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[snailbeast]

Hi, people.
I just thought about 2 things.
1) Speach skill is useless right now
2) You can buy mercs w/o any problems just after creating of anotherclonewastlander and become OP-in-RT on lvl1 already.

What`s my point.
My Suggestion is to make the amount of mercs speach and CH depandant.
For example with

    1-100 1
100-125 2
126-150 3
151-175 4
176-299 5 (with MP)
300=     6 (with MP)

Another way - is to make mercs Speachcosted.
For example to Hire a dog you need 20 Speach skill, to take S.Mutant you need 100 Speach skill, to take both you need 120 speach skill.

Also, you can make merc-options speach-depandant too.

Way to discuss.



Added:
sorry for my english

[Graf]

The second suggestion is resonable enough. I'm all for it.
(3 Muties or 15 dogs I'd love it)

P.S. I believe something like that is in development already and we can expect it to be implemented after wipe.

[Michaelh139]

Mercenary leaders and slavers already have to dump their stats into mostly Outdoorsman, first aid, and Doctor already....  Sure, they are at least useful skills, but dont make use dump ALL of our skillpoints into only one skill for only one reason that will obviously make our character in itself completely worthless and unable to get slaves and unable to survive 2 seconds in combat even with his mercs.

I find leader builds one of the most balanced ones in fonline.

[Solar]

If you search other threads you will see posts talking about similar things. Hopefully we will see a new system upon the next wipe.

[vedaras]

If you search other threads you will see posts talking about similar things. Hopefully we will see a new system upon the next wipe.

solar but you should note the part, about speech and mercs. I would fully agree to that if for example to hire mutants you would need to have 150% speech or something (this would not indicate how many you can have, but all kinds of mercs would have a speech-to-buy check, and only if you have not lower than exact number of speech you could buy exact kind of mercs.

[Solar]

It won't work like that.

[Vaimortal]

Mercenary leaders and slavers already have to dump their stats into mostly Outdoorsman, first aid, and Doctor already....  Sure, they are at least useful skills, but dont make use dump ALL of our skillpoints into only one skill for only one reason that will obviously make our character in itself completely worthless and unable to get slaves and unable to survive 2 seconds in combat even with his mercs.

I find leader builds one of the most balanced ones in fonline.

Mercenary leaders are not balanced to much power for one character. This game has serious game balance issues.(for example a smg is better than a minigun)

This would be balance , you could get 5 or 6 mercs BUT at a cost you would have to sacrifice something more , because lol 5-6 mercs rocket bitches or ghoul snipers is fucking OP , they auto shoot and they don't get confused not human , bots they act and do not think.

It won't work like that.

I just have one question. Why ?

[Badger]

Will this include a way to get followers without handing over fistfuls of cash? And less merc price fluctuation?

[Ulrek]

Mercs and slavers already have problems. such as the crappy AI.

You say mercs and slaves don't get confused? what happens if you hit a friendly militia by mistake in TC? your mercs are fighting the militia and the enemy and your friends all at once, rockets and laser blasts everywhere.

You say they're OP? well they cant function in a large group of players, they -have- to go solo, unless all their friends are snipers/Rocket guys. so they have to go solo or risk getting their minions shot by mistake if they rush up infront of the burst line.

You say it's wrong that a level 1 can be "OP" with mercs? well, look at sneaks, and thieves, and every other character that will than need 300 skill, this will only lead to alts, and if mercs can kill you, even plasma mercs, than you're screwing up badly/Not ready for combat. and you would be destroyed by a normal PvP team anyway.

You say big gangs exploit them? well, in order to use mercs to full effect, you must have a special team setup, like S8 does, the mercs -must- be set to kill everyone but faction members on sight, and you must have all your team members added to the main faction base. which alot of multi-faction alliance gangs cant do, since they're a mix, like the JDC was.

You say you want merc leaders to have to sacrifice something? well the real "leaders" of man and minion will just suffer, you'll still get surprise butt sex. but this time from as many mercs as a 300 speech proxy alt can hold.

-Ulrek-

[Solar]

Mercenary leaders are not balanced to much power for one character. This game has serious game balance issues.(for example a smg is better than a minigun)

Incorrect.

I just have one question. Why ?

Because it will work in another way.

[JovankaB]

The only problem with mercs is "attack all except me and my friends" setting. It should work in bases/tents only. Well, and a fact that you can have the same number of dogs and supermutants.

Anyone who says NPC followers don't do mistakes, clearly didn't play any merc leader (maybe except some lame gang alt that never did anything else than entering grid with mutants set to auto-attack everyone).

[Vaimortal]

Mercs and slavers already have problems. such as the crappy AI.

You say mercs and slaves don't get confused? what happens if you hit a friendly militia by mistake in TC? your mercs are fighting the militia and the enemy and your friends all at once, rockets and laser blasts everywhere.

You say they're OP? well they cant function in a large group of players, they -have- to go solo, unless all their friends are snipers/Rocket guys. so they have to go solo or risk getting their minions shot by mistake if they rush up infront of the burst line.

You say it's wrong that a level 1 can be "OP" with mercs? well, look at sneaks, and thieves, and every other character that will than need 300 skill, this will only lead to alts, and if mercs can kill you, even plasma mercs, than you're screwing up badly/Not ready for combat. and you would be destroyed by a normal PvP team anyway.

You say big gangs exploit them? well, in order to use mercs to full effect, you must have a special team setup, like S8 does, the mercs -must- be set to kill everyone but faction members on sight, and you must have all your team members added to the main faction base. which alot of multi-faction alliance gangs cant do, since they're a mix, like the JDC was.

You say you want merc leaders to have to sacrifice something? well the real "leaders" of man and minion will just suffer, you'll still get surprise butt sex. but this time from as many mercs as a 300 speech proxy alt can hold.

-Ulrek-

Yes they don't get confused , i did not say they are perfect. Miniguns and rocketluanchers are not fit for large player groups yet still people use them in TC and in large groups.Why the fu*k i have read this forum countless time that many people have leader mercs as an alt for TC ? Do you think i have imagined that ?

Well yeah every build has it weaknesses but in this situation you can avoid large player groups , or specialize a group of players with with rocket luanchers and snipers you said it yourself and then it becomes a bit unfair. The 300 Skill would make them have less mercs at a time making them more useful in larger groups and less poweful being solo or in a " specialized " group or in traps. Sounds like balance to me.

" You say they're OP? well they cant function in a large group of players, they -have- to go solo, unless all their friends are snipers/Rocket guys."

So they mostly are OP , you are in denial with yourself. Few situations where they only might be useless. You can always gather friends with rocketluanchers and snipers but you won't always encounter guys with rocketluanchers and miniguns.

Oh yeah i would like to know how do you OUTSMART 5 plasma shots/Rocket shots/sniper shots/laser rifle shots ?

[Ulrek]

As for how you outsmart 5 plasma/laser mercs, shoot them with a rocket or two, and have a friend burst twice with an LSW, problem solved.

For rocket launchers, some one is pretty much going to have to take one for the team... once that happens, hit them with a rocket or three, than burst with an LSW as before, or spawn in a cheap slave squad behind, than step out while the snipers cover you.

This has been explained a number of times, FOnline currently is like rock/paper/scissors. Mercs beat snipers, snipers beat big gunners, and big gunners beat mercs.

As for people using mercs in TC, the way people use mercs, are for ambushs, i blew the crap out of a little level 7 merc leader with a rocket the last time i got ambushed by mercs in a TC fight, he was a alt, and probably a proxy, if you allow people to have 6-8 mercs with 300 speech, guess what, people will make those ambush alts and give them even more mercs, and they'll still show up with surprise butt sex just for you, but this time with more rocket mercs or plasma mercs.

As for using a group of people with rockets and sniper rifles to use mercs fully, that's not the best idea, those snipers won't last if they have to close in, sooner or later someone camps, and a sniper cant rush a building and hope to survive for as long as a BGer could, which is why you have the bursters up front, to handle mercs and militia, and rush with, for when you're pushing for ground.

Oh, and i've created a build to show you, that it'll just delay the merc leaders, you can still make a useless character for merc handling, it'll just take alot longer, but still do able, if you level off ODM.

http://www.nitue.net/fcp/

It should be "Post Wipe Leader". have a look.

-Ulrek-

[snailbeast]

you are always speaking about killing ONE merc leader by a GROUP of players... It sounds kinda lame. And you losing one player about almost every time as a bait.

[Solar]

Talking about a post wipe merc leader is a pretty futile activity, given that nobody knows what the system will be in the end