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[jonny rust]

Now I don't know much about how the economy works and this may be way out of line but here it goes;

It seems strange that a gang can take a town and then turn it into a ghost town by either killing anyone who enters or not guarding it from thugs yet still make several thousand caps off of that town daily.

I mean on one hand that towns economy is being destroyed but on the other it it generating a huge revenue for the controlling gang,

Am I right to say that?

If so, shouldn't a towns revenue be reflective of the 'tourism' that town gets?

If a gang takes a town and expects to make money off of it then they should be protecting the town as well. The more people who come into town to trade etc. the more 'muscle money' the controlling gang would get.

right?

[Michaelh139]

You are very correct, but you are also very wrong.  Let me explain.  (Not that I don't think your way of thinking should be the way it works...  I totally agree)

bad Karma Scenario 1:
Lets say a gang of "Raiders" takes control of a town.  They dont give a shit about the people, or whatever, they just want their "pay" for "protecting" the town.  So it doesnt matter to them whether the town's economy is destroyed, they're there to suck it dry.

Good Karma Scenario 2: 
Lets say a gang of "Peacekeepers" takes control of a  town.  They are good guys, so they bulk up the town's gaurd and keep watch over the place from raiders and allow anyone to come in as long as they don't cause trouble.  The town's economy is bolstered, but it costs alot of money to actually bother "protecting" the town and "Taking care" of the town.

[naossano]

I totally agree with johnny rust, and can't agree with something else.
If the raider keep harrassing people and kill everyone, the economy is down for one reason :
- Nothing can be produced, of be sold.
If there is no production, TC boxes and traders inventory, should end up dead/empty, after a period. (of course, at the beginning, the gang should take more, as they treat peoples lifes. But after, there wouldn't be anything to take)

But i also think it's highly abusable.
The pk gang may just allow their friend to keep the economy flowing.
(or some of their own alt, that are out of the faction)

[Crazy]

I totally agree with johnny rust, and can't agree with something else.
If the raider keep harrassing people and kill everyone, the economy is down for one reason :
- Nothing can be produced, of be sold.
If there is no production, TC boxes and traders inventory, should end up dead/empty, after a period. (of course, at the beginning, the gang should take more, as they treat peoples lifes. But after, there wouldn't be anything to take)

But i also think it's highly abusable.
The pk gang may just allow their friend to keep the economy flowing.
(or some of their own alt, that are out of the faction)

It's always easier and more profitable to kill people coming for trade and take their stuff than take a percentage of what they trade. Such system have been tested in the past, it just don't work at all.

[Daro]

Cool story. Most of that visitor don’t have anything to sell and you are talking about trading incomes.
Complain about northern PK is another  bullshit. Most of TC cities are empty. It is really hard to meet single PK there. Area around NCR and SF is more dangerous that northern town.

[jonny rust]

Cool story. Most of that visitor don’t have anything to sell and you are talking about trading incomes.
Complain about northern PK is another  bullshit. Most of TC cities are empty. It is really hard to meet single PK there. Area around NCR and SF is more dangerous that northern town.

Northern Cities are usually empty, thats my point, and while a know that a ghost town holds very little value for PK's I think I'm talking more about PvP's here. I have no problem with PvP, or PK for that matter. I consider one an important game aspect and the other a wasteland essential. However most people's perception of these unguarded ghost towns is that they will be shot on sight upon entry (which may be a stereotype, but stereotypes are stereotypes for a reason, right?).

with the amount of visitation these towns get (apart from perhaps Redding during good times) they should all be gone by this point from lack of traffic.

Don't forget my main issue with this is the possible impact that several thousand caps (and I expect the real number to be higher than I think) flowing daily from these towns for no real reason has on the economy when the little guys can't even withdraw 50 caps due to bank runs. Since there is no stock system I can only assume that these bank runs are caused by the rich-old-white-men who control the vast majority of the wastes capitol. 

perhaps with an impending wipe this is a moot point, but its still more of a question about the economy than an implication.

[Gaizk]

Agree for the most part with TC, it does make a lot of sense to protect your town so its tourism bolsters its economy and thus giving you far more money. Still bad karma scenarios as explained before do occur and so you might just have a raider group sucking dry a town

As for what Crazy said, it got me thinking for a while and to this point I dont see that being a true case scenario... Sure you could rob the people that come into town but for how long is that going to work?. So it probably boils down to how attractive said town can be...

A poor town like modoc would surely be a raiders nest instead of a productive city, same for klamath and Den, thus those towns are better off being leeched rather than bolstered, however towns like Redding and Broken Hills should have a lot of potential, thus being attractive towns to ¨protect¨, with the protecting faction doing their best to publicize their towns to attract more costumers and so.

Lots of coding and lots of balancing behind this idea would probably make it never happen but still, its just wishful thinking  thats all..

[jonny rust]

Agree for the most part with TC, it does make a lot of sense to protect your town so its tourism bolsters its economy and thus giving you far more money. Still bad karma scenarios as explained before do occur and so you might just have a raider group sucking dry a town

As for what Crazy said, it got me thinking for a while and to this point I dont see that being a true case scenario... Sure you could rob the people that come into town but for how long is that going to work?. So it probably boils down to how attractive said town can be...

A poor town like modoc would surely be a raiders nest instead of a productive city, same for klamath and Den, thus those towns are better off being leeched rather than bolstered, however towns like Redding and Broken Hills should have a lot of potential, thus being attractive towns to ¨protect¨, with the protecting faction doing their best to publicize their towns to attract more costumers and so.

Lots of coding and lots of balancing behind this idea would probably make it never happen but still, its just wishful thinking  thats all..

I dont expect anything to change overnight, but if we are ever planning to get past the beta stage with this I believe it will need to change sometime.

However concerning leaching a town; any town that is simply leeched would not be continuously productive, instead there would be a steady decline in it's profit until it inevitably dies out all together. Perhaps there would be a cool down? a gang can squeeze a town for a period of time but eventually will need to relinquish (or nurture) that town until it becomes profitable again.

[Crazy]

Perhaps there would be a cool down? a gang can squeeze a town for a period of time but eventually will need to relinquish (or nurture) that town until it becomes profitable again.

Gangs aren't taking towns for money.

[Kelin]

Agree, it costs a lot to take a town and buy militia. You would have to hold the town for more than several weeks to have a really good income, which is almost impossible (one hispanic gang from another timezone and town income is reset).

[SEGA_RUS]

Benefit from TC
1)Loot from enemy fractions if you win
2)caps, some % drugs, guarded shops for Town Leader fraction

Some reasons for TC
1)TC for RP
2)TC for PK
3)TC for big battles between fractions(if you win you got all, if not - nothing)

and 1 thing
TC organizations are killing Unity, SF caravans, ect. too