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[avv]

That line depends on your goals. If one plans to go and do organized pvp versus others, it stays quite high. If he decides to stay in small group or alone and gather items or whatever such people do, it's going to look like that there.

[Gaizk]

That line depends on your goals. If one plans to go and do organized pvp versus others, it stays quite high. If he decides to stay in small group or alone and gather items or whatever such people do, it's going to look like that there.

If we were to adhere to that line, Avv, then where would the low level pker gangbanger assholes would end up being?

Honestly, its damn damn easy to grab a MAMK2, a LSW and prey for hours on low level towns... ALONE, on the contrary it does require a shitload of patience, awareness and overall good old intuition to stay alive early on the game... Like a Cat and Mouse thing, except mouses dont build turrets or make an army...

[Stampedo]

What's up with that EVE line? I don't get it.

This game requires one safe zone where beginners will learn the basics/get gear/buy material.
Having this somewhere would help starters, instead of giving them multiple high kicks in the face while laughing its ass off.

The community is very low compared to other MMO's, I wonder if there would be ways to bring more player while keeping the essence of this game.

[Gaizk]

The community is very low compared to other MMO's, I wonder if there would be ways to bring more player while keeping the essence of this game.

Ever heard the saying, filth builds on dark places? Well this place is filled to the brim with bullshit scenarios, thus it draws bullshit in. However there also cant be light without darkness, and so theres also a part of the community which is quite bright and friendly.... Then theres the gray area which is mostly crafters in their caves, no one likes them and they offer little to the game but they're essencial for they keep the economy going.

Anyhow, its up to you wether you feel like becoming more of the filth that floods the game, or standing up to it. If you can get past the troll game for trolls part then you might enjoy the fun this game brings

Oh and yes THE GAME TROLLS YOU, ALOT, so begging for a newcomers area is only going to fall on deaf ears because, as my previous posts have proven so far, THIS GAME IS DESIGNED FOR TROLLS, but trolls can be fun, and trolling is also fun so theres fun in it, just some special kind of fun

[runboy93]

Community is low at the moment.
It's all because of waiting for wipe

When wipe happened+updates off then there is muuuch more players than now. Believe me or not.

[jonny rust]

The community is very low compared to other MMO's, I wonder if there would be ways to bring more player while keeping the essence of this game.

beginning training/tutorial area's WERE part of the game essence of Fo1 and Fo2.

You weren't thrown at 21's with CA and LSW's your first day on the job either. 

I like to think the only reason we don't have this is because of limited man power versus the amount of time it would take to build and script it.

The ONLY people you see arguing against this idea are the griefers themselves.

I don't mind PKers one bit BUT there is an extreme short sightedness to the griefing where they don't realize that their behavior is caping our population and perhaps even diminishing it. There is a very likely possibility that they are 'over hunting' and they don't seem to mind or perhaps fail to understand this.

Community is low at the moment.
It's all because of waiting for wipe

community is always low and there is a high drop out rate. Let's not pretend the problem doesn't exist.

[Stampedo]

I have absolutely nothing against PK. It's the right opposite actually.

Anyway, to balance that, this game needs to be a more beginner-friendly. In particular for the huge amount of people that didn't play Fallout 1 & 2, that are already repulsed by those old school-ish graphics and outdated gameplay.

And I hate to hear those pseudo-elitist players arguing that this game is not made for noobs and they have to go through this awful learning phase and a high dose of frustration to worth playing this game. That's a dumb statement because every single players has been a noob once, they just had enough determination (masochism?) to keep playing. Each begginer can become an experienced player, as long as the game is not telling him constantly "get the fuck out asshole, nobody wants you here".

This game is total anarchy, that's his charm, but at the same time it should be slightly more compartimentalized so every kind of players can find what he's looking for and on the top of all: having fun.

If I were to create a new mod for Fonline, I'd have concerns to find the right balance between "keeping hardcore gamers pool" and "seducing new players and make them stay", in order to have the biggest player base possible.
What would you do?

[Grommok]

Some time ago someone suggested to make a sort of "noob town" where players could make their first level, have a few quests to help them get started, and so on.
Probably those players would have ragequitted at the first encounter with a Section 8 member.

[spears]

This subject has been done to death, what is a low lvl town going to offer? A place to get easy hunting rifles? Safe molerat farming?
The best way to get through the earlier part of the game is to have some friends, party up with some people anybody who isnt a complete nubcakes wont be needing all the crap gear like hunting rifles and deagles from a midbie encounter.
Dying doesnt get any less annoying until you stop caring about your stuff so much, losing a top tier combat loadout to a merc trap happens, wherever you move the safe point to in the lvl/gear progression will still cause grief.
If anything i think increasing the starting outdoorsman would probably be the best way to make it easier on nublets with the minimum amount of change.

[Stampedo]

Ok so you're involuntarily pointing out something interesting.
Having a safe zone is rather stupid, it's true, and it goes against the games philosophy. What I think is that there should be improved mechanics for allowing people to help newbies.

Currently, it's kinda hard to find trustful people to party with or people that are actually willing to help and not shooting you in the back after you've dug some ore for them.

There should be in-game forums (by forum, I mean a place like a bar or something) where people gather and share stuffs (material, gear, tips, sell stuffs) in a safe way (a place where weapons are not allowed for example).

It could happen at any level.

[Gaizk]

Ill tell you why this isnt gonna happen

THIS IS A TROLL GAME FOR TROLLS, any mechanic you consider designing has to be worked around the fact the game IS FULL OF TROLLS, people will abuse it in any possible way and render it void. Distrust will move back and things will be the way they were

This doesn't mean such mechanics cant exist, just that they would require an awful lot of work and constant supervision, both things devs on this game are not willing to really do, they got works, lifes etc and they shield themselves with that despite how wrong they're little pet project goes... Which to say, what they do isn't wrong at all, or at any level, its just a pet project and see it as such.

Ill repeat since you didn't get it on my first post, this community is FULL OF ASSHOLES, TROLLS, and whatnot, I dare say half of the people that plays this are twats, tossers, idiots and 12yr old kids, The fact you dont see just how many there are is because they're dormant, waiting for wipe. IT will be HELL when that happens and you'll realize the magnitude of the trolls on this game. IF you  can enjoy the constant frustration from playing with, against and alongside trolls then go ahead, if not then shut the fuck up, and if you're very so inclined to add something, then be very thoughtful instead of throwing random ideas that can bring to random abuse. Scrutinize every idea you can come up with, ALOT, because everyone else is doing so since we dont want abusive mechanics, just abusive players

[KruskDaMangled]

beginning training/tutorial area's WERE part of the game essence of Fo1 and Fo2.

You weren't thrown at 21's with CA and LSW's your first day on the job either. 

I like to think the only reason we don't have this is because of limited man power versus the amount of time it would take to build and script it.

The ONLY people you see arguing against this idea are the griefers themselves.

I don't mind PKers one bit BUT there is an extreme short sightedness to the griefing where they don't realize that their behavior is caping our population and perhaps even diminishing it. There is a very likely possibility that they are 'over hunting' and they don't seem to mind or perhaps fail to understand this.

community is always low and there is a high drop out rate. Let's not pretend the problem doesn't exist.

If you went the right way you didn't run into horrible end game enemies. If you whimsically wandered towards the coast you got slaughtered by said end game enemies if you couldn't avoid them. (Actually, if you went the right direction half cocked you still got slaughtered, but not as badly.)

Speaking personally, it's not a matter of griefing weak players I see. It's a matter of "a person I don't know".
"I should shoot him, because he might not be friendly/I want his stuff"
I guess it involves some malice, but it's not really about ruining someones day, so much as getting more stuff for me, and friendly players who need equipment. (And yes, at some point, one will have the need for shitty newb equipment, for newbs and stuff. Even if you don't, it can still be sold.)

Even when I don't even have the carry weight left to carry loot, I still shoot unknowns on sight on general principal, you just can't trust them.

[jonny rust]

If you went the right way you didn't run into horrible end game enemies. If you whimsically wandered towards the coast you got slaughtered by said end game enemies if you couldn't avoid them. (Actually, if you went the right direction half cocked you still got slaughtered, but not as badly.)

Speaking personally, it's not a matter of griefing weak players I see. It's a matter of "a person I don't know".
"I should shoot him, because he might not be friendly/I want his stuff"
I guess it involves some malice, but it's not really about ruining someones day, so much as getting more stuff for me, and friendly players who need equipment. (And yes, at some point, one will have the need for shitty newb equipment, for newbs and stuff. Even if you don't, it can still be sold.)

Even when I don't even have the carry weight left to carry loot, I still shoot unknowns on sight on general principal, you just can't trust them.

All I'm saying is that If you are hunting players and see a blue suite with no weapon and 40 HP in the middle of a fight with some brahmin there are two ways you can go.

You can blow pieces of him all over the wasteland for a few weak healing powders and maybe some hides and junk and risk him rage quiting as a result, meaning no repeat business..

Or you can leave him to his own devices. Let him have his powders and kill the brahmin. let him make a tent and earn some real loot. Then next time you meet him he might have something actually worth killing him for. By this point he would have a much better understanding of the game and less likely to walk away from it meaning he will be back with more loot and you're attack would have been less of a slap in the face and more of a lesson.

IMO #2's the way to go.

But I also wasn't trying to single out player killing (which imo isn't synonymous with griefing). I really meant griefing in all of it's forms

[KruskDaMangled]

All I'm saying is that If you are hunting players and see a blue suite with no weapon and 40 HP in the middle of a fight with some brahmin there are two ways you can go.

You can blow pieces of him all over the wasteland for a few weak healing powders and maybe some hides and junk and risk him rage quiting as a result, meaning no repeat business..

Or you can leave him to his own devices. Let him have his powders and kill the brahmin. let him make a tent and earn some real loot. Then next time you meet him he might have something actually worth killing him for. By this point he would have a much better understanding of the game and less likely to walk away from it meaning he will be back with more loot and you're attack would have been less of a slap in the face and more of a lesson.

IMO #2's the way to go.

But I also wasn't trying to single out player killing (which imo isn't synonymous with griefing). I really meant griefing in all of it's forms

Ideally, yes.

I don't always waste bullets on someone like that. If they do anything threatening though, it won't go well. Just because someone doesn't have armor doesn't mean they aren't dangerous.

And like I said, it kind of levels out. I promote the experience of new players in my group, who don't feel like quitting because they have support. That's just kind of how my group of fellow players works. Everything is about our group, not random people. Sometimes we recruit people, a lot of times we shoot them in the face. It ends up being not fun for us if we are just naive.

It does vary of course. It's a safe bet that some poor schmuck wandering around a less PVP intensive wilderness area isn't that dangerous. Your bigger hunting areas, for players and NPC's, well, you have to learn sometime that it's not safe to hunt there, because people hunt YOU  too.