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[spitfire182]

I just thought that already no one using grenades in battles so my suggestion is simple: make fast shot affects grenades like pre-wipe. I remember when in last session well used grenade-build could change result of a battle. Lower AP cost for grenades also brings some variety to 2 bursts LSW sneakers. What do you think?

[vedaras]

i must fuckin agree like most players i think, but sadly that changes nothing :<

[pistacja]

Some grenade buff would be nice. 3 frag do something like 30-40 damage, and even 4 plasma are not much more then ~100 vs a combat armour.

[Solar]

Fast shot won't affect them. Grenades will have a boost. LSW sneaking will be harder.

[vedaras]

Fast shot won't affect them. Grenades will have a boost. LSW sneaking will be harder.

why you have to nerf it in first place if later they need a boost? This applys not only to grenades...

[Solar]

They will not get a boost to AP cost, so you will not be able to spam people with them and kepe them permanently down.

The boost will also not be at such a high percentage as AP 3 -> AP 2 (+50%). It wil also not be tied to a compulsary trait perk.


Same reasons as I've said many times. Maybe you should write them down somewhere so you don't need to ask it every time.

[vedaras]

They will not get a boost to AP cost, so you will not be able to spam people with them and kepe them permanently down.

The boost will also not be at such a high percentage as AP 3 -> AP 2 (+50%). It wil also not be tied to a compulsary trait perk.


Same reasons as I've said many times. Maybe you should write them down somewhere so you don't need to ask it every time.

Grenades werent overpowered even before, they were just another good way to fight, one of some. Lsw sneak is not overpowered neither. I just dont understand why it looks that your goal is to make only small guns as competitive weapon kind (small guns and various of them, are only receiving, boost, boost, boost and boost (assault rifle, fn fals, tommy gun, greased smg, all shotguns)). And not mentioning that small guns were best and most used skill in all along the way.

[Solar]

You're welcome to read the explanation in previous posts. Plasma's were doing better dps than Avengers, Frags were being used to keep people down for long periods without being able to respond. Both of those things are not allowed to happen.

Frags will get more splash and a slight boost (aswell as armour being changed around). Plasmas will get a boost up to ~+35% not the old +50% and will not make you burn a trait to do so.

I don't want heavy weapons to be the ideal sneaking weapon. Throwing, Pistols and Melee will be advantaged as far as sneak is concearned, heavy weapons will be disadvantaged.

assault rifle, fn fals, tommy gun, greased smg, all shotguns

Plenty of other weapons have recieved the same boost. Plenty of weapons will get another boost, either directly or through the new perks. If those boosts don't result in the overall weapon useage being how I want it, I'll change more things again.

Eventually we will have diverse characters and multiple weapons used, as well as low tech weapons not being totally useless compared to the top tier.

[vedaras]

You're welcome to read the explanation in previous posts. Plasma's were doing better dps than Avengers, Frags were being used to keep people down for long periods without being able to respond. Both of those things are not allowed to happen.

Plenty of other weapons have recieved the same boost. Plenty of weapons will get another boost, either directly or through the new perks. If those boosts don't result in the overall weapon useage being how I want it, I'll change more things again.

Eventually we will have diverse characters and multiple weapons used, as well as low tech weapons not being totally useless compared to the top tier.

Plasmas damage looks really good, but it has range of 15 only, so first of all its hard to come close to your target, and secondly target can just run away as simple as that. Frag grenades were good 1v1 weapon, and still you could throw only 9 of those to 1 single target (before player gets up), which to ba was only like 150 dmg at best. You can do same damage with sniper rifles/laser rifles 1 critical hit.

Some weapons just have to be shit, but i see the problem of them being unused in another place. For example tommy gun, was one of the best guns of level 1 gunsmith but still unused much. And i think its because of this situation: most critters (of those who uses ranged firing weapons) in encounters uses  hunting rifle, 10mm smg, desert eagle, mauser, assault rifle. Now guess what weapons are most popular in encounters in between players... (im not talking about town control here, since in there usually only the very imba sutff is used)

[Solar]

This is why there are more options for getting close in the perks. Why sneak is a good thing for throwing weapons. Why all maps are not just flat desert.

Weapons do not exist in a 1v1 vacuum, nor is the final damage done the only factor. They took away control of the character for too long, so that if someone popped round a corner and a frag guy was there he could stick you in the open, which was death. Frags are still useful for knocking people down, they will get better damage and they will get more splash. If we can get cover working well, they they will also be good vs fixed positions.

The idea is to increase options, not limit them down so each lame niche some weapon might be useful in is forever preserved just by virtue of it being useful. If it is stupid, its going to go. The potential is there for things to be useful in interesting ways.


Low tier can still be worse without it being worthless.

[Swinglinered]

Just make half of Plasma damage be electrical, and half fire.

That sort of is what Plasma is.

Oh, forgot explosive.

Maybe make them 45-90, one third each electrical, fire, and explosive damage.
(15-30 each type)

[Badger]

Did somebody say molotovs? I thought I heard somebody say molotovs.

[pistacja]

If one could throw them above cover (walls, rocks, ruins, etc) and throw them at a spot not at a moving enemy, that would be nice.

...just not like in FT, were you could throw them inside closed rooms.

[vedaras]

Frags are still useful for knocking people down, they will get better damage and they will get more splash. If we can get cover working well, they they will also be good vs fixed positions.

just add damn dynacord sticks to game once again, im 100% sure no one will miss frag grenades. Because you described the difference between these two just now.

And frags are shit in knocking target down, you can make maximum of 3 throws, or 4 (if you will use drugs + bonus rate of fire perk, but i havent seen anyone like that now), and these knockdowns doesnt remove AP from your enemy or anything, so as long as it doesnt kill its useless since it changes situation only from enemy fucks you up to enemy fucks you up after getting up.

[Lexx]

This can only be valid if you are a loner. If you are at least two players in a group, one could act as support with throwing grenades.