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Gave it a try, again

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Solar:
I must play a completely different game to you. I crafted over 100k worth of stuff in a couple of weeks without being in danger once ... playing solo :-\ Tents disappear if you don't visit them for 7 days, not that harsh a restriction


To Allow one char to do everything will hardly encourage an economy where players rely on each other, nor particularly encourage player interaction.


There are more than enough skill points, even at I5, to be a crafter and a fighter.


--- Quote ---Now how does this equilize the capabilities of gangs and soloists exactly? It does give a major bonus to gangs and disencourage soloists if anything
--- End quote ---

Because one person can only use up so much per unit time. If a person could use as many materials as his gang could gather, it allows one person to craft at essentially the same rate as all people who will gather for him combined. These "gatherers" can then gain the benefits of the crafters ability exactly as if they had them. This is not the case in this system, so those players, considered as a whole, will have to give up similar percentages of their combat SP to craft at a similar rate to the solo player.


--- Quote ---And you have to craft top tier equip in the facion base, so you can't quite leave it. That could work.
--- End quote ---

 8)


Its important to keep in mind that many features will be built over the basic system we have in place now, we can't get everything ready all at once.

Quentin Lang:

--- Quote ---@Tent - 10 hides arnt realy much a gun and you have 10 hides no problem... or yo ucan spend few mins on crafting and buy hides ~10-20 mins of geathering mats depands what you collect and price on hides...
--- End quote ---
Its real easy to kill 10 brahmins, get their hides and make a tent and not die even once. The problem is: I assume that brahmins are near-extinct race in FOnline 2238. Well, who cares anyway, we can always use dog pelts....

Giemz:

--- Quote from: Solar on February 05, 2010, 03:58:20 pm ---I must play a completely different game to you.
--- End quote ---
Seems so. Experienced player always plays a diffrent game. So diffrent you may even don;t understand the basic problems a new player can have.


--- Quote ---To Allow one char to do everything will hardly encourage an economy where players rely on each other, nor particularly encourage player interaction.
--- End quote ---
The game is written in a way that a player should avoid relying on any other as much as he can. In every possible situation it's better to run from another player or shoot him, is that the interaction you are trying to imply?. Even if that wasn't basic design the culture (lack of actually) of play and feasible harrasment and griefing did that.


--- Quote ---There are more than enough skill points, even at I5, to be a crafter and a fighter.

--- End quote ---
And a doctor and a medic and a outdoorsman? No, there isn't.


--- Quote ---Because one person can only use up so much per unit time. If a person could use as many materials as his gang could gather, it allows one person to craft at essentially the same rate as all people who will gather for him combined. These "gatherers" can then gain the benefits of the crafters ability exactly as if they had them. This is not the case in this system, so those players, considered as a whole, will have to give up similar percentages of their combat SP to craft at a similar rate to the solo player.

--- End quote ---
What this have to do with proffesions? If anything it's a cooldown thing not a proffesion thing. And a group of people can more easily have all proffesions taken then a single player obviously. And for the cooldown thing. That can only work if the system is alt free or at least not as openly alt-friendly. It's way easier for groups to level 5 crafting alts then for a single player to do so. There are better ways to slow down people then cooldowns and ones not as easily alt avoided.

Solar:

--- Quote ---The game is written in a way that a player should avoid relying on any other as much as he can. In every possible situation it's better to run from another player or shoot him, is that the interaction you are trying to imply?. Even if that wasn't basic design the culture (lack of actually) of play and feasible harrasment and griefing did that.
--- End quote ---

Currently, that may be the case. But we are a game in development:


--- Quote ---Its important to keep in mind that many features will be built over the basic system we have in place now, we can't get everything ready all at once.
--- End quote ---


--- Quote ---And a doctor and a medic and a outdoorsman? No, there isn't.
--- End quote ---

Correct. But you can be combat capable and be any one of those things, or even two of those things as well - which is more than enough.


--- Quote ---What this have to do with proffesions? If anything it's a cooldown thing not a proffesion thing. And a group of people can more easily have all proffesions taken then a single player obviously. And for the cooldown thing. That can only work if the system is alt free or at least not as openly alt-friendly. It's way easier for groups to level 5 crafting alts then for a single player to do so. There are better ways to slow down people then cooldowns and ones not as easily alt avoided.
--- End quote ---

Ah, yes, I went off on my usual rant about single player vs groups instead of the actual question :)

Let's try this one instead. Professions allow us to set relatively low requirements to craft the best stuff (so people can be multi role chars [see above]) but still limit what they can do

Playing solo is a player choice, it will obviously have disadvantages - though the countdowns still help stop gangs using one crafting alt to allow the others to go as combat alts, so hopefully it equalizes the difference a bit more.

Badger:

--- Quote from: Solar on February 05, 2010, 05:07:04 pm ---Let's try this one instead. Professions allow us to set relatively low requirements to craft the best stuff (so people can be multi role chars [see above]) but still limit what they can do

--- End quote ---

I'd say that would be true if it weren't for the stat requirements. But needing 9 INT to be a level 3 doctor just means that people have their crafter build and their main. The crafter build is the one that fulfils the profession requirements, while the main is the character they actually want to play. Do you really think everyone who wants to be a master doctor also has 9 INT? Or everyone who wants to be a level 3 armourer has 7 ST?

The high stat requirements discourage players from crafting with their main, because in order to craft their build has to be totally skewed in one direction. I understand there should be basic stat requirements so people don't make a 1 ST 10 INT 10 LK skilled build and just craft with that. But needing 7 Agility to craft small guns just ensures people have a crafting alt, and so we actually see less diversity in character builds because their 'main' can just be combat orientated.

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