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Author Topic: Why not to add guild system into the game?  (Read 1851 times)

Lordus

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Why not to add guild system into the game?
« on: April 26, 2010, 09:41:44 pm »

 
Why not to add guild system into the game?

 All gangs would have choice to choose the guild membership. Membership like PvP (PK, mercenary) guild, Crafting guild, Farming guild, Trader guild. You, as a member of gang, will get benefit from this membership.

 The purpose is, that if you will have get more and more benefits because of playing constantly under one current guild, your own gang will specialize in one way of playing.. This will need to cooperate with other gangs, under the influence of another guild. Why not to add guild system into the game?Trader guild clan will need help from mercenary guild clan against PK guild clan.

 I.E.:

 There should exist 2 types of bases: kind (tree) of storage bases, kind (tree) of resources bases (like current outpost, hunting ground...). Only PK guild base members will have possibility to find and raid enemy resources bases.

 Mercenary guild clan should have possibility to kill PK guild members in the guarded towns. But if mercenary attacks PK guild members, the guards will not intervene and the players from the same gang (PK) can help their temates. (Like in real wasteland.. everybody will leave, only two sides will attack each other).

 Trader guild clans should have possibility to trade with every NPC traders (other players will be limited). Only traders should trade water as a resource for base supply tanks...

 These benefits/disadvantages are only examples. The point is, that if you are PK team, you should have any advantage in are you like to play.
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Re: Why not to add guild system into the game?
« Reply #1 on: April 26, 2010, 10:32:03 pm »

no terrible idea, who the hell wants to make a guild of traders? most people will just have seperate alts to do any of those things, why narrow down what kinda things you  can do in a guild
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Surf

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Re: Why not to add guild system into the game?
« Reply #2 on: April 26, 2010, 11:27:44 pm »

no terrible idea, who the hell wants to make a guild of traders?

When obt3 started, "we" as a group of 10-12 german players wanted to play as mainly a traders guild. We were rhe Far-Go Traders. ;) And it was fun to behave like such a guild, until we realized that no one really was interested in tradi g with us or making caravan,  rather shooting at us for no apparent reason. Nowif there'd be an actual advantage in trading etc when youre a member of such a guild I am sure that people'll play as such huilds.


It's not everything just aboutin shootin'. ;)

vedaras

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Re: Why not to add guild system into the game?
« Reply #3 on: April 26, 2010, 11:45:45 pm »

When obt3 started, "we" as a group of 10-12 german players wanted to play as mainly a traders guild. We were rhe Far-Go Traders. ;) And it was fun to behave like such a guild, until we realized that no one really was interested in tradi g with us or making caravan,  rather shooting at us for no apparent reason. Nowif there'd be an actual advantage in trading etc when youre a member of such a guild I am sure that people'll play as such huilds.


It's not everything just aboutin shootin'. ;)

the problem is that in game reality every gang could easily exploit system and have members belonging to all guilds

Surf

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Re: Why not to add guild system into the game?
« Reply #4 on: April 26, 2010, 11:51:56 pm »

Jep you're right. I think it's the root of all problems FOnline has - alts.
Re: Why not to add guild system into the game?
« Reply #5 on: April 27, 2010, 12:40:39 am »

Jep you're right. I think it's the root of all problems FOnline has - alts.
the root of all problems is not alt. Bad unbalanced game mechanics lead to alts
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Surf

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Re: Why not to add guild system into the game?
« Reply #6 on: April 27, 2010, 12:47:07 am »

Of course its far from finished, but its not that unbalanced at all. People are just greedy and take everything the can get away with. ;)  (powerbuilds etc)

Drakonis

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Re: Why not to add guild system into the game?
« Reply #7 on: April 27, 2010, 10:54:09 am »

the root of all problems is not alt. Bad unbalanced game mechanics lead to alts

no. it's limitations to prevent making at least SEMI jack of all trades build on a single character. Can do many things but is good at 3 tagged things, more he plays, better he is, even in non tagged skills... But what we have? Serious skill point limit pushed by low lvl cap- that's why people rather to make 2-4 specialist characters(it does'nt take long" rather than ONE crappy character that is not even half good in desired actions a designated alts could be.
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Lordus

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Re: Why not to add guild system into the game?
« Reply #8 on: April 27, 2010, 03:12:38 pm »

 I have (maybe) solution for this alt abusing guild system.

 My solution consist of 2 parts. Part of benefits from focusing on only one gang under one guild, and part of penaltie, if you dont focus on the one gang.

 I will start with the penalty system.

 Imagine, that your base will need water as basic resource. Every base will have (or maybe not every) its own water supply and water tank. Small caves will grant water for 5 alts per real day. If you log more alts, your water demand will raise and you will consume water from your water tank reserve. You will have 2 choices: use water bags to resuply your base or use water merchant (under the trade guild.. only they will have knowledge how to find water resources and transport it).

 It is very falloutish... first half of fallout 1 was about finding water chip because water was the n.1 resource in the wasteland. (Fallout new generation (= "fallout" 3) was about water resources too).

 Of course, there must exist penalty for lack of water. I can imagine penalty like base destroying, but i think that this is too much hard, but best penalty i can imagine is, if your base will have not enough water, your base will be visible on world map, until you will resupply your water tanks to some level. It was hard to imagine the relationship with real world with current problem (i know that this is game, but IMO there must exist some kind of relationship between game and real world), but i found it. In real world, if your hideout will be without water and the inhabitants dont want to die, they have to find water somewhere else, so they will oftem leave and come to the hideout and this helps scouts to find this hideout.

 So point is, if you will have base with huge number of players (alts), you will need more water. Current system is bad, you collect money, buy base and nothing else.

 Second part is about benefit, if you (team members) focus your attention to only one gang.

 At first, i think that there must exist possibility to make regular base network under one gang possesion, with special rights system (for newbies,..). I can imagine 2 basic types of bases: crafting (+storages) and resource "base". If your gang will be bigger and wants to posses resource bases (like current outpost,...), you will be able to. But you will need to posses bigger crafting (storage base) to posses bigger resource base. And to have bigger base with bigger water tank, you will need to hold your basic base for some time, you will need to make some special guild quests.

 The possibility of ownership bigger bases, better resource bases,... would be only one from more benefits that your guild offers to you. There should exist some rank system in the guild. If you reach first few ranks, you cant loose them, until your gang will leave the guild. But highest ranks, with best benefits, would need to periodically repeat some quests*, activities.

 I can see 2 big problems: balance (but this is beta) and boredom. So i suggest that first few guild ranks should me NPC quests, but to reach and hold highest ranks, you will need to make only real player interaction quests*. I.e.: water merchants will need to supply X bases per week, PK raiders gang will have to attack x cities (or) and X water merchants caravans, PK mercenary will have to protect X water merchants, the crafter guild will have to sell x weapons.

 Why i am suggesting this. From my own experience (VSB), there exist many players which were roleplaying traders, PK, anti PK, mercenaries, someone was pure crafter etc. etc... Current system is kind of self-sufficient gang economy. You have no need to trade with other gangs, or non gang players, because if you have need, you can make alt and problem is over. If you will have to focus all aim to your own gang, you will have benefit from this, and then you can trade these benefits with other gangs.

 And look, now, we have almost useless Raider base (guild), in this universum, there exist water merchants, Brotherhood, NCR, ... with only one usage.. join, reach level 3 proffesion, leave then (if you can). So the background for guild system is already exist.
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Lexx

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Re: Why not to add guild system into the game?
« Reply #9 on: April 27, 2010, 05:31:53 pm »

Quote
Imagine, that your base will need water as basic resource. Every base will have (or maybe not every) its own water supply and water tank. Small caves will grant water for 5 alts per real day. If you log more alts, your water demand will raise and you will consume water from your water tank reserve

And how should the base know what is alt and what not?
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Surf

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Re: Why not to add guild system into the game?
« Reply #10 on: April 27, 2010, 05:36:16 pm »

And how should the base know what is alt and what not?

Tieing character accounts directly to the factions terminal?
But I doubt that this is possible..

Lordus

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Re: Why not to add guild system into the game?
« Reply #11 on: April 27, 2010, 07:17:55 pm »

And how should the base know what is alt and what not?

 Well, each base should be designed for limited number of "avatars" (alts,chars,..). If you reach this number, you must find additional resource of water. It does not matter, if you have 10 real players without alts, or 4 players with 6 alts. The more chars who will enter/log in (into) the base per day, more water you will need. Even visitors/friends too. If you have time to login more avatars per day, you will find time to find another water.

 At this moment, everybody has alts. I had one main battle character, one trader, one crafter SG, one crafter armorer, second battle character and few miners. And my alts numbers was average in our team.

 The point is, that if you use many alts per day, there should exist some ingame duty... if you add guild (or for start some roleplay of water merchants), the existence of base with many players/alts, respectively their need of water, will generate kind of roleplay for other players, water merchants. Only important thing is, that this "roleplay" should add Player vs. Player interaction (trade, fights, stealing,...) into the gameworld. This should not be blind lead, only dutie for dutie, only measure to reduce alting. IMO, if there is any factor, which devs dont like, but there is no reasonable way how to erase it, the only meaningful way is to do some measure, which will bring benefit to other players. (In real worl, smoking is bad, everybody knows it, but there is no way how to ban it, so there exist consumption tax and money from this tax could help another people, in medicine, sport,...).

 Another benefit from this.. if all water merchants guild (or water supply) will be settled in Hub (like in F1), you will attract the focus to this city.

 Also you can add another parts to this economy chain.. you will need more brahmins, because of water caravans, so many brahmin hunters will go to Hub to sell watermerchants their brahmin,....
« Last Edit: April 27, 2010, 07:25:43 pm by Lordus »
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Lexx

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Re: Why not to add guild system into the game?
« Reply #12 on: April 27, 2010, 07:24:44 pm »

Tieing character accounts directly to the factions terminal?
But I doubt that this is possible..

One character is one account.

Quote
Well, each base should be designed for limited number of "avatars" (alts,chars,..)

Like above, the player character is your account. And even if we would split account and character, it wouldn't be a problem, to simply make another account.

Quote
The more chars who will enter/log in (into) the base per day, more water you will need. Even visitors/friends too. If you have time to login more avatars per day, you will find time to find another water.

This is an interesting idea. But it has - in fact - not much to do with alternative characters. It just has the luck to react on it as well.
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Lordus

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Re: Why not to add guild system into the game?
« Reply #13 on: April 27, 2010, 07:40:49 pm »

One character is one account.

Like above, the player character is your account. And even if we would split account and character, it wouldn't be a problem, to simply make another account.

This is an interesting idea. But it has - in fact - not much to do with alternative characters. It just has the luck to react on it as well.

 I dont know why we need split acount/player/avatar/char.. current state is not ideal, but my idea is compatible with this.. Maybe i did not described it precisely, but i mean that Base will have capacity of "entering the base per day" (you can enter by login into the base, if you are logged of, or just by simple entering from world map). If you reach limit, your water reserve in tank will be consumed. So you will have to not entering the base next day, and reserve will be filled, or fill it by water bags (but this will be the hardest way how to do it) or make deal with some water merchant and bring him to your base with water caravan.
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Re: Why not to add guild system into the game?
« Reply #14 on: April 28, 2010, 08:02:45 am »

How would the Guilds be justified in-game?

I mean... is it enforced by magic?

Yes, we have respawn, I know.

If Guilds were more like a network of contacts that grease the wheels for various endeavors, even special quests, then ok.

But of course, alts.

The Meta-Game lurks, always.
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