Other > Winter 2011/2012
Loner trait
jangling:
The issue i have with no tagging may come down to perceived 'loner; in role-play.
For me, that means a lone gun man, but sometimes a gun for hire.
That means, you need to travel with people, many people roleplay like this. Get a job in NCR, travel with your new boss, but no real loyalties- waiting to get paid.
However maybe roleplaying a loner for others is forever alone on world map, trading on forum to meet in towns and combat.
Maybe there are other types of loners.
I think blocking a core mechanic like follow is crazy. its a multiplayer game, loner characters should be encouraged but in a multi-player way.
--- Quote from: Chrupek on December 23, 2011, 01:37:28 am ---cant use science on hides, when loner is in map
--- End quote ---
Seems fair but then to counter balance that i think a concession such as loners are aloud more then one tent, its a big map after all.
Solar:
I'm not sure how its been implemented, you're just meant to be unable to lead a party (so no slaves, mercs, etc or lead a group of people).
Does it currently stop you joining a party too?
baaelSiljan:
guys You dont understand, do You? It doesn't mean forever alone, this mean they often meet in some places, encounters, help each other in other way than walking toghether and killing all what is moving. You want to hire him, leave message on some board (I dont know if it is implemented if not another suggestion here) or find him in city shouting that You hire people, then tell him what to do and where to go (coords? or next suggestion mark on someones map some places - only when he got big outdoorsman). Loners aren't characters for fighting, more for survive.
And this is trait (negative meaning), someone who get it, will know what he is taking.
If You want to add some small things it doesn't make sense like now, if You allow them parting or party doesn't have noticable cons it may ends that loners will be walking in groups and form gangs (nonsense)...
Loners dont use taxi's, loners don't go into gang fights - they are outsiders, so pros and cons should cover it.
JovankaB:
--- Quote from: jangling on December 23, 2011, 01:19:35 am ---What would mad max be if he never interacted with other characters in the movie?
--- End quote ---
You can interact with people in towns and in random encounters.
You can do jobs for other people, just not travel along with them or sit in their hidden base.
You can't have traveling in party ability, or it WILL be used by gang alts (sharing locations etc) and proxying loners.
It opens too many possibilities to abuse the idea.
--- Quote ---I'm not sure how its been implemented, you're just meant to be unable to lead a party (so no slaves, mercs, etc or lead a group of people).
--- End quote ---
What I meant was disabled tag button/option, which would be simple (I suppose) and take care of most of the team features.
- if a no-loner uses context menu on a loner, the tag button is disabled (but visible)
- if a loner uses context menu on anyone, the tag button is hidden
Note the difference. I think the button should be still visible but grayed out in the case no-loner uses context menu on a loner (maybe with "Loner" text on it or some other way to show why the button is disabled) because for no-loners the option sometimes would work and sometimes not (depends who they clicked). Loners clicking others can have the button hidden completely, because it would never appear in their interface. Is this confusing? :P
Anyway, this is client UI idea. Tagging loners should also be checked by server side script to prevent hacking.
I think there still would be a possibility to share car location/radio. This might be a problem, especially cars. But I don't exactly remember how remembering these locations work. If there is a way to make them work as a shared tent this shouldn't be possible for a loner.
This wouldn't prevent you from having NPC followers or to join NPC factions, because you don't tag anyone to do this. I suppose NPC factions are still necessary for some professions and I think loners should be able to take them. But maybe not.
Having mercs doesn't mean you are not a loner. They are not your friends, they work for you for money ;) Same about slaves (especially slaves). But I think this is a problem of balancing merc build, not the loner trait, so I think NPC followers should be allowed.
Proposed trait description: You are a loner. You have a hard time working in teams, but [put bonus here]
avv:
--- Quote from: JovankaB on December 23, 2011, 11:31:40 am ---You can't have traveling in party ability, or it WILL be used by gang alts (sharing locations etc) and proxying loners.
It opens too many possibilities to abuse the idea.
--- End quote ---
But the idea is too ambitious. Not being able to have a base is a big tradeoff so you should get a good refine for that. However if you get a good refine, it's just another reason to make an alt. Character-based benefits will always create more alts.
And even if the benefit is something that would only help solo char player it would fail as feature because the mechanics still encourage alting in general. Features must be designed so that they match the actual gameplay, not so that they match some fantasy non-existing gameplay that we'd wish to have (Mad Max wannabes).
So small benefit for small tradeoff is in this case the best choice.
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