Other > Suggestions
Discussion: Stop this merc / slave madness in PVP
jacky.:
But there is no point jov. Tnb have unlimited money as they will just use rl muties what is evem worst. Same slaves with grenades are op. Problem with mercs they can be spawned in critical ammount in tc. Why not remove them and leave only followers? Increase numer of spawning followers and remove mercs.
LeMark:
--- Quote from: JovankaB on December 28, 2012, 10:44:03 am ---If unarmed mutants can effectively use grenades then it's a bug.
If they were just unarmed mutants without auto-attack they wouldn't be such a threat.
Their price could be increased a bit too, if they cost 50 caps it's really silly.
You shovel 5 shits to get a supermutant. That's wrong I think.
And mercenaries with owner logged off or dead should run away if not harassed.
I'm not sure how it is now.
Finally, they should only protect owner (and each other) not whole faction.
Auto-attack should be option to guard base/tent from intruders and that's all IMO.
I think the changes would limit alt-abusing followers in gangs.
If someone would like to play merc leader it would be still possible but would have
to play like a leader not grid bomber.
I don't get whole "it's not PvE". NPCs and followers are part of the game, if you want
to play clean, fair PvP matches go to Hinkly. The game never was a tournament platform.
--- End quote ---
All good idea, but at the end that will just not work and we will still see 1 guys farming machine with mass merc and PVP town full of merc / slave. Is time to fix it once for all, no to try, you already did and fail.
T-888:
--- Quote from: Kilgore on December 28, 2012, 07:59:45 am ---This.
If you don't know how to effectively limit it, then it's better to remove mercs/slaves at all or to make them never attack players.
--- End quote ---
Wasn't my intention to propose to scrap the feature entirely, that's your solution for the problem. I don't support the idea, because mercenaries and slaves are a viable factor in unregulated, unscheduled, global fights. It's not fair, but it shouldn't be, just the lack of proper limitation. There's more than that possible - scraping a good feature from player interaction, there has to be an alternative. Mercenaries, slaves wouldn't play such a huge role, if they would be properly moderated by some sort of factors. They are in the game after all.
That's IF there is infinite amount of time and enough resources to supplement the effort, currently there is no limit on it, but with periodic wipe system it wouldn't be the case as players couldn't just solely focus on such type of action, thus decreasing the chance to be in the same situation which is present now.
It's plausible of course to be effective enough on its own to prevent future damage, but I think it's better than scraping the feature entirely.
--- Quote from: JovankaB on December 28, 2012, 10:44:03 am ---If unarmed mutants can effectively use grenades then it's a bug.
If they were just unarmed mutants without auto-attack they wouldn't be such a threat.
--- End quote ---
They also can use Gatling, Plasma, Laser rifle to about an approximate of 10~ hexes range.
--- Quote from: JovankaB on December 28, 2012, 10:44:03 am ---And mercenaries with owner logged off or dead should run away if not harassed.
I'm not sure how it is now.
--- End quote ---
Currently if your logged off, your mercenaries act normally.
--- Quote from: JovankaB on December 28, 2012, 10:44:03 am ---Finally, they should only protect owner (and each other) not whole faction.
Auto-attack should be option to guard base/tent from intruders and that's all IMO.
--- End quote ---
Exactly.
--- Quote from: JovankaB on December 28, 2012, 10:44:03 am ---I don't get whole "it's not PvE". NPCs and followers are part of the game, if you want
to play clean, fair PvP matches go to Hinkly. The game never was a tournament platform.
--- End quote ---
Agreed.
I can add.
--- Quote ---Number of Slaves you can have is 2 + number of Mercs you own
--- End quote ---
It's over kill in my opinion, 10 man group of mercenaries/slaves can be achieved so easily forming "air strikes". Slaves should be as any other follower, taking up Party Points, like 50 per a slave. Previous session maximum of 5 slaves was good, I had a slaver on my own and it was balanced nicely.
Thus.
--- Quote ---Dog/Brahmin
--- End quote ---
Shouldn't take up any, why a slave doesn't need PP, but a dog requires? Just doesn't make sense.
--- Quote from: Mayck on December 28, 2012, 12:01:03 pm ---I never got why you need 2 dogs to guard one extra brahmin. It should be other way around, one dog for 2 brahmin (if it should be dog dependant at all).
--- End quote ---
This.
--- Quote from: JovankaB on December 28, 2012, 10:44:03 am ---...
--- End quote ---
Another thing, regular energy weapon mercenaries that can be bought for 1k approximately, they hold about 450 caps inside their inventory + a laser pistol and you can get both out with gold nuggets, thus almost eliminating any cost. They use Plasma rifle, Gatling almost on max range, use Laser rifle effectively and all other energy weapons and with appropriate build they have a lot of HP and good resistances due to MAmk2 armor + their fast.
Their price needs to be like 5-6k at least, no caps in their inventories.
--- Quote from: jacky. on December 28, 2012, 01:10:30 pm ---Tnb have unlimited money
--- End quote ---
Incorrect.
avv:
Price is nothing because playerbase divides into haves and not-haves anyway. Merc pack should be an item like gauss pistol to make it balanced.
T-888:
--- Quote from: avv on December 28, 2012, 06:38:56 pm ---Price is nothing because playerbase divides into haves and not-haves anyway. Merc pack should be an item like gauss pistol to make it balanced.
--- End quote ---
Incorrect.
If that would be the case, we'd see nothing but the most expensive mercenaries out in the field.
Look, even players who bring in these large amount of mercenaries in fights revolve around the most cost-efficient solutions, like the priceless unarmed mutants, regular rocket-launcher mutants who are extremely cost efficient of how durable they are and what firepower they bring in compared to regular mercenaries. Compare to the minigun version mutants, they cost like 7.5k~ more than rocket-launcher version, but are almost the same as the only difference is the weapon and some amount of HP and both can use the same weapons equally well.
That means the price is a large factor of what kind of mercenaries are used.
Balancing price depending on the mercenary ability is key point to focus on.
--- Quote ---Minigun Mutant 14.5k~
RL mutant 7.5k~
must be with same health.
Minigun Mutant 14.5k~
RL mutant 14.5k~
--- End quote ---
That's balanced.
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