Author Topic: Character Animations  (Read 145477 times)

Offline Johnnybravo

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Re: Character Animations
« Reply #375 on: June 03, 2012, 01:56:30 pm »
BTW:
Was there any progress on the timing of those animations? I know it's been here already, talked about.
It's pretty much the only real flaw now - seeing how you melt before the bolt of plasma hits you :d.
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Offline Karpov

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Re: Character Animations
« Reply #376 on: June 04, 2012, 01:30:29 am »
Poor NPCs :(

Am I right in thinking that any armour on the model would add another level of complexity to this, i.e. you would also have to switch the armour to a "choppable" version and so on?

I think we're definitely getting to the stage where a coder is going to be pretty essential to finish this stuff off - I think the animations are looking great, but sooner or later, those NPCs are going to need to die once, and with blood and gore :)

I think it's not so hard. I found the right command, but I just can't use it inside the script. Somehow it works in a different script, so I tell the game to run that one instead. The problem with this is that the external script is not related to the main script where the animations happen, so pointing to the right critter is impossible from there, so I use the player. I'm sure someone will know how to fix it once I upload the files.

BTW:
Was there any progress on the timing of those animations? I know it's been here already, talked about.
It's pretty much the only real flaw now - seeing how you melt before the bolt of plasma hits you :d.

Well, that's not a flaw with 3D models. In the original game there was no trouble, it seemed to make everything stop when a weapon was shot, the critter didn't even put the gun down until the animation had finished. In real time that is not possible.
 I can't delay the animation because you never know how far the attacker is, and how much is it going to take until the bolt hits you. Besides, laser and plasma effects are merely graphical. If the shot was actually that slow, then you could even dodge it when you see it coming.  Last but not least, even if you could correct that, the normal response times from the server, even the lowest ping, would make it look the same  ;D.

Re: Character Animations
« Reply #377 on: July 21, 2012, 03:39:09 pm »
  But sometimes it is hard to create one from scratch, so motion capture would be a good idea too.
Hey.
I use 3dmodels of Vanburen in my own game-project.
Now, I explore the possibility to create additional animations that were not in the files of Vanburen (such as emotions, gestures, interaction with objects: carrying heavy objects, opening doors, pressing buttons etc.)
I use the Xtion depth sensor and a special program to create animations of the human body.
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=prueM6BlY24" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=prueM6BlY24</a>
Despite some technical limitations, you can get very nice results in a very short period of time.
Maybe I could do some animation for your project?
If you are interested please contact me.
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Offline Haraldx

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Re: Character Animations
« Reply #378 on: July 21, 2012, 03:59:12 pm »
More muscle is always appreciated! ;)

The only problem I see is that you are using a kind of a motion capture which tends to get realistic motion, which isn't really the case with Fallout sprites. However, I cannot speak for all, feel free to give something a shot, after all, nothing bad can happen.
I still can be reached over e-mail if you somehow need anything from me. Don't see a reason why you would, but if you do, e-mail remains the safest bet, as I do not visit this forum reliably anymore.

Re: Character Animations
« Reply #379 on: July 21, 2012, 06:33:37 pm »
If you are interested please contact me.

I'm helluva interested in what you're doing, because this way you can create A TON of human animations, if not EVERYTHING in short amount of time! Screw falloutishness for now. We need done animation sets or this will take forever! The animations can be adjusted later.

Go for it, xammurapi, imagine how many animations you can do during one evening and what a workout it will be! :D

Skill-based weapon animations, unarmed moves, crates carrying, shit showeling, pushing people away, injecting drugs, drinking beer, limping, nursing wounded arm, taking damage to limbs, repairing and crafting stuff... Just some suggestions for new animations.:)
« Last Edit: July 21, 2012, 06:59:38 pm by Horatio »

Re: Character Animations
« Reply #380 on: July 21, 2012, 09:26:27 pm »
Skill-based weapon animations, unarmed moves, crates carrying, shit showeling, pushing people away, injecting drugs, drinking beer, limping, nursing wounded arm, taking damage to limbs, repairing and crafting stuff...
Yes, I also imagined WEALTH, similar to that described.

But we must realize that still, after the capture and digitization of the final animation will require treatment.

To get started, I need the following:

1) The decision of the project coordinator of the need to create animations of this kind.

2) Approval of technical aspects. IPISoft Studio can export animation in several formats: bhv(bip), fbx, smd, dae, and we need to decide in advance about your specific format. Animations can be saved for 3ds max biped or motion builder or iclone, or it will be the animation of bones (with a pre-import target model and configuration dependencies between the bones and animations). Also, consider the following points (technical limitations):
   a) The program does not record the movement of the head (not a problem, because in the modern game's head is usually animated procedurally, "tracking" objects of interest)
   b) the program does not record the movement of fingers (not a problem, because usually the hands clenched, or something like that)
   c) Now I have only one sensor depth and complexity of the animation in some way limited: for example, if the leg will be obscured at any time by scanning another part of the body, the position of the legs can not be recognized correctly.

3) Scenario animations. A text or graphic (in the form of sketches or diagrams) a description of movements, which should be digitized.
For example it should be a text in the form of:
sequence 1: unarmed idle - pick up item - unarmed idle - crates carrying - unarmed idle - injecting drugs ....
sequence 2: one-hand armed idle - shooting - one-hand armed idle - burst - one-hand armed idle - weapon maintenance - one-hand armed idle - nursing wounded arm ...
sequence 3: two-hand armed idle - sweep - two-hand armed idle - guns fell out of the hands - two-hand armed idle - reload weapon - two-hand armed idle - stunning
And all of the above examples in all possible combinations.
And each sequence must be described in the style in which the director explains the actor, that he should do.
Until it is all.
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Re: Character Animations
« Reply #381 on: July 22, 2012, 01:44:09 pm »
1) The decision of the project coordinator of the need to create animations of this kind.

I don't know who is authorized as a project coordinator/leader. We have here several mods, but LutherBlissett is the most active recently. Karpov have done male/female animations, haven't updated his progress, though, he seem to work on death animations right now. Noone hears anything from him recently. I'd ask Mr. Blissett.

2) Approval of technical aspects. IPISoft Studio can export animation in several formats: bhv(bip), fbx, smd, dae, and we need to decide in advance about your specific format. Animations can be saved for 3ds max biped or motion builder or iclone, or it will be the animation of bones (with a pre-import target model and configuration dependencies between the bones and animations). Also, consider the following points (technical limitations):
   a) The program does not record the movement of the head (not a problem, because in the modern game's head is usually animated procedurally, "tracking" objects of interest)
   b) the program does not record the movement of fingers (not a problem, because usually the hands clenched, or something like that)
   c) Now I have only one sensor depth and complexity of the animation in some way limited: for example, if the leg will be obscured at any time by scanning another part of the body, the position of the legs can not be recognized correctly.

BVH or FBX seems fine to me as Blender user, i only need to weigh the bones in rest position (cross position) and edit the animation. We don't have fingers, too, we have mittens. As for leg positions, i could iron the glitches out, same with head.

3) Scenario animations. A text or graphic (in the form of sketches or diagrams) a description of movements, which should be digitized.
For example it should be a text in the form of:
sequence 1: unarmed idle - pick up item - unarmed idle - crates carrying - unarmed idle - injecting drugs ....
sequence 2: one-hand armed idle - shooting - one-hand armed idle - burst - one-hand armed idle - weapon maintenance - one-hand armed idle - nursing wounded arm ...
sequence 3: two-hand armed idle - sweep - two-hand armed idle - guns fell out of the hands - two-hand armed idle - reload weapon - two-hand armed idle - stunning
And all of the above examples in all possible combinations.
And each sequence must be described in the style in which the director explains the actor, that he should do.
Until it is all.

In this case we should know what's available, throw some ideas in, make ten basic, most necessary animations without guns as a pilot and adjust later positions for guns. You'll probably need some simple placeholder for items in your hands and then we can work on the animations. I could provide the animation list, unless someone else wants to be the director.

Re: Character Animations
« Reply #382 on: July 24, 2012, 10:38:02 pm »
And here I am.
I was hoping that stored in the repository model is suitable for the job. However, they are optimized to work in the game. I had to find a converter X-> FBX and work with the obtained models. With regard to generally accepted standards, they are rotated around a vertical axis through 180 degrees, have a lot of extra bone and have the incorrect naming of the parties (the right elements are labeled as left or vice versa) I do not know, this is a bug or error converting the original model? No idea whether the animation is now compatible with the models used.
Next.
as an actor (except for the animation of a tough guy), I used my 14-year-old nephew. It turns out that body composition has a significant impact on the mocap, despite its markerless. The next time I'll keep that in mind.
Next.
For the record mocap definitely need to work in the studio / room as the sun creates too much noise.
Next.
Without a list of required moves is impossible to work =)
Next.
Only one depth sensor is not enough for the job. I'll try to get another one.

I am open to access some of the mocap, which I digitized in the format "fbx" with a link to a modified model of man, which I downloaded from the repository. In the animation there is a certain amount of debris, but from what I understand, nothing irreparable. In addition, the program has options trajectory smoothing and removal of garbage, but I do not understand how they work =)
Waiting for reviews.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/dedy2lxirgoqys1/fjjOpxaWrk?m
« Last Edit: August 01, 2012, 09:58:38 pm by xammurapi »
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Offline Haraldx

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Re: Character Animations
« Reply #383 on: July 25, 2012, 04:33:01 pm »
Hmm... Let me take a look into the bones and their naming. It seems that the Left and Right names are shown correctly only if viewed "head on" (Facing towards the human's face). I can't tell how intentional is it as I'm not the one who made the human skeleton/model. It has been some time since I last did something useful towards the 3D project and my memories are just about outdated already, so can't really help you much tho.
I still can be reached over e-mail if you somehow need anything from me. Don't see a reason why you would, but if you do, e-mail remains the safest bet, as I do not visit this forum reliably anymore.

Re: Character Animations
« Reply #384 on: July 25, 2012, 07:14:17 pm »
Hmm... Let me take a look into the bones and their naming. It seems that the Left and Right names are shown correctly only if viewed "head on" (Facing towards the human's face). I can't tell how intentional is it as I'm not the one who made the human skeleton/model. It has been some time since I last did something useful towards the 3D project and my memories are just about outdated already, so can't really help you much tho.
http://svn3.xp-dev.com/svn/FOnline3d/trunk/data/art/critters/CR_HumanMaleStrong.X
I took this model from the repository and convert it.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/1f3ryep5dqczwf5/CR_HumanMaleStrong.fbx
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Re: Character Animations
« Reply #385 on: July 28, 2012, 03:13:26 pm »
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqeIOrqJA-M" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqeIOrqJA-M</a>
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tTfuUYjAumI" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tTfuUYjAumI</a>
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WadywtHQDjs" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WadywtHQDjs</a>
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6j7enJsUMYo" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6j7enJsUMYo</a>
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RrFSVB-G9J8" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RrFSVB-G9J8</a>
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2YGuxgVD8U" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2YGuxgVD8U</a>
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezX7aB0XSCg" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezX7aB0XSCg</a>
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kREijs_UVMI" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kREijs_UVMI</a>
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PXizyoyVN6k" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PXizyoyVN6k</a>
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Offline Luther Blissett

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Re: Character Animations
« Reply #386 on: July 28, 2012, 07:28:08 pm »
A lot to look at! :)

I'll look in chronological order...

Firstly, in my opinion, yes please! More animators are definitely needed. For the style elements, it's certainly true that the Fallout animations are heavily stylised (especially the "run" one), but I would consider any animation to be better than none at all, especially if they can be produced simply and quickly - and as Horatio said, these can be adjusted later.

It's notable for example that the Van Buren ones "breathed" or "swayed" a little, compared to the completely static poses of the Fallout ones. However, the process of applying this simplicity and style to an existing animation is likely much easier than creating these from scratch. I'd assume these animations are keyframed throughout, but we can likely adapt these stylistically by importing the standard idle pose as the start and finish point, then picking 3 or 4 keyframes from the animation and deleting all other keyframes and letting it tween between those points, making it far less fluid and realistic. Once down to a smaller number of keyframes, they can be tweaked into a more Fallout-like exaggerated position (see the punch or run animations for good examples of exaggerated action).

The currently possible "animation slots" are in \Client\data\art\critters\_FOHuman.fo3d - you can run additional animations with a debug code, but otherwise they do need linking up in the main scripts. This is entirely possible, but I don't know how to do it personally. It should be fairly easy to understand for anyone with the slightest bit of scripting experience. It was previously suggested that we should add a lot of "flavour animations" for drinking, smoking, using things etc - predominantly replacements for the "milking an invisible cow" use animation - specifically those for doctor/first aid/failed steal (successful steal probably being invisible).

Regarding project coordination, I'd probably consider Karpov/Graf/Grey as the main coordinators of the 3D stuff, though the 2238 Devs themselves would be responsible for what was to be used in 2238 - though I do have a reasonable involvement in the 3D stuff I think. In the absence of a reply from any of those, I would personally say "yes, go for it". I can't see any reason why this work would cause any problem, and am fairly confident that they would also see the benefits of this - as mentioned before, things can be tweaked and refined in future.

Technically, Karpov's animation was based on a Max biped - I think I may have a source file for this if it's useful to you. Otherwise, the current skeleton is mapped out in one of the 3D tutorials, if you want to look at bone names etc. As said, it's mittens for hands and a single head bone, which I think is perfectly sufficient when you consider the in-game size of the models. For file formats, I've personally used .x through Fragmotion (it can import the native .x files seamlessly) - but pick whatever seems most cross-compatible - especially with Blender, as we've got a few good animators using this. The model orientation is flipped L-R when editing, but is then flipped or rotated in the game engine it seems - whatever you export must match this. The model may appear "face down" in some programs, due to the difference in Y/Z axis for up that some formats or programs use. Any "no_name" bones which appear can be safely deleted. You should have everything linked to the main skeleton, and an additional two hand bones, again there's a diagram in the tutorial section which should help.

[edit]
Looking through the little videos you've put up, it's all looking good. The bits that would need tweaking for "Falloutness" are likely the movement of hips, rotation of torso etc. If these animations had existed in the Fallout world, they'd likely have a completely static body, with just the movement of the arms. I'm pretty confident that it's doable, simply by positioning the body to the normal "idle pose", then using some of the keyframes from the arm movements, but deleting all the lower body movements. I'm almost certain I could do this with Fragmotion myself, but I'm a little short of time right now. I'll try and have a go at a couple quite soon, and see if it's as easy as I think it will be :)
« Last Edit: July 28, 2012, 07:37:53 pm by Luther Blissett »

Re: Character Animations
« Reply #387 on: August 01, 2012, 08:29:49 am »
Xammurapi these animations are looking good. Especially since motion capture animations are easy to tweak and edit. A bit less of a work then creating an animation. I'm sure they will be useful.


Re: Character Animations
« Reply #388 on: August 03, 2012, 08:57:16 pm »
It would be nice to see a list of desired animation: text or video or links to animated models.
To create the current animation, so I did: downloaded the wow client and wow_model_viewer. In it, I looked at some of the characters and lists of animations that they use. I did own list, and then tried to reproduce what I saw (with amendments). This is a very good help.

I do not quite understand your reasoning about style. In the video test using 3D models in the game engine http://youtu.be/wpzC0lctAGE, everything looks great in my opinion.

My knowledge of 3D modeling are insufficient to handle the animation in the editor, but see the biped would be interested. Which modifier is used to snap the character?

In general, I am most interested in creating animations for the super mutant. Frankly, by coincidence, that I think about it for 15 years, starting with a Fallout1, when I saw the in-game-movie http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PfyqlMBeQFU&feature=player_detailpage#t=60s Maybe it's a bit strange, but many times I imagined that it was me - super mutant, new warrior of the Master's army, who before diving into a vat of the virus was VaultDweller. And I imagined how I go through the corridors of the Vault13, shooting yesterday genetic cousins ​​...
It would be nice to implement impersonation in the actual animation, I'm glad that I now have the opportunity.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2012, 12:34:48 am by xammurapi »
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Offline Haraldx

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Re: Character Animations
« Reply #389 on: August 03, 2012, 11:50:06 pm »
I do not quite understand your reasoning about style. In the video test using 3D models in the game engine http://youtu.be/wpzC0lctAGE, everything looks great in my opinion.
Those are Van Buren animations. What we are aiming for are almost (if not exactly) perfect copies of Fallout 1/2 sprite animations. The main problem is that the original Fallout animations aren't very realistic (take a look at the running cycle, it's ridiculous how at one point the legs make an almost perfect 180 degree angle) and rather choppy. Van Buren animations (which I actually have a feeling were motion capped too) are the exact opposite, but hey, I'm getting side tracked a bit here.


In general, I am most interested in creating animations for the super mutant. Frankly, by coincidence, that I think about it for 15 years, starting with a Fallout1, when I saw the in-game-movie http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PfyqlMBeQFU&feature=player_detailpage#t=60s Maybe it's a bit strange, but many times I imagined that it was me - super mutant, new warrior of the Master's army, who before diving into a vat of the virus was VaultDweller. And I imagined how I go through the corridors of the Vault13, shooting yesterday genetic cousins ​​...
It would be nice to implement impersonation in the actual animation, I'm glad that I now have the opportunity.
Sounds nice. As far as I know, we need the whole set for muttie animations (that is - everything).
I do not know if this is the whole list of animations a character uses, but hey:
All the question marks show animations that I don't know if are really needed/going to be used.
I have a feeling I forgot some animations tho, not even talking about the optional ones we might need for more random diversity. May the light be with animators...
« Last Edit: August 03, 2012, 11:53:19 pm by Haraldx »
I still can be reached over e-mail if you somehow need anything from me. Don't see a reason why you would, but if you do, e-mail remains the safest bet, as I do not visit this forum reliably anymore.