Other > General Game Discussion
TC in the next session
seb910:
--- Quote from: Pozzo on October 06, 2011, 11:16:35 PM ---I agree with that guy. Milicians are mercenaries employed by the faction controling the town. When the job is done, milicians come back home.
So let's say the town stay secured and untakable for 1 day when controled by a faction. When the time is over, the town become neutral and the milicians go away. So the faction will have to defend the town by itself.
When the timer is running, milicians protect the town and become secured as NCR is for now (so people can come in town to mine and trade). I think that will offer some good battles for PvP and other players will enjoy to come safely in northern cities.
So everyone is happy ;D
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NO PLEASE NOOOO!!! I don`t want happy talkers, they can happy talk on irc. No militia! North is north.
Nice_Boat:
--- Quote from: T-888 on October 06, 2011, 11:39:18 PM ---If you face odds you can't overcome it is you made a mistake or the team made a mistake. In small scale pvp when you die it's entirely your fault and in big battles you make excuse " oh noes they were more than me " right ? I mean man your so wrong off the track.
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That's bullshit and you know it. Every frontal assault with swarms is a gamble. Every. Single. One. You don't need mad skills to run up to the enemy, spend your AP and if you're alive heal and do that again. There's a multitude of scenarios like that and every single thing that demands player skills in large battle is an element that comes from small battles. The only thing large battles add is formations (which are bullshit and encourage camping) and that random factor I was talking about (lots and lots of frontal clashes that are won by people who have more luck in terms of damage).
--- Quote from: T-888 on October 06, 2011, 11:39:18 PM ---It's actually a challenge to maneuver with 20 people as good as 5 people that's why it takes more skill , goddammit. I think you haven't played with msh.
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I think msh would be amused if he heard that. Also msh doesn't really like swarms, just ask him why.
--- Quote from: T-888 on October 06, 2011, 11:39:18 PM ---I haven't seen what ? You know you haven't seen me 1 vs 4 guys , i'm basicly starting to talk like you. None of that is a viable argument.
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You're sounding like a little kid that feels threatened somebody just might take those swarms away. Newsflash, there's hardly a player that really likes this style of play, you're a (very vocal I admit) minority.
--- Quote from: T-888 on October 06, 2011, 11:39:18 PM ---I quoted you to answer you. The same techniques for movement and engagement , the pvp was different overall people had a completly different experience , your are in denial with your own arguments man.
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And you know how it was and felt because...?
--- Quote from: T-888 on October 06, 2011, 11:39:18 PM ---Still i don't see any strong arguments , don't care man how experienced you are then.
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To be honest the results of that poll you can see at the top of this page are a pretty strong argument.
--- Quote from: Johnnybravo on October 06, 2011, 11:47:53 PM ---So go find another game. This is no "hurr durr I click you first, me better!!1!!" (no offense, but the combat itself is rather simple). There is much more possibilities with every new player included, if you can imagine only that the more they are, the better they can rush, it's a little sad. On contrary with just few people around it's more about random generator, regrouping from respawn, etc. Clearly artificial limitations and not "skill". Though would you really butcher the game combat system to make it faster? It's almost unique to have game where combat is based on positioning and not egos.
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Combat is not simple, it's pretty realistic when you think about it in terms of lethality and the very real impact of morale and coordination on the outcome. Heck, I talked about it with the lieutenant in the armed forces and he said it emulates every single facet of the real thing (scouting, logistics, mopping up, communications, procedures, even how the engagement flows). The problem is that what is lethal for single players is not enough to stop a swarm. That's why in small scale PvP you get modern tactics (delicious and pretty friggin' complicated) and in large scale PvP you get musket-era tactics with them sniper rifles being muskets and bazookas being some hilariously underpowered grenades. Besides the maps are what they are and while they can accomodate complicated maneuvres executed by two squads of 5-10 people, they become a "little" crowded when we're talking 20-30ish. That's why with swarm battles you more often than not end up with two masses of people mindlessly bashing at each other until one of them is dead or flees. I don't really understand your hurr-durring about combat being based on positioning and not egos, nobody's calling for making it more like Quake 3, it's just that very large swarms don't really work that well in gameplay terms for reasons outlined above. If we had better anti-crowd weapons (like C4 or those Avengers from session 2 that could kill 4 people in 2 bursts) it wouldn't be as bad as it is right now, but I don't think the devs like having weapons that lethal around.
Xaern:
Here's my idea.
Have every town have a safe period for an in-game week after being captured, during which militia will respawn every five minutes or so and the town control clock will be longer if you decide to take it during the safe period, because folks just don't appreciate so many people wrestling for control of their town.
After said safe period the militia will no longer respawn and the TC clock will be normal again, the only benefit of the lessened security is increasingly better rewards the longer you manage to hold the town.
For fans of roleplay I suggest a town tolerance system. Simply put, the town will compare the amount of players killed by gang members without provocation to the amount of players who trade, talk to NPCs, and just generally hang out.
If the amount of players killed by gang members without provocation is higher than the amount of players allowed to go about their business then the town will become unhappy, and the town control counter will be shortened for the next gang that decides to take the town, perhaps the militia will receive penalties due to the unhappy town.
A happy town however, (Frequent player activity and less unprovoked deaths) will have a somewhat extended TC counter and the Militia will do their jobs better.
I am assuming that militia will be nerfed severely and not drop loot, otherwise this suggestion is foolish.
Anyways I'm sure we can take my idea and everyone else's and come up with something exciting, but less overpowered.
T-888:
--- Quote from: Nice_Boat on October 07, 2011, 12:30:05 AM ---That's bullshit and you know it. Every frontal assault with swarms is a gamble. Every. Single. One. You don't need mad skills to run up to the enemy, spend your AP and if you're alive heal and do that again. There's a multitude of scenarios like that and every single thing that demands player skills in large battle is an element that comes from small battles. The only thing large battles add is formations (which are bullshit and encourage camping) and that random factor I was talking about (lots and lots of frontal clashes that are won by people who have more luck in terms of damage).
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It's not a gamble always if your know what your doing it's always considered how much the risk is of a frontal assault your speaking like you have never town controled maybe you haven't long enough so that you dont remember , large battles are more than just wasting AP and taking cover you don't want to see the teamplay aspect in big battles that is more complicated and intesnive than in small and again i repeat myself do you actually listen ? So your the narrow-minded child man :) big battles have everything that small battles have to offer and more , you just can't accept it.
--- Quote from: Nice_Boat on October 07, 2011, 12:30:05 AM ---I think msh would be amused if he heard that. Also msh doesn't really like swarms, just ask him why.
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Yes he would be amused , but since he likes challenges i think he would agree maybe he will add his 2 cents. Btw were talking about 10-20 people it's not really a swarm for me just usual TC , such amount of players is possible to control and make tactics and all if the leader is good and if most of the players know what they have to do , but hey there is where the actual skill comes and is needed , i think you don't understand that too.
--- Quote from: Nice_Boat on October 07, 2011, 12:30:05 AM ---You're sounding like a little kid that feels threatened somebody just might take those swarms away. Newsflash, there's hardly a player that really likes this style of play, you're a (very vocal I admit) minority.
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You ignore many of my arguments , newsflash with people like you it's actually impossible to discuss anything. There are plenty of people that likes big battles , like everyone who participates in them and hey i think it's almost half the server if not more still i told this before but yeah you ignored that and start to talk in circles.
--- Quote from: Nice_Boat on October 07, 2011, 12:30:05 AM ---And you know how it was and felt because...?
To be honest the results of that poll you can see at the top of this page are a pretty strong argument.
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Now you don't make any sense man , you will most probably start talking complete garbage now ;D
Sarakin:
--- Quote from: Kilgore on October 06, 2011, 10:52:29 PM ---If you played before, you would know that any possible pvp action happened always in the last few minutes of each TC window, not 2 hours, and it's based on gameplay experience from 3rd session and not mine or your imagination. Speaking about 2 hours of pure action is ridiculous for anyone who played more than one session.
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This is true and it could be fixed by few adjustments:
-if someone starts the timer and defend it, the TC window will end
-if attackers are killed while defending, the town owners can expect more attacks until the end of TC window
Problem was mostly with taking town and going on world map, which shouldnt be problem anymore. With the former mechanic, it was common to see that timer stretched even an hour after the end of TC window due to constant retaking of the city.
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