone else so your little knife move will never work. Let's keep Fonline the way it is.

[DonGizmo]

I liked the minimal range because i had to use secondary weapon in rooms,... . But it is sad if you die and you have to craft 2 new weapons instead of 1.

[TwistedIndoctrine]

blah

Except the guns not in his mouth in the picture, and it's not in your mouth in game either. In game the muzzle of the barrels extends PAST the character adacent to them if they're side by side. Believe it or not, guns do infact have a minimum range, it's called the muzzle, and if you're standing behind it and it's not a cannon or a large calibre weapon it'll be fairly harmless (cannons being the exception, walk past the second wheeldrive on a tanks treading and you're risking serious concussive injury and possibly death from the air displacement of the muzzle blast itself). Hand weapons on the other hand can not produce that kind of force, because no one could actually hold a weapon putting out that kind of power.

Also - it's a heavy electric motor with bullets and barrels and Bob took advantage of the fact that it's designed to be mounted on a damned vehicle to push it ASIDE easily because joe is already off balance just holding something that should be mounted on an assault vehicle and would be practically impossible for Joe to actually fire AT ALL under any sort of control without seriously injuring or more likely just killing himself and Bob at the same time. That's how it would be if you wanted absolute realism, miniguns would be removed from the game period as hand weapons - they'd be restricted to vehicles and powered armor wearers at the very least.


And no I don't need to hope in front of a minigun to test it, I personally don't have the speed or skill to charge a minigun wielder (lol) in real life however in game the fantastic is possible (using miniguns effectively by hand for example) so why is this so far fetched an idea for you?Why do you need to get personal about it more importantly?

[Parowooz]

Also - it's a heavy electric motor with bullets and barrels and Bob took advantage of the fact that it's designed to be mounted on a damned vehicle

What the fuck? The nuclear war started in 2077, are you trying to say people were unable to invent ANY hand-held miniguns? Anyway I saw a minigun shot full-auto for few seconds in Predator movie, that's enough because we are playing the game about future and it's sci-fi so anything could happen.

to push it ASIDE easily because joe is already off balance just holding something that should be mounted on an assault vehicle and would be practically impossible for Joe to actually fire AT ALL under any sort of control without seriously injuring or more likely just killing himself and Bob at the same time.

Don't compare miniguns we know to those that may appear 60 years later. Also what are you saying is already in-game. If Joe would have 1 str and he would carry a minigun, without any knowledge about them whatsoever (40% BG skill), then yes - he wouldn't hit Bob even at point blank. But in this case Joe is a bulky motherfucker with 7 str and he has wide knowledge about baby cannons (200% BG skill?) so YES he will kill Bob without any problem.

[TwistedIndoctrine]

What the fuck? The nuclear war started in 2077, are you trying to say people were unable to invent ANY hand-held miniguns? Anyway I saw a minigun shot full-auto for few seconds in Predator movie, that's enough because we are playing the game about future and it's sci-fi so anything could happen.
Don't compare miniguns we know to those that may appear 60 years later. Also what are you saying is already in-game. If Joe would have 1 str and he would carry a minigun, without any knowledge about them whatsoever (40% BG skill), then yes - he wouldn't hit Bob even at point blank. But in this case Joe is a bulky motherfucker with 7 str and he has wide knowledge about baby cannons (200% BG skill?) so YES he will kill Bob without any problem.

Rage man.

Also that was kind of my point. It's okay for Joe to be super skilled and strong enough to maneuver a minigun in a close quarters combat scenario with the same speed and assurance and control as a dude with a hand gun for example? That seems a little ridiculous. If the assailant has gotten into close range with a machine gunner, even in real life, you're in a lot of trouble. Once someone has slipped past your muzzle and rushed your in close quarters combat you'd better damn well know what you're doing (special forces, literally) or you're probably going to die. That's just how it is. It isn't easy getting through a machine gunners arc of fire in an open field but CQC is a whole different ball game - it can take an infantry platoon or a SWAT team (no ones crazy enough to try that crap individually - you'll die there's no way you can react fast enough to all the angles in so tight a space as those found in room clearing drills) to safely clear a two story house for example.

All the OP is suggesting is that that be taken into account.

It doesn't get easier the closer you are in real life. Guns ARE NOT designed for close quarters combat, they wouldn't launch projectiles if they were. They developed and evolved in response to mass open ground warfare and their limitations REALLY show when they're taken out of that element - especially the larger guns. You don't do room clearing with heavy machine guns if you can avoid it. A heavier gun simply CAN NOT move in close quarters as well as a smaller one it's just a matter of sheer size mechanics which currently aren't implemented in any form in the game but maybe could be, so the OP spurred discussion about it, and I made a MS paint comic joking about it.